<p>We did not have the situation of the second year package being different than the first -- either with the merit aid at school 1 or the need-based aid at school 2 (D transfered in Jan. of sophmore year). Does this really happen? How can you research it?</p>
<p>Actually, limiting the parents' financial support to a 4 year college process, if communicated to the child early in HS, can result in the child having time to get the APs that help to assure that they can graduate in 4 years.</p>
<p>Even the most "I hear nothing" kid can get the picture if it is driven home in terms like: "you have X amount of $$ from me (or us) and x years in which to graduate."</p>
<p>I know parents who argue that laying the financial realities on the kid keeps them (the kid) from a "happy" childhood, but I bet **Counting Down **would rather have known the reality ahead of time even if it meant she would have had to do something about it in HS.</p>
<p>my3girls: my S's college's website discusses these issues for both merit and aid. If you have a school in mind the finanacial aid department will clue you in if you call.</p>
<p>Well, I asked, regarding the FA. I suppose that there should be something in writing, and there may well be. But when I asked the FA officer about the award and the next 3 years she said that it would remain at least at that level unless our circumstances changed.</p>
<p>Regarding merit money: in all of the cases we have seen, it is stated in the award. Freshman year only, non-renewable, or guaranteed renewable with these restrictions (usually academic)</p>
<p>07DAD, this university had MANY AP scholars. It seems that course availability and maybe the culture had something to do with the "oh, almost no one graduates in 4 years" attitude. Some majors are getting pretty intense with regard to required coursework. Son is in one of those. Fortunately, son is currently at a school that guarantees that the student will graduate in 4 years if he/she maintains a full course load and has passing grades. It also means that he routinely has 3 lab courses at the same time. (He went in with 6 AP credits, but not all of them were useable)</p>
<p>I find myself repeating over & over to students and parents: "Run your numbers through an EFC calculator." So many have no clue what they are expected to pay, and even fewer seem to realize that the financial aid they are likely to be offered will be mostly in the form of loans & probably won't bridge the gap between EFC & cost. I wish guidance counselors would make it a priority to explain this at the beginning of high school. I am sure some do ... just not any I have come across.</p>
<p>I do think the guidance counselor has some responsibility here. The GC doesn't know the family's specific finances, but why not strongly urge the kid and the family to go to an online EFC calculator before starting the college search? Many schools send kids to online college search engines -- why not send them first to an online EFC calculator?</p>
<p>My daughter's HS had a "college financial aid" night given by our state's nonprofit financial assistance organization. The message was "there is money for college out there." Again, no mention of "calculate your EFC first." And absolutely no discussion about how some schools gap, and don't cover the entire EFC.</p>
<p>Of course, even given the message, many parents don't get it. They get the EFC number and refuse to believe it ("Oh, I'm sure we'll get more"). I witnessed one train wreck last year and am watching another one this year.</p>
<p>Some of us avoid the scale, too! We just don't want to know.****</p>
<p>mafool,
Re: the five years to graduate -- DS dropped one of his schools due to this. Heard first hand from a current student who had been poorly advised and was now going to take five years for his major. His OOS school will now cost as much as some of the good privates he declined.</p>
<p>Our GCs start the conversation about finances in late junior year. Way, way too late, IMO. They dance around it and encourage people to go run EFC numbers, but they also couch it in "but there's lots of money out there," so that's the message that parents and kids want to hear. They never talk about gapping.</p>
<p>Dad07,
My mom went back to work my soph year "to help pay for college." I'm the oldest of five, and I knew it would be hard. I focused on the schoolwork so I could get scholarships (that was more productive than working for $2.35/hr.). But after all those years of "succeed in school!" getting stuck sure felt cr***y.</p>
<p>At least I was able to string together loans and work, and was able to go independent. A $3500 loan and a 20/hr. week job around here doesn't begin to cover a state flagship.</p>
<p>I wish I had had better info about the four year thing. ZG's major has a lot of courses and she plans also to become certified to teach. I don't think it's doable in four years and I can't imagine how we could afford a fifth year.</p>
<p>I hear more & more stories of students taking 5-6 years to graduate from state schools. One neighbor tells me this is considered "normal." If so, the extra cost should definitely be considered when deciding on schools.</p>
<p>zm- I think that is becoming more and more common for teaching degrees with the increased requirement for mastery of an academic subject in addition to the teaching credentials and student teaching. My condolences.</p>
<p>Zoosermom, one of the things that intrigued me about Centre College (KY) is their promise that students will graduate in 4 years ... or the 5th one is free. I think there are some other schools that make similar pledges. I bet the advising is pretty awesome at those schools!!</p>
<p>The curriculum we were looking at was engineering. Students at one of the "name" schools routinely needed 5 years.</p>
<p>kelsmom,
Our smart, funny next door neighbor is at Centre and has nothing but wonderful things to say about it.</p>
<p>"zm- I think that is becoming more and more common for teaching degrees with the increased requirement for mastery of an academic subject in addition to the teaching credentials and student teaching. My condolences."</p>
<p>That's exactly the problem. She needs to (of course) have a degree in something else as well (environmental science and policy), so there isn't room. All kidding aside, she has very high GPA requirements in order to stay in the education department AND very tough classes. How come teachers and education students get no respect for how qualified they are?</p>
<p>Lots of theories for that one, mostly they don't hold water.</p>
<p>Maybe guidance counselors try to target the families who might actually qualify for aid with financial aid info, so the ones who don't qualify at all don't ever get the facts?</p>
<p>^^^But how could they possibly know? I think it would be very wrong for them to try to make those assessments.</p>
<p>I doubt very much that our GCs would have immediately included us in a list of families that would qualify for financial aid. But we did, just not at the state schools.</p>
<p>This thread is making my stomach hurt. Seriously. Where do I find a good EFC calculator, if I develop the courage to see the bad news for myself?</p>
<p>Does the fact that I'm mostly a stay-at-home mom factor into it? I mean, I could be working, but we've made the decision as a family for me to stay home while the kids are in middle and high school.</p>