smart, quirky, final college list?

College Search & Selection
1

<p>Hi:</p>

<p>My son really enjoyed an overnight at Olin School of Engineering. It seemed to be a good personality fit with him. He was up until 2 a.m. baking bread with a bunch of students, doing problem sets, playing games, and surfing funny youtube videos. He had so much fun actually, that he fell asleep in the class he was observing in the next day (Yikes, I hope he gave a different name to the professor).</p>

<p>Anyway, here is his list to apply to schools. He wants to major in mechanical engineering or physics/math, and play (hopefully) at a high level in a band or orchestra. His stats are a 3.9 unweighted gpa, ranked around 7% (although school doesn't rank). His SATs are 730 critical reading, 760 math, 720 writing, SAT II math II 800, SAT II Physics 780. APs are all 5s and include physics, calculus, english, etc. He has taken two Smith College courses (discrete math and engineering 100) His extracurriculars are mainly band things, quizbowl, and editor of a carnivorous plant newsletter. No major hooks.</p>

<p>His list (in no particular order):</p>

<p>Rice
Olin
University of Rochester
Lawrence University
Case Western University
Williams College (legacy)
Grinnell
Umass/Amherst (not sure he "loves" his safety but hasn't toured...live near)
Allegheny</p>

<p>Our EFC is rather high so hoping for some merit aid. Allegheny has offered him a pre-offer of the trustee scholarship of around 18k.</p>

<p>Just looking for any advice on whether this list has the sort of personality feel as Olin and, if possible, if anyone has another safety closer to our home in Northampton they could recommend, that would be helpful. </p>

<p>He has been very careful about creating this list with the help of this board. Thanks to all.
I will add he keeps mentioning Yale to add to the list which he might but without a major hook I think it will probably be a waste of his time. :( Ditto for MIT.</p>

<p>Any advice appreciated.</p>

2

<p>One that jumps out as a bit of an outlier, to me, is Williams. I understand that it’s a legacy choice, and it is close to home. And of course it’s an excellent school. However, I would think Harvey Mudd is closer to what he seems to want (if only it weren’t so far away).
Or Swarthmore (which is closer, and offers engineering as well as the benefits of a consortium college.)</p>

<p>Trinity (Hartford) is a little more selective than Allegheny, and is not exactly quirky, but it does have its own engineering program and is closer to home.</p>

<p>Less selective, and possibly qualifying as a financial “merit” safety, is Clarkson University (Potsdam, NY). It’s small, close, offers engineering and merit scholarships. I’ve heard negatives (ugly campus etc.) but your son might prefer it to UMass especially if the out-of-pocket costs were in line.</p>

<p>Overall, though, that looks like a well-selected list.</p>

3

<p>You should be aware that most LACs, such as Grinnell, Lawrence, and Williams, don’t offer a major in mechanical engineering. All three, though, would be excellent for math/physics.</p>

<p>Swarthmore and Harvey Mudd sound like good fits, and they both offer engineering.</p>

<p>Should also look at Carleton - smart, quirky students, excellent math and physics.</p>

<p>Good luck!</p>

4

<p>I was just going to say the same thing. If he wants engineering, as you know, Williams won’t offer that. Its a wonderful school, but if he is sure he wants the option of engineering, thenunlesshe wants to do a 3-2 program or drive to Albany for engineering classes, that might not be the best fit. How about WPI? It would probably be a safety?;</p>

5

<p>I’d suggest removing Case. Based on my campus visit and talking to a bunch of students and alums from there, I don’t think there is a happy, quirky, smart vibe at Case like most of the others your S is considering. Lawrence seems like a sure admit and very likely to offer merit aid.</p>

6

<p>My son did look at Swarthmore and sat in on a class there. I thought the campus was stunning and loved it. His feel of the school was that it was cold/snobby. It is so funny how they can make a snap judgment about a campus. His came from holding doors open for a few students and not getting a thank you. They don’t offer merit but it did look fantastic. But, alas, it is off of his list.</p>

<p>Regarding Williams, he met the physics chair and the clarinet instructor and he is torn between physics, or math, or engineering. He went through a short while where he hated the engineering class at smith (which is an overview of all types of engineering) but I think he likes it now. He wants to attend a school that has a well-rounded, liberal arts type curriculum and offerings so WPI and Clarkson or RPI for that matter are not on there. I have mentioned Carleton to him a few times already. I wonder what the band/orchestra scene is there. And, no merit aid. He is a commended scholar, not semi or finalist. </p>

<p>Trinity is in Hartford and, well, he hates Hartford. Very dangerous section of the city as well.</p>

<p>Clarkson is so male dominated but I wonder if they have cross-reg with Potsdam so he could get the music experience. Maybe I will have him take a look at that. Thanks for the rec.</p>

<p>I would be interested in the Case impressions because he originally put Carnegie M. on the list but removed and replaced with Case thinking more merit offer and possibly the same type of students.</p>

<p>Thanks everyone.</p>

7

<p>Forgot to mention that Harvey Mudd would be perfect. But, so so far away from his 6-year-old sister…as are some others on the list. Where IS that Harvey Mudd of the east.</p>

8

<p>If he wants a liberal arts type school, I am confused that he si so excited about Olin. It would not meet that criteria.</p>

<p>If he wants schools with engineering and liberal arts in the NE, how about Tufts or Brown?</p>

9

<p>If he is undecided on engineering or physics he should definitely be someplace where he can switch if he finds he is on the wrong track. That said, deadlines are coming up - he should be on this right quick!</p>

10

<p>Your son is a very strong applicant. His SAT II’s are excellent and really telling. He’s already got a 5 on AP Calculus and AP Physics, I think I’d throw in that MIT application. People like your son do get in there, and I think they value nerdy ECs more than a lot of places because, well, they are nerdier. Cornell is another place where I think he has a real shot. I agree with you that his chances for Yale are slimmer given his ECs. </p>

<p>I like Rochester and Case on the list. I love Rice on the list, actually that could be a great fit. Like others said, if he’s willing to go “away” and he liked Olin it’s hard to see how he wouldn’t just love Harvey Mudd. It is perhaps the best option and I think he’s a great candidate. There is nothing else in the nation quite like it. I think Case is a safety and gives a lot of merit. I can’t speak to the tone of the place. I can’t see them rejecting an applicant with his SAT IIs. Closer to Northampton, I don’t think I see anything safe that has the breadth of the things already on his list. Maybe RPI and WPI. I’m actually not sure how I see he’s going to play music at a high level at Olin. It seems a little narrow and really small. Of course, if he’s wants the ultimate in pain and challenge, there is always Cooper Union in NYC which is free. It’s the hardest application I’ve ever seen and the application itself should give a good idea of what he’d be in for. Its graduates tend to go on to top graduate programs though and have really been brutalized like few other schools can do. It’s a reach for anybody though. </p>

<p>Allegheny doesn’t seem to belong in this group at all. I think that your son is a bit too academically strong to be challenged to his capacity there, and I haven’t heard that it’s the kind of school is that much harder to get out than to get in like Lawrence or Case, but maybe it is and I just don’t know it. </p>

<p>Reed is worth a look for Math/Physics, it’s quite unique, and so is UChicago. </p>

<p>Good luck. It sounds like he’ll have a nice diverse set of options to choose from.</p>

11

<p>I agree I’d throw in an app at MIT, it’s a reach but in the realm of possibility. Yale not so much.</p>

12

<p>shelldemeo-
I did not mention, at the risk of boring those readers who have heard me say it a gazillion times before, but my older s sounds just like your s-- initially planing a major in physics (applied) but with possible interest in engineering. Williams, Amherst, Dartmouth, MIT and Harvard were the first schools he looked at. He sat in on classes, had tours of the physics lab, and at Williams had lunch with the faculty from the Physics and Astronomy depts. He LOVED it. But, he ultimately decided he wanted the option of engineering and did not apply. Next round of schools we looked at were Ga Tech, Cal Tech and Harvey Mudd. Then looked at Columbia, Yale, Brown and Tufts. But the perfect fit, the one he loved the minute he got there, applied to ED and attended— Rice. Started out as a physics major. Changed to Mechanical Engineering, and is happily working as a MechE.</p>

13

<p>Most Williams students that decide to be engineers, do a 4-1 program. Graduate from Williams with their class and then get their engineering requirements at Columbia. I would think, unless he was sure he wanted to be an engineer, such an option would appeal to him. Physics and math at Williams are both excellent.</p>

14

<p>Regarding the Case issue, Case has a very present alternative scene. From what I hear from friends at case, the students are incredibly quirky, they are just more blunt about their quirkiness which turns some away. It obviously a very good institution which gives great aid and has quite a few opportunities available within the sciences. I definitely believes it is a good school and should be weighed highly, particularly if money is a concern.</p>

15

<p>Case has good merit aid.
<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/696637-merit-aid-percentage-common-data-set-6.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/696637-merit-aid-percentage-common-data-set-6.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

16

<p>Rice is an AMAZING place… glad to see it on the list. Although it is still tough to get, Rice offers 30% of its incoming class some form of merit aid (ranging from $2000 NMF scholarships to full tuition for outstanding engineering students).</p>

17

<p>As a safety: Alfred University (NY) </p>

<p>[Alfred</a> University - Inamori School of Engineering - Mechanical Engineering (ME) Bachelor of Science](<a href=“http://engineering.alfred.edu/undergrad/me/]Alfred”>http://engineering.alfred.edu/undergrad/me/) Mechanical Engineering </p>

<p>[Alfred</a> University : Honors Program](<a href=“http://www.alfred.edu/honors/]Alfred”>http://www.alfred.edu/honors/) Honors Program </p>

<p>[Alfred</a> University - College of Liberal Arts and Sciences - Performing Arts - Major and Minors - Music](<a href=“http://las.alfred.edu/performing-arts/music/]Alfred”>http://las.alfred.edu/performing-arts/music/) Music
[Alfred</a> University - College of Liberal Arts and Sciences - Performing Arts - Facilities](<a href=“http://las.alfred.edu/performing-arts/facilities/#miller]Alfred”>http://las.alfred.edu/performing-arts/facilities/#miller) Performing Arts Facilities </p>

<p>2200 Undergrads, School of Engineering, College of Liberal Arts, School of Business, School of Art & Design. No Greek Life. 50% Male, 50% Female. Division III Athletics. </p>

<p>Princeton Review’s Best 373
Fiske Guide 2011 & Fiske Guide Best Value
USNWR’s Great Schools Great Prices </p>

<p>Please note I am recommending as a safety with possible merit aid & Honors Program with Performing Arts available. Also AU wants more students from OOS.</p>

18

<p>Shelldemeo - from what I can read, your son seems that he will do well anywhere he goes. Congrats to him for working so hard in high school, and for working conscientiously to compile a list like that! I do agree that Allegheny seems a bit out of place on that list, but then again, it is always good to have a safety school (and by the sound of it, he’s already in), so why not? From what you’ve written, though, Rice in particular sounds like a great fit, so best of luck to him!</p>

<p>The one thing I will say is that if he truly wants to apply to MIT, he should do it. It may end up being a “waste of his time,” but he might as well go for it - you never know!</p>

<p>Also - when I read the title “smart and quirky,” I wondered whether you had looked at Carleton or not. They do give good FA there (I’m a student here), the students are certainly smart, quirky, friendly, and motivated, and there is definitely respect for the music scene (my roommate is in choir, one of our friends plays the flute, acapella events are heavily attended). However, there is no engineering major, although you can certainly complete the engineering school requirements anyway with a degree in physics or chem (depending on what kind of engineering).</p>

19

<p>“His feel of (Swarthmore) was that it was cold/snobby. It is so funny how they can make a snap judgment about a campus. His came from holding doors open for a few students and not getting a thank you. They don’t offer merit but it did look fantastic. But, alas, it is off of his list.”</p>

<p>Read the book Blink? </p>

<p>First impressions from others were “cultish”, “twee”, “impressed with itself” along with “intellectually challenging” and “seriosu academic vibe.”</p>

<p>Not saying that Swarthmore isn’t a really good school . . . but different schools do have different cultures, since the issue here is the best “fit” for a student, and since there IS something to first impression, best to move on :-)</p>

<p>Seems like a split list: Engineering and LACs . . . does the kid know he prefers one style or the other, or is the process here to keep options open until April?</p>

20

<p>I encourage applying to both types of schools if he’s not sure. </p>

<p>D got into two very different schools EA, one with more of a liberal arts focused and one more math/tech focused. With the pressure off and the ball in her court, she had time to do serious due diligence, learn a lot about herself and make a really good decision. Sure, she could have guessed earlier and ended up with the same result, but it was sure nice for her to take the time and really think it through.</p>