OK, we took another look at the numbers we got for this. Things seem to be not as far off as I had indicated earlier.
We ran it for 12 schools – all the schools on our list that have NPCs available at collegeboard, which is about half the schools on our list. Most of those 12 only have need-based aid, and most MFN. We ran things with and without one other child in college, since my older son will be in school for just my younger son’s first year.
With them both in school, there was about a $6K range in the NPCs (i.e., our net cost), with those numbers coming in $2.5K-8.5K above the EFCs (the average of the two). With just one in school, the range was tighter, about $5K overall (but 9 were in a $2K range), but also farther from the EFCs, $5K-10K above.
With two in school, Dickinson, Grinnell, and Harvey Mudd were the closest to the EFCs, and Case Western and Brown the farthest. With one in school, Swarthmore, Williams, and Case Western were the closest, and Amherst and Brown the farthest (Brown was the farthest in both cases). (Dickinson and Case Western are not MFN.)
I didn’t review all the data we had entered, that’ll be work for another day. But it’s basically the same numbers for both the NPCs and the EFCs.
So, not sure what to make of all this. Most of the numbers from the NPCs seem to be not too far off from the EFCs, kinda consistent with the discussion here. I can understand them being a few thousand off. Only a few schools – maybe just one – were off by a significant amount. (Is Brown not known for being generous with aid?)
My feeling has been that, when in doubt, for a vanilla situation, the college NPCs should be more on target with what the college might offer than another source. And the bottom line is which NPC projections are in line with what your family can afford- or swing- not how they align with a projection for the Fafsa EFC. Many of us found the college aid that materialized left us with about a third more to pay than the Fafsa EFC.
After you see those NPC figures, you tear into what each consists of- grants vs loans, the real “gift” portion versus what you pay now or over time (loans.)
For your particular details, I thought you might say, per the NPCs, we can’t afford colleges A, B, and C. Then you have an idea which schools may have to go off the table. Or, D is doable, but not as generous as E.
The CSS Profile asks for much more detail than the Fafsa EFC. Be careful you aren’t using input figures higher than needed. The first thing is retirement- anything protected in a “Qualified Plan,” (you can’t touch the money) isn’t assets. In contrast, savings, mutual funds, stocks, etc, are. Many confuse their net worth with these distinctions.
You can play with higher or lower inputs, see the changes, if any.
I’ll also add that once all of your results are in and you’ve narrowed to the final 2 or 3, you can go back to a school and make a plea for slightly more. We did this with both S and D and did get a bit more. The closer you are to May 1st the more receptive a school might be. Of course, that depends entirely on how its yield is looking. If a school is tracking well, it may very well politely decline your request.
We also found that after initial results several schools, unsolicited, came back with a revised offer that was a few thousand less. I have no idea if this was due to CSS Profile data, school specific FA supplements, or the school simply trying to sweeten the pot to get the applicant to say yes. Dickinson was one school that did that with my D.
We had two applying at once which made things really interesting. Tuition for S + D combined had to be affordable - There were surprises (pleasant and not-so-pleasant) for both - In the end, it worked out - although I will say that with tuition creep and the college experience coming with lots of “extra” costs, we are totally feeling the pinch as they head into their junior years.
Along the lines of what 4Gulls is saying, I would suggest that if a school is coming in within 5K (and maybe 10K) of your budget, then keep them on the list and see what happens. Some of the schools that my D applied to were surprisingly generous with aid, and some were surprisingly stingy in comparison. Just make absolutely sure that your son understands that it’s a two-part process: admission, and then sufficient financial aid, and that you have to have both.
What about Vanderbilt? They are reputed to offer good aid. Also, he could likely get full tuition at Miami of Ohio. I realize those are bigger schools, but may be worth a look in the money hunt. Good luck!
If he likes D.C., George Washington University and American University give good merit. And Tulane in New Orleans. As you no doubt are aware, your best FA will come from your reaches, but no merit aid possibilities there.
I would think that for physics, the particular program (emphasis, research opportunities, focus on grad students or undergrads) would be most important, and other things secondary, as long as it’s affordable.
I am not sure what you consider small to medium, but have you considered Northeastern? It is not a total safety, but it certainly seems to meet most of your criteria. They can be generous, and my DD picked it over some of the schools on your list. It ended up being more affordable the UIUC, and we are also in state, She was not that interested in going, but it was her safety. She also looked at Reed, which is also very strong in physics, but it just didn’t make the cut off for her to apply.
Missed my edit cut off! I see you crossed off Reed, so ignore that! Also forgot to mention the Northeastern Promise. You woudl receive the same aid there, or better, for all 8 semesters, even though you older DS would have graduated and your calculated need would go down. As they say, you could win the lottery and your aid won’t decrease.
Those numbers seem to be typical, since colleges generally expect a student contribution (loans up to federal direct loans and/or a few thousand dollars in work earnings). Of course, each college may expect a different student contribution, and each college may calculate EFC differently.
What you want to do is determine your AFC (the actual family contribution you will contribute), then figure out how much he is willing to work for pay and/or take federal direct loans, which is the ASC (actual student contribution). Your target net price should be no higher than AFC + ASC.
Well, on that note, we did have a slightly different personal perspective. We got the aid we thought we would (D1 started before NPCs were fully rolled out) but did take some modest Parent Plus loans.
For reasons I can’t explain, all her aid packages came in within $150 of each other, so the decision among colleges wasn’t about saving thousands of dollars. (And she only applied to schools she knew she could be happy at.) If a family is cautious and knows how they will repay the PP, well, it was an option we took. In a sense, we did roll that comfortable loan amount into what we saw as a feasible “AFC.”
Dickinson is one school that indicates that applicant’s interest level is important. Did you do anything in particular to show interest there?
In comment #48:
I thought the NPC output included (possibly) loan and work components. I was under the impression that you couldn’t do either of those beyond what was listed there. Is that not correct? Can you do either of those on top of what’s included in the NPC?
I have no problem with taking out the Federal Direct Loans up to the limit, but I was under the impression you couldn’t take any additional loans than what’s listed in the NPC output (even if it’s $0).
The student has a four year max, but parents can take the Parent Plus. Some colleges won’t include student loans in their packaging, but the student may still take them.
Yes, net price should include student loan and work amounts (ESC) as part of it. For a school that claims to “meet need”, net price = EFC + ESC (otherwise, it may be EFC + ESC + unmet need). But you need to make sure that it is not more than AFC + ASC.
https://studentaid.ed.gov/sa/types/loans/subsidized-unsubsidized#how-much indicates that the “school determines the loan type(s), if any, and the actual loan amount you are eligible to receive each academic year.” This can cause ASC to be constrained on a per-school basis based on willingness to include loans in ASC.
A school’s financial aid offer may or may not include work-study, which creates an incentive for on-campus jobs to prefer hiring the student, but may also cause them to limit the student’s work to earn just up to the subsidized amount of pay. However, a student can work at other jobs (or any job if not offered work-study) during the school year or during times when not attending school (summer or winter breaks).
“Your school determines the loan type(s), if any, and the actual loan amount you are eligible to receive each academic year” but for the top schools OP mentioned, it shouldn’t be a problem to get the annual maxes, even if they do not package them in the NPC. At some point, you may want to pose some of these questions on the finaid forum, get feedback from some posters experienced in the nuances.
And this: we shouldn’t confuse the Fafsa EFC with the family contribution the college calculates, sometimes also called EFC. When ucb says “net price = EFC + ESC,” it’s not the Fafsa EFC. It’s the school’s.
There are (at least?) two more types of loans colleges can add to a student’s FA package - Perkins (for very low income students) and “Health Professions” (for low income students pursuing “dentistry, optometry, pharmacy, podiatric medicine, or veterinary medicine”.