<p>Grinnell is an excellent school that happens to be in Iowa. Most kids and faculty are from places other than Iowa. You could have just as good an educational experience there without having to deal with some of the east coast attitudes common at many of the top eastern schools. Same goes for Carleton. The most outstanding Fellow at my wife's surgery office was a Carleton grad. They absolutely loved here easy going nature and strong but relaxed work ethic. They begged her to join as a full partner but she wanted to return to the Midwest. This year they had a guy from the east with a full Ivy background. They are looking forward to the day he leaves.</p>
<p>OP: I don't know what your financial status/need is... but your son might benefit by looking into quality programs such as Emory Scholars where he may be eligible for a full ride. Keep in mind that most scholarship programs have early application deadlines - generally December 1 though they may vary.</p>
<p>A little more information:</p>
<p>Financial Aid will be necessary, but we will probably not qualify for much need based. Even though I have another child in college, we do not have to give her much financially. She was much easier in many ways. Goes to South Dakota State University and it very happy there. Her stats were not as good as my sons, but she has lots of other things going for her - outgoing, involved, strong leader, knew what she was looking for.</p>
<p>HS Courses for S
Algebra and freshman English in 8th grade</p>
<p>9th
World Lit
Biology
Geography
Geometry
Spanish I
Band
Chorus</p>
<p>10th
American Lit
Chemistry
Algebra II
World History
Health
Speech
Economics
Band
Chorus
Spanish at Comm. College</p>
<p>11th
Brit Lit
US History
Human Bio
Physics
Government
Pre-Calc/Trig
Computer Literacy
Spanish III online/correspondence (not completed yet)
Band
Chorus</p>
<p>Expected 12th</p>
<p>Calculus
Chem II
Adv English (not sure at this time if it will actually be offered - in the works)
Sociology
Psychology
Band
Chorus
And of course the obligatory PE each year.</p>
<p>HS is on a trimester and an A-B Block schedule so some of the courses are only for one or two trimesters. </p>
<p>He was accepted to the University of Iowa National Academy of Arts, Sciences, and Engeneering program next year, but we declined. Mostly due to the poor offer of aid. It is a program for a select (12-15) group of students to enter the Univ. after their jr. year in hs. </p>
<p>Also might mention he is reserved, and thinks very literally. Not a lot of common sense, a bit on the lazy side, but loves learning. He is probably weakest in Math. I am a bit concerned that he has no real study habits and when hit with the challenges of college will be lacking some of the skills he will need to cope.</p>
<p>Also, he does not really care to go where the weather is nicer and I am wishing that he would stay within a days drive of home but will not make that a hard and fast requirement.</p>
<p>Everyone's comments and suggestions have been very helpful. We bought the Fiske's book today and have been looking into some of the colleges that have been suggested. Thanks. It is amazing how much there is to know about this whole process. It is nice and good to try to make the best decision possible, but I also know that it is not the be-all end-all of our existence.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Financial Aid will be necessary, but we will probably not qualify for much need based.
[/quote]
This is a critical piece of information.</p>
<p>The Ivies, for example, don't give merit aid. This is true of a number of other "most selective" schools.</p>
<p>I suggest the following:[ul][<em>]Calculate your family's EFC using one of the on-line calculators. With 2 (or 3) kids in school, it's possible you might qualify for more need-based aid than you think. Check it out if you haven't already.[</em>]Check each of the schools of interest to see what merit aid they offer. If they don't offer merit $, or your Ss wouldn't qualify, that school won't work for you.[li]Check the "Schools Known for Good Merit Aid" thread. There are ideas there for specific schools; for quality vs. non-quality merit aid, for schools where merit aid is "automatic" based on stats, etc.[/ul]</p>[/li]
<p>If financial aid is important and need-based aid won't be forthcoming at all or in sufficient amounts, this is the way you have to go. Curmudgeon's D built her search completely around finding schools that fit <em>and</em> had the potential for great merit aid. You can search for his threads and learn a lot.</p>
<p>OK, great info - first priority for parents is finances. Several colleges, in cluding Dartmouth and ?Princeton, ?Cornell, have calculators on their websites that allow you to plug in data from last year's tax return and get an idea of what your EFC from that college is - my understanding is that colleges that use Profile will have different EFCs than just the federal methodology. If the figure takes your breath away, and is undoable for your family, then the Ivy search is probably over. Each college will give you a slightly different EFC, and some will be more generous than others in how they structure the mixture of loans and grants, but if you simply cannot begin to afford the EFC of one Ivy League school, you probably won't be able to afford any of them. All this "stuff" is discussed in detail on many FA threads, try searching for them.
Curmudgeon's daughter was in this position last year - needed merit aid. She applied, and was accepted to Yale and a need-based LAC, Amherst, I think, but ended up taking a full merit scholarship at Rhodes College. Their experiences with the process and with merit aid are very instructive - they played the merit game very well. Curmudge illustrates the fact that if the EFC is way too high, you don't have to completely prohibit your child from applying to expensive need-based schools, you just have to level with them up front about the money, and what is necessary for them to go to a private college. The money is out there, and many good colleges are out there, you just have to match them up.</p>
<p>THere are sad cases every spring where kids have applied, been accepted, THEN the parents look at money and realize there are no merit scholarships to Ivy League schools, essentially none at Duke or Stanford either - have to look at money first.</p>
<p>Jmmom, great minds think alike! That "we won't get need based aid" was like waving the red flag at the bullfight - boy, I miss Curmudge, he would have a great folksy metaphor!</p>
<p>"Also might mention he is reserved, and thinks very literally. Not a lot of common sense, a bit on the lazy side, but loves learning. He is probably weakest in Math. I am a bit concerned that he has no real study habits and when hit with the challenges of college will be lacking some of the skills he will need to cope."</p>
<p>He honestly sounds like a wonderful young man whom lots of colleges would love to have. However, the fact that he's "a bit on the lazy side" indicates to me that the Ivies would not be a good fit. The fact that costs are a concern, but you wouldn't qualify for much need-based aid, are another reason why Ivies and most top LACs also would not be a good fit: They don't provide merit aid. Even if he can get merit aid from Grinnell, it doesn't sound like a good fit as I've heard that the students have to academically work very hard. </p>
<p>My suggestion is to take a close look at the honors programs of state universities like U Mich., and U Wisconsin, all of which are wonderful first tier colleges where he'd have excellent chances of admission and also may qualify for merit aid.</p>
<p>Many second tier colleges also may be willing to not only accept him, but also give him very generous merit aid. If he's "a bit on the lazy side," he also may appreciate the fact that the work may end up being relatively easy for him, leaving plenty of time for ECs.</p>
<p>I also suggest that you think hard about the distance you're willing to have him go away to college. Transportation costs add up, and will probably get worse and worse because of gas prices. In addition, getting students to and fro a college that's far away can eat up lots of parents' money and vacation time.</p>
<p>I went a 2. 5 drive away to college. It was in a different state, and I definitely experienced a different region and culture than in my home town and state. My husband went to college about 4 hours from his hometown, and also found it broadening. Just emphasizing, here, that one needn't go a day's drive away in order to have a broadening experience. Just going to a different part of one's state can be very broadening.</p>
<p>Just a note - honors colleges at big Publics may not be any easier than ivies. There is more of a "weed-out" mentality -whereas the ivies and private U's tend to support / encourage their students to pass and suceed at their classes. Also, boys are often late to bloom. Excite his interest in something and surround him by motivated peers, and he may blossom into a more focused and driven scholar. JMHO.</p>
<p>A couple of thoughts:</p>
<p>Financial considerations will be key to the college selection process. As others have said, Ivies and many other top schools do not give need-based aid, so he should seek out those that give merit aid. he certainly can still apply to top schools but be aware of the financial implications of attending.</p>
<p>He should apply rolling admissions to some top state unis such as Michigan or Wisconsin; they may be willing to fork out some money to attract a desirable candidate. </p>
<p>As for the "lazy" bit, it may be a development stage of it may be that he is not sufficiently challenged by his curriculum. I strongly suspect the second explanation. Unless he has developed bad study habits, there's nothing that a challenging curriculum at a top tier college won't cure. So I would not worry about not being able to keep up with fellow students.</p>
<p>Thanks, marite. I do think he would rise to the occasion of more challenging work. And I am probably not around enough teenagers to know that his laziness is just normal. He has just never wanted to do much that involved real physical work.</p>
<p>We have had the finances talk and I thought that some of the choices (Wash U, Grinnell, and U of Chicago) gave good merit aid. I am not opposed to investing a couple hundered $ for app fees to see what will happen. My main concern is that he ends up somewhere that is right for him and since at this time he doesn't seem to have a handle on what that is, I am not sure how to proceed. He has participated in camps and other programs at various campuses (Creighton, Grinnell, Iowa State, Univ. of Iowa) and has not come away with any strong feelings about any of them one way or the other.</p>
<p>Again, I suspect that his high school curriculum has not been inspiring enough to give him a sense of what he would truly like to study, but most college students arrive on campus undecided about what to study. The high school curriculum is far more limited than the range of discipline available at colleges. This is why students are not required to declare a major until sophomore year. I would not worry about it. </p>
<p>He should, however, seek out a liberal arts college that will give him the flexibility to explore different possible majors rather than a more techie one. Wash U, Grinnell and Chicago are all excellent choices as are Carleton, Macalester, and some other Midwestern LACs and unis. Going to camp is not a really good way to learn about college life since you are surrounded by other middle or high schoolers. </p>
<p>Since he seems to be keen on the theater, I suggest he write his college essay about his activities in this field and look into colleges where he could continue to pursue his interest as an EC.</p>
<p>FWIW, if he really is considering Nebraska - Lincoln (UNOmaha is not any where the same level by the by), then I can almost guarantee that he would receive a Beadle Scholarship which will pay the difference between in-state and out-of-state tuition (so you pay in-state). He also would be an excellent candidate for the Honors Program (pretty sure it's the largest honors program in the Big XII) which provides a book scholarship. Further if he is going to be Nat. Merit, then he gets full tuition and a $2000 stipend.</p>
<p>He also might have a good chance to earn a spot in the Chancellor's Leadership Class, considering some of his leadership activities.</p>
<p>I had a great 4 years at UNL, and can assure you that he would find many students in the Honors Program who are from a very similar HS situation as your son. </p>
<p>Just something to consider.</p>
<p>What about UNO for bioinformatics?</p>
<p>bigremed, </p>
<p>Are you implying there aren't a lot of big city kids from Kansas? Interesting...</p>
<p>No, that's not what I was implying at all. It's going to depend on what your idea of a "big city" is, the KC metro area is nearly 2 million people, Wichita is 354k and Topeka is 225k people. But Kansas' population is nearly 2.75 million people, while Nebraska's is 1.76 million. Omaha is only about 800,000 people, and Lincoln is about 240,000 and Memorial Stadium becomes the third largest city in the State on football Saturdays. I'm just saying that compared to many of the other schools listed, the Nebraska Honors program is going to have the most students who are from small towns but are also academically talented.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I am not opposed to investing a couple hundered $ for app fees to see what will happen.
[/quote]
I would be careful, though of your S setting himself up psychologically for a major letdown. By this I mean applying and being accepted to a school which simply does not offer the type of financial aid he needs.</p>
<p>The "sad cases" every spring which cangel refers to are just that - kids thrilled to get into Ivy/other prestigious school, only to realize after the thrill of acceptance that they are facing the agony of unrealistic plans.</p>
<p>If a school will not be financially feasible, don't apply there. It's just way too tough psychologically. Kids should only be excited about the possibility of attending schools within their financial reach.</p>
<p>bigred,</p>
<p>Interesting regarding Kansas. It is so easy for us on the east coast to think a small town is one that only has 50,000 people and is at least 30 miles from the nearest large town. Or that a small town is any that has just a few stop lights and some farms nearby. </p>
<p>Kansas, and especially Nebraska, puts a whole new light on this.</p>
<p>FWIW, my D's first year roommate came from a small town in SW Kansas, small enough that the nearest "restaurant" was McDonalds 20 miles away. That gave me a whole new meaning of "small".</p>
<p>I thought I would bring this up to date if anyone was interested and as we wait impatiently for acceptance and financial aid info.</p>
<p>S has been accepted to:</p>
<p>U of AZ
AZ State
Iowa State
U. of Ne - Lincoln
Purdue
Drake
Grinnell
University of Chicago (EA)</p>
<p>waitlisted at:
Wash U</p>
<p>waiting on:
Northwestern
Princeton
Harvard </p>
<p>He is a National Merit Finalist so will get whatever scholarships come with that. Has been interviewed for a top scholarship at Grinnell and we are awaiting the news there. I have done te financial aid estimators and if they are close, even the schools without merit aid are a possibility with some debt.</p>
<p>The best offer so far is from Iowa State with full tuition, room and board, but he absolutely does not want to go there. His top choices at this time are the University of Chicago, Princeton and Grinnell. I guess we now are just going to have to wait and see.</p>
<p>Thanks for all your previous help!</p>
<p>iowa, congrats on raising such a bright child!</p>
<p>waitlisted at Washu--what a shocker. ;-)</p>