<p>Does anybody know anything about this school? How is the campus and how are the academics? I heard that they dont give grades, if so, how do people get into grad school?</p>
<p>I live in Maryland and have seen the school but never attended there. It is a very different type of school. It has a beautiful campus and is located in picturesque Annapolis. There are lots of things to do in Annapolis and great restaurants.</p>
<p>The students (Johnies) do not generally have a field of major as with other schools. You study the great books. In doing so, you also learn the language that some of the books were writen in. For example, when you study Aristotle, you learn greek so you can read his works in the original Greek etc. I think that you even learn Latin.</p>
<p>Essentially you have a double major when you graduate: Classics and ancient philosophy.It certainly is an interesting school to say the least. You should check it out and speak to the students.</p>
<p>does anyone know how the dorms are?</p>
<p>St. John's College is one college on two campuses. There is one campus in Annapolis and another in Santa Fe. The curriculum on both campuses is the same the only difference is the location.
Students who are accepted to either campus have the option of enrolling in either campus and students who attend either campus have the option of freely transferring to either campus; i.e.: If I wanted to I could spend two years in Santa Fe and the next two in Annapolismany people do this, it is highly encouraged.
I currently attend the Santa Fe campus and I have visited the Annapolis campus on several occasions.
The Curriculum is based upon the great books of the western world. We don't use any textbooks--we always read the primary texts; i.e: when we are learning Geometry we read Euclid, when we are learning history we read Herodotus and Thucydides or Plutarch and Tacitus etc.
The curriculum is very broad--we study mathematics, science, music, philosophy, theology, Greek, French and various other things intensely here at St. John's. It is not a place for someone who wants to specialize in a particular field and it is not a place for people who want options in class selection. All of the classes are required--there are no options. This can be very frustrating to some people but I personally love it--you never have to wait in long lines to sign up for classes!
All of the classes are discussion oriented. There is not a lot of lecturing--the professors/tutors expect that you have read the reading and the classroom is simply a place to discuss ideas. Thus, if you have a hard time speaking up in class you will fail at St. John's. Your success depends upon how thoughtful you are in the classroom discussions. Don't let this scare you though--I used to be very quiet in class and I was for about the first month here but then I started adapting.
One thing to understand about St. John's is that it is very small. Both campuses have less than 500 students. This means that you will get up close and personal with your peers. I personally love this, but some people prefer anonymity.
The previous poster was mistaken on a few points: We DO study ancient Greek but we do not study Latin. St. John's used to study Latin but then they switched it to French. The first two years are Greek the last two are French. The language classes are by far the most challenging and in many ways the most rewarding.
When you apply to graduate school the St. John's degree is read as: The History of Philosophy, Mathematics and Science by a lot of schools. And simply "Liberal Arts" by others.
St. John's College is a place for people who love to read and/or are not satisfied by the traditional ways of learning. It is widely regarded as one of the most challenging undergraduate institutions and as such students who go to the college have a great attrition rate into the greatest graduate schools in the nation. </p>
<p>Answering your original question: St. John's DOES have grades they simply are not emphasized. You do not see your grades--they don't get mailed to you or anything like that. If you want to see them you have to go to the Registrars office. They are kept only for graduate school purposes. The "Don Rags" are given far more emphasis here: at the end of each semester you get together with all of your professors/tutors in one room and discuss your progress at the college. This qualitative approach is far more beneficial to the student, the college believes.</p>
<p>If the college sounds interesting to you I encourage you to apply (it's a free application), I absolutely LOVE it, and most who come here do. </p>
<p>If you want to discuss St. Johns I love talking about it, so email me at <a href="mailto:dfvidaurre@sjcsf.edu">dfvidaurre@sjcsf.edu</a> or IM at plasticnoise87</p>
<p>:)</p>
<p>Good Luck!</p>
<p>P.S: If the idea of no grades appeals to you check out the New College of Florida. My brother goes there. They really do have NO grades. Instead they have written evaluations. The New College of Florida is a REALLY great school, they frequently send their students off to the top graduate/medical/law schools in the country. If you haven't looked into it yet, I encourage you to.</p>
<p>Davidav87, it sounds like you are a student at St. John's. I think the college's educational style is perfect for me. However, I have a couple questions that are nagging me. As a conservative Christian, I'm worried about how accepting the tutors and students are of conservative Christianity. Also, I've read that there is quite a bit of drinking at St. John's. Is this true? If so, is there a nondrinking subculture. I don't mind being around people of different opinions. I'm just worried that there would be a lot of pressure towards particular philosophies and viewpoints.</p>
<p>Hey Taoigh,
If the educational style is perfect for you then the college is perfect for you. I know of several conservative Christians here at St. John's and they have no problems. I myself am quite religious and while there are a lot of atheists here it's not unlike any other college. Your views will be considered just as much as other views--it would be a boring college indeed if everyone had the same opinions!
I don't think there is any more drinking at St. John's than at any other college. There are plenty of students who do not drink (I am one of them).
You will not be pressured to believe anything unless you allow yourself to be pressured. At St. John's people will expect you to have reasons for your opinions and if they are rational they will respect your opinion even if they do not agree with it.</p>
<p>David Vidaurre</p>
<p>P.S: You might also be interested in Thomas Aquinas College in Santa Paula California. Thomas Aquinas College's educational style is almost identical to St. John's--it is the great books program--but I hear the school is far more conservative then St. John's. At that school drinking is prohibited. It is Catholic though, and I don't know if this is a problem for you. There are a few minor differences between Thomas Aquinas College (<a href="http://www.thomasaquinas.edu%5B/url%5D">www.thomasaquinas.edu</a>) and St. John's--at TAC you learn Latin, for example. I don't believe there is a music program at TAC and the math program at St. John's is far more extensive. TAC reads a few MORE writers in seminar specifically more religious writers and, of course, they read a lot of Thomas Aquinas! Although I am from California I chose St. Johns over TAC simply because I did not feel comfortable going to a college with a dress code and also because Santa Fe is beautiful. There is also another Great Books College in Illinois called Shimer College (<a href="http://www.shimer.edu%5B/url%5D">www.shimer.edu</a>) but this one is far different than St. John's or TAC, it is however, based upon great books and not textbooks. The Thomas More College of Liberal Arts (<a href="http://www.thomasmorecollege.edu%5B/url%5D">http://www.thomasmorecollege.edu</a>) in Vermont is the same way. Thomas More College of Liberal Arts also has a Rome program where all the sophomores spend a semester in Rome which is of course, very intriguing. This school has less than 100 people, so if you want a REALLY small collegethis one is for you! TMCLA , like Thomas Aquinas is a Catholic school. Shimer has no denomination, neither does St. Johns.
The University of Texas at Austin has an internal program that is very similar to St. John's or TAC but the difference is that it is in a university with 60,000 people--a considerable difference. It is called the Plan II program and you can find out more about it here: <a href="http://www.utexas.edu/cola/plan2/%5B/url%5D">http://www.utexas.edu/cola/plan2/</a>
Make sure you look at all of your options! There are several options for a person who wants a "great books" education. St. John's is the original though, and of course I think it's the best. Hehe.</p>
<p>EDIT: Thomas More College of Liberal Arts is actually in New Hampshire.</p>
<p>Anyway, if you want to know any more about St. John's email me at: <a href="mailto:dfvidaurre@sjcsf.edu">dfvidaurre@sjcsf.edu</a> or IM me at plasticnoise87</p>
<p>I am still thinking about applying at St. John's. I am an international student and I have to be concerned about the financial aid offered by the colleges. Do you have any information regarding this?</p>
<p>Don't think about applying. APPLY!
It's a free application!</p>
<p>Financial Aid at St. John's is available to all but only on a NEED-basis.</p>
<p>how many hours do you study/read per day? on average how many pages in a book do you read every night?</p>
<p>This all depends on the person, of course. And on the book.
We just got done with Herodotus. The reading assignments were very long there. About 150 pages to read between seminars. Right now we are reading Plato and since the writing is so rich they assign only about 70 pages between meetings. We have seminar every Monday and Thursday. Beside that there is a lot of reading to do for lab. About 50 pages between meetings. We meet in lab every Tuesday and Thursday. Then there is Math, which isn't so many pages, but it's a lot of work because you have to prepare the propositions. Finally Greek, like math, it isn't so many pages but a lot of work.</p>
<p>Some people leave all of their reading to the last minute. Others do not. I schedule my reading accordingly and make sure the work does not become overwhelming.</p>
<p>Do you have a lot of time to do ECs and play sports? What time do classes start in the morning?</p>
<p>I have plenty of time to do ECs and they are very important to do for someone who wants to get into graduate school. Most of my ECs are in community service and I do several hours a week..</p>
<p>Hours are not the same for all the students but mine are as follows:</p>
<p>Mon, Wed, Fri-- Greek: 10:30am-12:00
Mon, Wed, Fri-- Math: 1:00am-2:30
Tues, Thurs-- Lab: 9:00am-12:00
Mon, Thurs--Seminar: 8:00pm-10:00
Wed--Choir--2:30-4:00</p>
<p>Again, it varies for everyone but that should give you an idea. Seminar does not vary. EVERYONE has seminar on Mondays and Thursdays.</p>
<p>I also work ten hours a week. If you can afford not to work this time could also be spent on extra-curriculars. Even if you have to work, you will have plenty of time to pursue whatever extra-curricular activities you like. The trick to manage your time carefully.</p>
<p>Hi! I just got my acceptance letter today =)</p>
<p>I have a few questions for davidav87... </p>
<ol>
<li>Which campus did you prefer? Maryland or New Mexico?</li>
<li>I hve taken 3 AP exams (one4,two5) and taken a few classes at the local community college..i dont get any credit for those do i?</li>
<li>I really like it..but i have to convince my parents. How are grad school rates? to people generally get into good grad schools? This reallyyyyyy concerns my parents</li>
<li>are there things to do in annapolis/new mexico? I dont mind rural areas, but i do like to have movie theaters and such around</li>
<li>how's the housing? financial aid? is the admin hell to deal with? do most people like it there? if i have to transfer out for some reason, do my credits transfer?</li>
</ol>
<p>I would hav eemialed you, but i figured everyone who wondered the same things could read it here.. thank you in advance =)</p>
<p>1) I have been to both campuses and they both have their advantages and disadvantages. The Annapolis campus has a better Music program but the Santa Fe campus has a better Lab and Math program. The Annapolis campus is said to be a lot more serious then the Santa Fe campus--they wear suits to seminar and stuff. The Santa Fe campus is a lot more "laid back" but just as academic. I personally prefer the Santa Fe campus for many reasons not least of which is the beauty of Santa Fe.
2) Nothing will be transferred. You have to understand that the curriculum here is VERY exclusive so they can't transfer anything. I had 72 college credits which I sacrificed to come hereits well worth it.
3) Graduate Schools love Johnnies. If you have not been sent the pamphlet that shows where all the Johnnies have gone to graduate school in the last few years call admissions and request it. They get into top law/business/graduate and even medical schools. This should not be a concern at all. Johnnies also have a history of winning great graduate fellowships such as the Rhodes scholarship and Marshall Scholarship. Make sure you request the pamphlet that gives you all the statistics.
I had to convince my parents that St. John's was a good choice especially because I was accepted to Berkeley which many perceive as a really great school. I convinced them that for undergraduates St. John's is as good as it gets. They were also impressed that St. John's made the Princeton Review list for "Best Overall Undergraduate Experience" very highly.
4) In Santa Fe the nearest shopping areas are at least 3 miles away. There are no gas stations, liquor stores or anything thing of the sort very close to the campus. In Annapolis you don't have to go far to find things to do.
5) a) In Santa Fe most people get Single Rooms--no roommate--which is very cool. This is exclusive to the Santa Fe campus though.
b) Financial aid is fantastic in the Santa Fe campus. I hear it's not as good at the Annapolis campus. The Princeton Review rates the Annapolis financial aid at something like 82 and the Santa Fe campus at 99. However, the financial aid is ONLY need-based, that means that you will not get money for being in sports or having great grades, only if your family (according to them) "needs" it. If you have not yet, fill out the FASFA form--fill it out now! When you fill it out it will tell you what the government thinks you can afford and St. John's will take care of the rest.
c) Admin is definitely not hell to deal with. It's very pleasant and the dean/president know most students.
d) Most people love it here. I certainly do. I cant imagine being anywhere else.
e) Yes, your credits will transfer if you must transfer.</p>
<p>If you are seriously considering St. Johns, save up your lunch money and visit one of the campusessit in at a seminar and a few tutorials. Im sure you will love it.
Where do you live? Which campus is closer?</p>
<p>wow. thank you so much. I live in california, so santa fe is closer. i was thinking two years at annapolis and two at santa fe..and yes, i am seriously considering st john's so im going to visit after i get the rest of my letters back... but my parents aren't very willing to pay for a private education, especially if i get into UC berkeley, davis or san diego. i was pretty sure about number 2, but i had to ask anyway..and my parnts are actually quite conservative about the college experience but they are warming up to the idea of st john's, so thats great. again, thank you very much. that was extremely helpful.</p>
<p>I also lived in California. Cool.
Your parents clearly don't understand the difference between Berkeley, Davis, San Diego and St. John's. It is NOT the same. I was set to go to Berkeley before I sat into some classes--hundreds of students. The professors need microphones. Amazing. I hope you can change their minds.</p>
<p>When/If you come and visit be sure to let me know!</p>
<p>well they understand the difference but i guess a school like st john's is out of their 'safety zone' ..its unfamiliar to them so they woudl prefer something closeby and something they know is a good school..im working on it though!</p>
<p>Google "Reed college Ph.D productivity". It will give you lists by academic area of which undergraduate colleges the most students in these programs came from. You will see that St. John's is way up there in most of the Ph.D programs, including math.</p>
<p>Indeed. Math is acutally a very popular field that St. John's students pursue in graduate school.</p>