Switch highschools?

Parents Social Lounge
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<p>My 8th grade son normally would standout both academically and athletically in highschool. However, his public highschool will probably have well over 50 National Merit Finalists and is a national powerhouse in his sport so he probably won't standout. If he doesn't switch schools, he might graduate in the top 20 and spend 2 years JV and 2 years varsity, maybe not starting until his senior year if at all. He will probably be an academic fit for HYPS and might be good enough to be recriuted by an Ivy for his sport but I would judge him just below that level now.</p>

<p>Assuming he doesn't get recruited, would his college admissions chances be better for him to go to a somewhat lesser highschool, that is good but not great academically? There he would standout, he would have a good shot at graduating 1st in his class, play 4 years varsity and possibly be captain (it wouldn't affect his recruiting chances - that's based on club team performance). He could also excell in track (his current school wouldn't allow him to do both sports due to some overlap in seasons). He could take the same courses but would be academically easier allowing him time to participate in more ECs. His sport is year 'round with travel to college showcase tournaments so at his current school he might not have time for many other ECs. There are many other factors that we will consider and my son is open to the idea. I just think his college application would look much more impressive if he switched schools. Sorry for the bragging but what do you think? Thanks for your replies.</p>

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<p>I think there are two separate issues here – one having to do with the sport and the other with academics.</p>

<p>Academically, your son might be better off in the school that tends to have 50 NMSFs a year simply because he would have a peer group in which he would feel comfortable. This might make an important difference in terms of his happiness. I wouldn’t worry so much about his lesser class rank (unless he is trying to get a merit scholarship where class rank is the deciding factor in selection). Colleges know that the competition at different high schools differs.</p>

<p>My daughter chose a selective academic magnet program (a school with about 35 NMSFs a year) over her neighborhood high school (usually 1 or 2 NMSFs a year) and thereby sabotaged (slightly) both her class rank and her GPA. In the end, though, it didn’t matter. She had expected all along that she would end up at a college one level of selectivity below HYPS (because she had impressive academic stats but didn’t have the “something special” that HYPS are looking for). That’s exactly what happened. It’s also what would have happened if she had gone to the neighborhood high school. But at that high school, she would have been an oddball who had little in common with most of her classmates. At the school she attended, she had a large peer group with whom she had much in common.</p>

<p>Think of it this way: Your son has the potential to be accepted at highly selective colleges. One of the reasons why he would want to attend one of those colleges is the quality of the students with whom he would associate there. He would be disappointed if he had to attend the local branch of your state university system at least in part because he would not have an academic peer group, right? Well, if this thinking applies when he’s four years older, perhaps it should also apply now. Your son has the opportunity to attend a high school that is top notch, academically. It sounds like a great “fit” for him. Why turn that down?</p>

<p>As for the sport, much depends on how strongly your son feels about being able to play for his school. If it really matters to him, then maybe switching to the other school is a good idea (but look VERY carefully at the rules about transfers playing sports; he might find that he has to wait a year before he would be allowed to play). If he doesn’t care that much, and is willing to pursue the sport primarily outside of school, then maybe academics should be the deciding factor.</p>

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<p>As someone who has a son playing college athletics - and who has been through the whole recruiting process, my advice would be to go to the high school where he is most likely to flourish academically and socially - and let the athletic chips fall where they will.</p>

<p>I don’t know what sport your son plays - but unless it is basketball and he is already 6’ 8" and still growing, projecting an 8th grader into a college scholarship is a extremely risky proposition. Throughout the high school years, kids are growing and changing and the outstanding 8th grader may not even start his senior year. Furthermore, the fallout from high school to college is amazing - less than 10% of the HS athletes go on to play college sports.</p>

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<p>Here’s something else to consider:</p>

<p>I live in Montgomery County, Maryland, which has a very good public school system. However, some of its 25 high schools have better academic reputations and statistics than the others do. (This is largely a function of the socioeconomic levels of the areas that each high school serves.) Three of our high schools – Whitman, Churchill, and Wootton – are universally known for their academic excellence. Even U.S. News knows how good they are. Those three schools – and none of the others in our county – just made U.S. News’s top 100 list. I doubt that anyone in the county found this surprising.</p>

<p>Whenever a real estate agent here puts a house on the market that is in the Wootton, Whitman, or Churchill district, the ad for the house inevitably mentions the high school. It’s a big selling point, even though students who attend these schools suffer in terms of class rank in comparison to those in the county’s other high schools because the competition at these three schools is greater. No real estate agent ever says “This house is located in [inferior high school] district, so your kid will have a better class rank than he/she would have had at Churchill.” That approach doesn’t sell houses.</p>

<p>Think about it.</p>

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<p>I think the peer group and learning in high school is important, though I admit we sent our son to the good enough local high school judging it had a big enough peer group even though it generally only has a two or three NMFs. There’s always the possibility that your son is the sort who will rise to the top wherever he is, but even if he isn’t most of the top colleges are well aware of the top high schools and will judge your son in his local context.</p>

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<p>For what it’s worth, my S was a NMF & just about the middle of his class because it is a very highly regarded private school with the most NMFs in the state. Yes, he may have gotten a higher class rank if he attended public school but he chose (& we supported) to go to a private school where he had more intellectual peers than he would have if he had attended the neighborhood public HS. It cost considerably more to send him there, but it was well worth it from his perspective & ours. He got into a school where he’s very happy with good merit aid, tho not HYPS. Don’t think he would have gotten into HYPS in any case, as many with glowing stats & high rank don’t every year, including the school validictorian for 2008 (it’s a crapshot).</p>

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<p>I have a son who is trying to be recruited this year. His sport, too, is year round, with lots of travel to college showcases (he just got back from one, having flown across the country to participate, and missing several days of school). In addition, as you mentioned, his sport is not one in which what happens on your high school team makes a difference in terms of recruiting–it is all done through the club.</p>

<p>I think you should be a bit careful here with your thinking. You say he might be good enough to be recruited for an Ivy, but then you go on to say he probably won’t start on his high school team until his senior year. Even if this school is very good, I can’t see how he would be good enough to be recruited for an Ivy and then not good enough to definitely start on a high school team in his junior year (when lots of recruiting for D1 sports, including Ivies, happens). Ivy League schools do have good teams in a number of sports, including the one I know best-soccer. Penn, Harvard and Dartmouth all made the NCAA tourney this year and at least Penn was ranked at some point in the top 25 nationally this year.</p>

<p>As you recognize, club sports are a huge time commitment. You worry that he couldn’t do top level high school academics and the club sport and other extracurriculars. I have found the same–my son basically studies and does his club sport. He also does a few other things that aren’t huge time commitments. </p>

<p>But here 's another point to think about. You are considering changing schools so he could do his club sport, academics and other extracurriculars. But then you also mention that he might not be recruited. If he wants to go to an Ivy, and would even go without doing his sport, then why spend so much time with the club sport doing the travel and college showcases? The only reason to go to a showcase is for recruiting. At least for soccer, there are many different levels of play, and there are some levels that don’t require so much commitment. Your son might even make captain of one of those teams if his sport also has different levels of commitment even at the club level. </p>

<p>If you do want the sports, academics and other extracurriculars, but feel that at your current school he could only do the academics and club sport, why would you go to a lesser quality academic school to do it all and not a less quality club sport team? The reason to play on the high level club team with the huge commitment is the chance to be recruited and play in college. Perhaps if he tones down the club sport commitment, he can do the academics and the other extracurriculars at his current school.</p>

<p>So I guess you really have to decide how committed your son is to his sport, whether it is important or not for him to continue to play at a very high level, and whether he wants to play in college. </p>

<p>I would avoid the high level club sport commitment as a kind of resume building at all costs. There is too much money, time and emotional investment that you really have to be dedicated. </p>

<p>What happens, if, at the end of freshman or sophomore year, he decides he doesn’t want to play and he leaves the club sport? This has happened for several very good players on my son’s team–they still play, but not at the highest level. Would you be still be happy with the switch in schools if that happens?</p>

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<p>I don’t have a horse in the race, so to speak, regarding elite athletics, but as a mother of three boys who play competitive sports but not league travel team elite - man, they are wildly different at age 14 than at age 18. By 8th grade you probably have a fairly good sense of where he could potentially be academically, but you have no idea where he will be with regard to athletics, he could discover girls at age 16 and decide there are far more important things in life than that kind of athletic commitment or he could finish growing by 16 while a whole bunch of guys zoom past him in strength and size. I’m a girl, and taught my “sport” to kids for several years, but I’d put my money on the academics, not the athletics. If I remember correctly, there was a kid in my older son’s class who actually switched up his sports a couple times in high school and still got recruited by H…he was that much of an attractive athlete/academic that H was interested in him for a sport he might have only played 2 years at a tiny public school in the middle of nowhere. So I don’t think ahtletics are formulaic and you either are or you aren’t a good athlete. But academics, yes there are very real differences in schools that impact our children. That is my two cent opinion.</p>

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<p>At which school would he learn more? </p>

<p>At which school would he have the chance for the greatest maturing of emotion and spirit?</p>

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<p>I found with my 3 that they basically rose to the occasion whenever their peer group challenged them. You’re giving up a lot sending a bright kid somewhere you know he’ll be best.</p>

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<p>Dartmouth was 16th in soccer this year.</p>

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<p>Isn’t it kind of hard to be 16th when the Ivy League has only 8 members?</p>

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<p>I appreciate all of your replies and some very good points have been raised. Just to address of few of the comments, I know the our son’s chance of getting recruited by an Ivy are small at this time and we are assuming he won’t be. In fact, I am a little ambivalent about him playing in college since I played a different sport at the D1 level and dropped it after freshman year because the time demands weren’t compatible with an engineering major.</p>

<p>My biggest concern is that his high school is famous for ungodly amounts of homework. Even now, he goes to practice, eats, does 4 hours of homework and goes to bed. Talking to other kids on his club team who go to different schools, they have half the work our son does. I realize many on this board have ambitious kids in the same situation as ours. More is expected of top students today and I accept that but I still wonder if it’s a good thing. The idea of switching schools looks attractive to us because it will relieve some of that pressure. Several other parents in our neighborhood have sent their kids to private school for this reason. That said, the peer group argument is the best reason for staying so we are leaning that way. Thanks again for all of you inputs.</p>

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<p>Why on earth would you want to switch out of a high school with a proven record like that? Clearly what they’re doing is working.</p>

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<p>Our high school is like that. 50+ NMS per year and it’s not the effort of the teachers nor the school, clearly from my daughter’s experience, they don’t know what they’re doing. However, clearly these kids that go to these schools know what they are doing. I looked at the picture in the school website and I can say that 80% of these NMS are Asians and that means they prep for the PSAT(check out the no prep thread). I’m contemplating switching out of this school for my second child. There is no way I want her to go to this school. My gut instinct tells me it’s a horrrible school. I know these students have after school tutors and such and they all come from countries that are gun-ho into school. So it’s maynot be all about learning. I rather she goes to a school with 10+NMS because there is less pressure and she will learn on her own pace. Doing gazillions of homework every night is just a mind numbing experience. Nothing good about that. But the final decision of which school she picks to go to is still hers.</p>

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<p>I wouldn’t switch based upon the sport - but the description of the school above is setting off little alarm bells. I’d investigate the school very carefully, looking at the quality of student life. While I want my kids to have a great education - I also want them to be whole people - with healthy social, athletic and academic lives. Very tough to do that under the weight of “ungodly amounts of homework”.</p>

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<p>We recently moved from a more diverse, somewhat poor, not-very-competitive district in one state, to a wealthier suburban, academically competitive district in another. A couple of my kids, who are excellent students, prefer the old school system because they really did stand out and got a lot of attention from the teachers since there just weren’t that many serious students. Now they are still getting the grades–but they miss the attention and wish they could stand out more. Here they have TONS of homework (more than I did in college. I don’t see how the kids–especially those who are taking multiple APs and participating in activities–aren’t having nervous breakdowns!) I don’t think all the busywork helps them any–just adds stress. I also think my kids’ test scores would look better coming from the more disadvantaged district–though I am not that concerned since they won’t be applying to super-competitive colleges. </p>

<p>My kids aren’t involved in school sports, but I can see your point about standing out more at a “weaker” school. I went to a huge, competitive suburban school, and it was sad to see so much talent go to waste. There were kids who could have made varsity at other schools getting cut or spending years in JV. Wonderful kids felt like losers. In your situation, I also would be considering the “lesser” school.</p>

<p>All that said, don’t sweat the decision. Just make it and stick with it. It sounds like your kid would be fine at either school. Would any friends or teammates be going to the “lesser”
school? That should be a consideration, too.</p>

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<p>I totally understand why you’d consider a different high school. Back when we were looking for a home to buy (when our oldest was an infant), I ruled out homes located within the attendance area of a very top notch public high school (New Trier in Winnetka, IL) because of concerns similar to yours. It wasn’t that I was worried about where my kids would go to college (heck, most of them weren’t even born at the time), but I was worried about the level of competition and attendant stress, the athletic opportunities and the size of the school (generally and as it relates to both athletic and academic opportunites), regardless of whether my kids turned out to be talented either academically or athletically. People thought I was nuts, both for passing up such an excellent school and for even thinking about such a thing when my oldest was less than a year old, but it made sense to me at the time. My D is now attending a very well regarded, but smaller and somewhat less competitive, public high school several miles away from the area we passed up, and I’m happy with my choice.</p>

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<p>As someone who went to my district’s top magnet program academically (I did eventually rise to the top, but I had more company there than I would otherwise have had), and then to a top college:</p>

<p>1) I was a lot happier, academically and socially, in the strong high school program, than I would have been elsewhere. I had plenty of years of the big-fish-little-pond thing, and it is not as nice as a lot of people seem to think.</p>

<p>2) It didn’t seem to hurt me in college admissions, even though I had lower class rank and grades than I likely would have had elsewhere. I got into six of the US News Top 20.</p>

<p>3) Having a high school program that at least had <em>some</em> element of challenge, and an actual peer group, meant that I wasn’t <em>completely</em> blindsided (by the workload and the experience of not always being the superstar) when I got to that top college. The students who had been superstars at poor or mediocre high schools, in general, came in with more of an attitude and had a harder time adjusting, both academically and socially.</p>

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<p>momof95, we had the same worries about D1’s high school options. In 8th grade, it was clear that she wasn’t academically or socially happy at her school, which continued through 12th grade. So we took a look at our district’s most rigorous magnet. The school has the same kind of fearsome homework reputation. I’d heard a number of local parents saying they weren’t sending their kids to Rigorous HS because they wanted their kids to have a life. I didn’t want my D going there, either. But D decided that it was the school she wanted to go to. We talked about the pros and cons, and then we said that she understood what going to RHS entailed, and that it was her choice to make. I didn’t want to be blamed years later for “forcing” her to go to RHS, or for keeping her from going there.</p>

<p>She’s now a HS sophomore, but like jessiehl, she is now a lot happier, academically and socially, at RHS. Again like jessiehl, she is going to be incredibly well-prepared for the workload of college. 9th grade was a shock to her system, and she’s now improved a thousand-fold in being able to manage her workload. RHS grads who go off to tippy-top schools report back that their classes are easier, or maybe no harder than, what they had in high school. I suspect that she might take a hit in college admissions. On the other hand, worst case for us would be that she put in four unhappy years at her old school, hoping for a payoff when fat envelopes arrived–and then still didn’t get into the reach schools.</p>