<p>I'm in Tepper, not in KF (yet, since two year program, takes 3/4 students). </p>
<p>According to US News 2006, both tied at 5 spot. In what I want to study, KF is ranked higher.</p>
<p>So, in all honesty and without bias, which do you tihnk is the better choice?</p>
<p>Oh, UNC's social life > CMU, would cost (literally) the same to go to either, but CMU may be looked at a bit more highly and I'm already in Tepper.</p>
<p>Ross/Tepper/Stern/Haas/Wharton are on the tier 1 level.
McCombs and UNC are tier 2.</p>
<p>Think I'm biased?</p>
<p>UNC 2005: 44,325 avg starting salary
<a href="http://www.kenan-flagler.unc.edu/Programs/BSBA/careerServices/placement.cfm%5B/url%5D">http://www.kenan-flagler.unc.edu/Programs/BSBA/careerServices/placement.cfm</a></p>
<p>Wharton: </p>
<p>Avg Salary for 2005: 53,999 Range:26k-95k </p>
<p>AVg Salary for 2004: 52,267 Range:26k-85k </p>
<p>Stern: </p>
<p>2004 average: $52,110 </p>
<p><a href="http://www.nyu.edu/careerdevelopment/survey/2004/placement_part2.php%5B/url%5D">http://www.nyu.edu/careerdevelopment/survey/2004/placement_part2.php</a> </p>
<p>Tepper 2005: </p>
<p>Max: 80k </p>
<p>Min: 40k </p>
<p>Median: 55,000 </p>
<p>Mean: 53,449 </p>
<p><a href="http://www.studentaffairs.cmu.edu/career/employ/salary/ba.pdf%5B/url%5D">http://www.studentaffairs.cmu.edu/career/employ/salary/ba.pdf</a> </p>
<p>Ross: </p>
<p>2005 Median: 50,000 </p>
<p>2005 Mean: 50,175 </p>
<p>Range: 12,000-77,000 </p>
<p>Oh.. CMU is consistently ranked the best for job opps and the highest for employer/recruiter prestige.</p>
<p>How's the food at CMU, as bad as people say?</p>
<p>I hate schatz. I love the O and Asiana. Other ppl hate Asiana and love Bentabowl's. </p>
<p>Most people have 3-4 places they eat at and hate the rest. As long as you find your niche it is fine. </p>
<p>Not to mention your dine-x works off campus on Vocelli's and Subway. FInally, there are GREAT restaurants just five minutes down Forbes on Walnut I think and there are also hot dog stands outside Tepper and food trucks on the sorority street.</p>
<p>i read somewhere that the average high school gpa for students in tepper is around 3.64, is that true?</p>
<p>Probably, high school ACCEPTED gpa, right? They re-scale the GPA so its UNweighted and does not count stuff like P.E. or other fluff classes.</p>
<p>Starting salary, while relevant, does not tell you which school is better. the reason tepper's starting salary is higher is because there is less diversity of jobs they are looking for. management consulting, technical jobs, and a couple of ibankers here and there. </p>
<p>seriously, what does a 4.2 ranking for both tepper and unc-business really mean? go visit both and then ask yourself, 'which school do i see myself fitting in more?'</p>
<p>I'm fairly positive that you have heard, read, or was told that "MONEY, is not everything." and that "prestige" of a CMU degree is something NOT, next to gold. I wish to re-emphasize that a CMU degree or Money does not make lasting happiness or fulfullment. If you learn anything at University ABC, learn that the career that you go to school for, is ONLY the first career; That learning is always an ongoing project because the class after you WILL know more than you and do it for less money. </p>
<p>I understand how proud you are to be at CMU and how hard you have and are currently working to achieve your dream. It may be your dream but not everybody's dream. You will soon discover that a year out of school (high school, college, grad school) No one will care.</p>
<p>"Starting salary, while relevant, does not tell you which school is better. the reason tepper's starting salary is higher is because there is less diversity of jobs they are looking for. management consulting, technical jobs, and a couple of ibankers here and there. </p>
<p>Right so Wharton is not that great 'cause a lot of kids do Ibanking. The 4.2 ranking here is misleading (which I have proved by posting the real post-grad stats). I am in no way putting down UNC but instead assigning the TIER system which you can see is relatively sound just by the data. "Starting salary, while relevant, does not tell you which school is better" <---- ?????? Surely it is not everything but such huge differences in the avg salaries are much more meaningful than some 4.2 ranking (like you've said yourself, what does it mean)?</p>
<p>itstoomuch: The kid wanted to know which was "better" so I provided the facts. Did I say it was a "golden ticket"? And oh yes, a year out of college ppl will care where you went. Refer to Wharton/Harvard post-grads. </p>
<p>Grad school? Not as much. Business schools (MBA) care the most about work experience and what gets you that? Top Business Schools and a top degree. </p>
<p>CMU helps prepare you for a career and the degree is as marketable as other top B-Schools in the tier 1 (which I have listed). </p>
<p>"Money does not make lasting happiness or fulfullment"
I'm sorry if you got these implications from my post but I gave the op what he wanted which was cold facts. The whole POINT of going into business is basically to study money and how it works in the real world. Did I at all say Money is the only thing that will make the op happy?</p>
<p>You seem to have a very biased view towards my late posts and I hope you can shed whatever implications my posts have included and this current view that I seem to have ulterior motives in my posting.</p>
<p>The op wanted help and he got it. Hell, I've always said you can succeed no matter where you go (even Community colleges). My neighbor teaches at George Mason for econ and he is highly intelligent and worthy of teaching at Harvard Econ or even Wharton's econ. You can find great education anywhere (nobody limits you at top schools and definitely not at CMU).</p>
<p>Would you rather I have said "CMU IS SO MUCH BETTER THAN UNC GO THERE WHAT ARE U AN IDIOT?" like they have done in other college's msg boards? The op wanted UNBIASED opinion so I gave the facts and listed reasons on why Stern/Wharton/Tepper/Ross are on another playing field.</p>
<p>Don't take it personally. I am just trying to give a balanced view. I wouldn't want someone to take my counsel and then that counsel turns out wrong for any reason. </p>
<p>If you notice that many parents, not all, will never make a perdiction on someone's chances. We are in a global economy, knowledge is very valuable while at the same time that knowledge is the CHEAPEST of all commodies. Your $55,000 job can be a $0 job in an instant.</p>
<p>JIM(hippie)O.</p>
<p>"reasons on why Stern/Wharton/Tepper/Ross are on another playing field."
On another playing field based on what? UVa McIntire, a school you consider not to be on that playing field, has a stronger reputation on Wall Street.</p>
<p>Based on employer reputation and salaries. </p>
<p>As for your second assertion, that is false. McIntire for ugrad is not as prestigious on Wall Street as Stern/Wharton/Tepper/Ross. It is on par with UNC/McCombs.</p>
<p>Itstoomuch: I understand that but I disagree. Our lives can be ended in a split second as well. Would you recommend we all just sit in our homes? I have consistently maintained the point that statistics are an unbiased view on how reputable a college is and how LIKELY it is to help a student out with respect to the future.</p>
<p>It is like a chances game where going to a top university gives you the most "rolls". I hate repeating myself but like I said, you can go to a CC and succeed in the business world. We all know stories about Ivy grads who are now jobless, blah blah blah etc. </p>
<p>I have never taken anything personal but I'm afraid you are starting to think I am "biased" in my postings when this is not true. I give what the posters want, whether it be unbiased data such as avg salaries/employer prestige, etc or biased data concerning my own experiences at Carnegie Mellon. </p>
<p>If you go through my posts you'll find that I post more facts than opinion and whenever I do list opinion I say so. This is how I've resolved many arguments peacefully such as with the Stern vs. Tepper thread (you can find on the 2-3rd page) or the CMU vs Tufts thread (don't know where that is). </p>
<p>Hopefully we can agree that at least top B-Schools like Wharton/Tepper/Stern/Ross merely show you the door (to use a cheesy Matrix line :)) and it is YOU who has to walk through it. However, they do show you TOP doors and the best doors available as well as provide you with the means to get to such doors. I hope that analogy worked as well as I think it did seconds before I go out to a party.</p>
<p>"As for your second assertion, that is false. McIntire for ugrad is not as prestigious on Wall Street as Stern/Wharton/Tepper/Ross. It is on par with UNC/McCombs."</p>
<p>AA: This is one time where I will point out that you don't have any facts. Call up Lehman Brothers. Call up any investment bank. McIntire has a much larger presence on Wall Street than Carnegie Mellon/Tepper. Go look on vault.com if you don't believe me. My dad has many friends in NYC and they have all said that UVa(McIntire) grads have a very large/strong/respected presence on Wall Street. Unlike Carnegie Mellon, it is on the recruiting core schools list for most the top i-banks/MC firms along with the Ivys, MIT/Stanford, and Mich.</p>
<p>Also, here's a quote from another CC'r: "UVa's McIntire School of Commerce alone sent more than 71 kids to various investment banks (not counting consulting firms here) out of less than 220 finance majors."</p>
<p>And that's only counting McIntire students. The A&S school sends an equal number of students.</p>
<ol>
<li>Facts = avg salaries. # of grads does not mean actual prestige. Many CMU grads, as previously stated, choose to do "other" technical things. This does not mean they are not requested or as marketable as Stern/Wharton/Ross. I hope you can distinguish "MOST ibankers" from "prestige".<br></li>
</ol>
<p>Tepper: 55k median</p>
<p>UVA McIntire: "The average annual base salary for the undergraduate Class of 2004 is $47328; the. median annual base salary is $47000"
Do not look at the OVERALL which include bonuses (while the Tepper link does not include bonuses). <a href="http://www.google.com/u/McIntire?q=average+salary&domains=commerce.virginia.edu&sitesearch=commerce.virginia.edu%5B/url%5D">http://www.google.com/u/McIntire?q=average+salary&domains=commerce.virginia.edu&sitesearch=commerce.virginia.edu</a>
<a href="http://www.commerce.virginia.edu/career_services/%5B/url%5D">www.commerce.virginia.edu/career_services/</a> Employers/Placement%20report/Reports/Placement<em>Report</em>2004.pdf</p>
<p>Of course, money is not everything but there is a tier system and you can see that the 50+ks of Tepper/Stern/Ross/Wharton are on a different field from the high 40ks of UNC/McIntire/McCombs.</p>
<p>Final points:
1. Quantity doesn't always measure "prestige".
2. The "mind set" of Tepper grads, much like MIT Sloan grads, are not always geared towards Ibanking.
3. CMU is consistently ranked the best at hooking its students up with whatever jobs they want whether it be technical or not. This is another support of Tepper's "prestige" whether or not its students want Ibanking or not.
4. I hope the links have proved that McCombs/McIntire/UNC are great B-Schools and grant amazing opportunities but are of a different field than the others.</p>
<p>AA: I might attend Tepper next year, and its definately a great school. But to say that McIntire is a step down from Tepper is absurd. You keep mentioning salaries and that is your only piece of evidence. And clearly it is not foolproof, as your system of "prestiguous ug biz-schools" puts Tepper over Wharton. If McIntire chose to select only 50-80 kids rather than 300, it would be able to jack up its average salary as well. By giving opportunity to more undergrads, McIntire is sacrificing its average salary value because it is known that many companies will only take a certain number of kids from one school, regardless of how small or large it is. But McIntire is public and has the resources to allow more students in, and thats what it does. That doesn't make McIntire any less prestigious because a majority of kids are still landing top jobs. Also, Tepper has focused its education on fields where there is more money. Finance and IT. McIntire takes a little more wholistic approach, and has strong marketing and is known for its specialty in management training. </p>
<p>I looked at the career website for Tepper/IS students. There are quite a few kids who take low-growth jobs as well as back-office jobs at i-banks. While their starting salaries might be higher, I'm curious to see what average salaries for both school's graduates are 5-10 years down the line.</p>
<p>I don't believe it is absurd at all. What evidence have you brought (no offense) besides your own experiences?</p>
<p>I AM NOT PUTTING Tepper over Wharton. I hope you realize how absurd that is. I am only putting those B schools over the McCombs/McIntire list. </p>
<p>"Also, Tepper has focused its education on fields where there is more money. Finance and IT. McIntire takes a little more wholistic approach, and has strong marketing and is known for its specialty in management training. "</p>
<p>We agree here so I see no problem? How do we measure prestige based on that? </p>
<p>"I looked at the career website for Tepper/IS students. There are quite a few kids who take low-growth jobs as well as back-office jobs at i-banks. While their starting salaries might be higher, I'm curious to see what average salaries for both school's graduates are 5-10 years down the line."</p>
<p>That all depends on the student. See, once you get the work experience, you can go to MBA or whatever else (Law school?)</p>
<p>The first job is the most important as nobody cares about what college you went to when you are in your 30s and at your 3-5th job. That's why I've focused on the avg starting salaries. You can't deny the discrepancy between Stern/Wharton/Tepper/Ross vs the rest.</p>
<p>Starting salary doesn't mean much at all. Let's take two undergrad schools. Everyone for University A gets a job at McDonald's. Everyone at University B goes on to med school.</p>
<p>First Year Income- A: $15k, B: - $50k (Whatever cost of med school is)
From the statistic shown above, it seems as if University A is the better school. But it's not. Statistics lie. 15-20 years down the line look at lifetime earnings.</p>
<p>Your analogy does not work in this case as it measures extremes of long term goals vs short term goals. Premed grads are very different from Business grads.</p>
<p>I don't get how you can PM me for advice in private and then turn around and criticize my logic in public :(</p>
<p>Like I said in the post above yours, 15-20 years when talking B-Schools is not very relevant at all. No one cares what college you went to whether it be Harvard or a CC if you are at your 5th job and have gotten your MBA or Law Degree. The FIRST job is what Top B-Schools give you so I have given you post-grad data for such.</p>
<p>Small differences in avg salary such as Stern's 52k is not very meaningful at all. But clearly a 53-55ks base salary vs the high 40ks of Unc/McIntire/McCombs is quite the defining line for a "Tier" system.</p>