<p>jazzymom, you missed the point. We are not just talking students with only high standardized scores. We are talking about students with not only high scores, but also highest GPA is school history, many regional and state awards and prizes and even national awards and prizes, real reasearch experiences. Well, being waitlisted by Wash U can now be a real honor. As Wash U figured, these student do not have high tendency to go Wash U anyway. Why not protect the yield? The only problem, wash u will never get into top 3, if it have this kind of admission policy.</p>
<p>wonder, you're still talking statistics.</p>
<p>Highest GPA ever, and a cure for cancer means nothing if you are the kind of kid who only dabbles in ecs to look good on applications, and never passionately contributes anything to the school environment.</p>
<p>wonder: </p>
<p>I think you are missing my point. Do you really think that every single one of the super stellar applicants you describe should be, must be, admitted by washu? You wouldn't say that about these applicants and HYP or MIT, but for washu, they * must* be admitted or something is amiss. I disagree. </p>
<p>Washu, like any university, is within its rights to pick and choose among many stellar candidates based on the needs of its institution. If they get upteen thousand applicants with incredible scores and research experience and so on all applying for limited spots in the pre-med programs and the engineering programs, then they have to say no to someone. They have to leave some spaces for the art students, the architecture students, the foreign language students, the humanities and latin american studies students and the myriad other numbers of students who apply with great stats but perhaps not national awards since their ECs and areas of interest don't lend themselves to that kind of experience. It's called holistic admissions. Looking at the whole candidate and what he or she might offer to the campus and finding a balance in admissions for all the departments and programs of the university.</p>
<p>So the adcom at washu has a difficult task or deciding between thousands of highly qualified candidates, some of whom really have no interest in attending washu but applied anyway for whatever reason. Or many who applied but will only go if they are offerred one of the full-ride type scholarships. I don't know how or why they draw the lines they do and say yes to some and WL or no to others. I think it makes sense if they try to make some determination about how much an applicant really wants to attend washu or is likely to attend washu when they make their decision. They want students who want to be there.</p>
<p>It appears that Wash U and other top schools such as MIT, Harvard, Stanford and Yale are mutually exlusive. Our school has a couple accepted by wash u but not the other schools mentioned above. A couple students accepted by the other schools are either rejected or waitlisted by Wash U. Wash u is indeed special.</p>
<p>I just got my waitlist letter today, and having read through this entire thread, I've got a couple things to say.</p>
<p>I could definitely be wrong, but it seems to me that the large group of posters on this thread are parents. As a student, I have a different perspective, and it's fairly demoralizing knowing that I essentially was rejected by a school that was my #2 choice (#1 realistically, I applied to Georgetown as well) out of only 5 that I applied to. I visited all 5 of the schools I applied to, demonstrated more than enough interest in WashU by visiting early, replying early, etc... yet I seem to be shuffled into the same group of emotion-less stats-only kids who chose WashU as a backup. WashU was clearly not a backup for me, but why should I be subjected to the same exact waitlist as someone who applied to 15 schools and never thought they'd go to WashU? WashU admissions needs a better way to gauge the interest of applicants, instead of ending up with this problem where their solution is an exborant number of waitlists.</p>
<p>I read on these forums how kids are only about the grades, have absolutely no desire, no personality, and just applied for the heck of it. It makes me sick to think that my genuine interest was brushed aside when I know that I DEFINITELY would fit in at WashU. This entire admissions process, I'm tired of being typecast as having this blank slate that I need to fill out perfectly...in order to merely portray a genuine success-oriented personality that isn't even guaranteed to be considered by the admissions officers. How else can I possibly prove to these people that I truly know I'd take advantage of all the possibilities there in order to succeed? Genuine desire can't possibly be written down on paper, yet that's what admissions is all about these days. </p>
<p>It's hard enough balancing work, school, and admissions files for a half of a semester. And to see 12 years of hard work boil down to me being typecast as just another "high achieving applicant"? It's ********. I've got the grades. I've got the SAT scores. I've got the extracurriculars. So why should an admin have the opportunity to deny me based on something they have no idea about? Admissions needs WAY more personal alumni interviews for applicants. Only through that will they get a truly accurate picture of the desire of a teen, and even then, it's still not quite enough.</p>
<p>I know I'll succeed at whatever college I go to, and ultimately it's not about the specific institution. It just pains me to see the superior resources of top institutions be snatched from my fingertips just because someone decided for themselves that I didn't fit in. I don't have a solution besides more interviews, but that still doesn't deny the fact that the entirety of undergraduate admissions is inherently flawed.</p>
<p>^I agree with that 100%.</p>
<p>Most schools don't put much weight on alumni interviews though, bluelin.</p>
<p>Also, won't all of the schools you applied to have admissions workers who decide for themselves if you fit or not? That's the whole point of the admissions process, and you shouldn't assume that WashU waitlists people only because they are "high achieving applicants" who "applied just for the heck of it." </p>
<p>I'm sure a majority of WashU applicants do have a desire to go there but unfortunately, there are just not enough freshmen slots. Sure, a lot of kids do apply to WashU as a "safety" or a "whatever" school, but since you did show interest in WashU, obviously you were not waitlisted because you were someone they assumed would not matriculate.</p>
<p>Please don't merely think everyone waitlisted was someone WashU believed was at the top of the applicant pool. There are a variety of other possible reasons for why you were waitlisted, and I'm sorry you were, but please don't blame it on the idea the admins thought that you were just a stereotypical "high-acheiver."</p>
<p>I'm sorry if this sounds harsh, but lots of people who DID have WashU as a first choice had the grades, scores, and ECs to be competitive for admission and <em>didn't</em> get in.</p>
<p>I'm not saying just WashU does it. Every school does. To me, it's a universal problem.</p>
<p>Personally, I take that second to last paragraph as a shot. I wouldn't post something as long as I did if I didn't believe what it said, and I'm pretty sure I wasn't waitlisted because of something else. Whether you think so or not, I know I'm at the top of the applicant pool. I could reel off all my stats for you right now, but like I said before, that's not what I'm trying to prove.</p>
<p>The main point was that as someone with all the right paper qualifications, why should my desire and personality be typecast? It's not out of the question at all to blame it on the fact that there's very few ways to separate yourself from the rest of the country. All in all, knowing that I AM in the same waitlist pool as other less-enthused applicants isn't exactly a good reward for years of hard work.</p>
<p>"I'm sorry if this sounds harsh, but lots of people who DID have WashU as a first choice had the grades, scores, and ECs to be competitive for admission and <em>didn't</em> get in."</p>
<p>I definitely definitely definitely realize that. But that's the inherent problem. The U.S. needs better universities to accomodate those who got shoved out because of overcrowding. The only problem is, there's a good chance I won't get into Georgetown or any other top school either, so If I fit into that niche you described, then where does that leave me?</p>
<p>The only thing I'm blaming WashU for specifically is that their waitlist is too broad and doesn't give a clear picture of where I stand with top schools.</p>
<p>And I'm saying that "supposedly" the reason WashU waitlists those at the top of the pool is because the school fears those kids won't matriculate there. Since you 'did' visit the school and 'did' show a lot of interest in other ways, I would think they would believe you 'would' matriculate. As you've already seen in the decisions board, some people who did have high stats did get accepted so that's why I said there's probably another reason for your waitlist decision.</p>
<p>You're entitled to think I don't have the stats, but I do. That's why I'm so surprised and annoyed. I can't figure out why else they'd waitlist me.</p>
<p>I think I fit in with the class that you mentioned above. Those with desire and stats who still didn't get in. I'd like to think that I was only waitlisted because there's simply not enough room for those types of applicants, but I'm mainly saying that that's what's wrong with college admissions. Too many kids, and those who still meet the standards are shoved out of most top-ranked schools completely.</p>
<p>I didn't say you didn't have the stats >< </p>
<p>Did you apply for financial aid? Are you in a state (or city, or school) that has lots of kids applying to WashU? Or did you ever think that maybe they were down to the last slot and were comparing you to someone with fairly equal stats (and all other parts of the app) and could not decide and so they flipped a coin and you just happened to be the unlucky one who got the waitlist decision?</p>
<p>It sucks to be waitlisted, but you just have to have hope for Georgetown now because being mad at WashU won't help you get into your other schools.</p>
<p>Sry, took your reply the wrong way...my bad</p>
<p>Yea, I mean, that all makes sense. And I'm fine with not going there, I'm not gonna dwell on it past this. I'm basically just mad because I know I'm good enough, but all these other factors (location, finances, overcrowding) are keeping me out. It's my first return for my entire school career up to this point, and it's not very rewarding.</p>
<p>Thanks for the discussion, it makes it all a little easier to come to grips with (although I still believe all the stuff I said about how this whole process is flawed)</p>
<p>No problem, and I'm sorry again that you were waitlisted :( it especially hurts when you're someone who really really wants to attend, but yeah, there are just too many good kids out there for too few spots in the top schools, but that's like life... job hunting will be much the same way. Good luck with Georgetown!</p>
<p>bluelin3r, I understand your frustration and agree with you that it's a real shame that there is not enough room in the top US schools for all the top students. And, in addition to the the US students, there are also large numbers of qualified international students vying for those same spots in the top US schools. That puts lots of qualified people like you in a tough spot and accounts for the increased quality of entering classes in tier 2 and 3 schools.</p>
<p>I believe that you are qualified for WashU and that you truly want to attend. I also agree that it feels unfair that WashU's waitlist is filled with people who are not as interested as you in actually attending. If you don't get accepted to Georgetown and still want to attend WashU, you really should make an effort to stand out from others on the large waitlist. Let them know how serious you are about the school. Send letters to key adcom personnel, ask your guidance counselors if they would speak to WashU on your behalf, send any new grades or accomplishments...etc.</p>
<p>bluelin3r - You make some very good and valid points. It is unfortunate and not fair that the admission process is faulty to applicants like yourself. Not as an excuse, but with 22,000 plus applications and a limited staff - some questionable decisions are made. This may well have occured in your case.</p>
<p>If your stats, ECs etc are what you say they are and you are still interested in WashU - I would recomend that either you or your GC contact the admissions officer assigned to your area. Approach them on the basis of what else can I do to improve my chances on the waitlist. Point out to them how you would/could contribute to campus life at WashU. Remember for WashU an important part of the process is building a community. I have a feeling that they will be taking people off the waitlist this year.</p>
<p>Bluelin3r--In an ideal world, everyone would get accepted to their first-choice colleges. But, I imagine, year after year thousands of hearts are broken when that fails to happen. ... You are undoubtedly well-qualified to attend Wash U., and would most likely have been an asset to the campus community. Unfortunately, admission's officers are only human, and when confronted with many thousands of applications for a very small freshman class, ruthless and sometimes seemingly inexplicable cutting occurs. If only they had a crystal ball to accurately foretell who would fit in and thrive at WashU, who would end up making a real contribution to campus life, and who would excel academically! </p>
<p>Don't forget--private schools like WashU are also big business. They're looking for top kids, but at the same time, they want every kind of diversity imaginable to create a well-rounded, interesting campus. It's possible your demographics, for whatever reason, did not quite fit what they needed at the time selections were made--gender, geographic location, academic interests, ethnicity, etc. (Read Jazzymom's post--#100.) ...</p>
<p>You objected to being shuffled into "the same group of emotion-less stats-only kids who chose WashU as a backup." I don't blame you for that, but I assure you there are plenty of passionate, well-rounded, brilliant students who loved WashU as much as you do, but were also waitlisted or, perhaps, even rejected. I think you're in fantastic company. ... </p>
<p>Finally, if WashU is truly your first choice, when your anger finally abates, go to bat for yourself with vigor and enthusiasm. Put your name in front of them in any way you can. Keep expressing an interest. Get to know your admission's officer on a first-name basis. (OK, maybe not that one!) Let them know again how interested you are, and why. Then, if you ultimately DO get into WashU, show them over the next four years how awesome you are. And best of luck to you!</p>
<p>I don't know about everyone else, and I certainly don't feel my daughter was entitiled to Wash U. admission. All I know is that it was her dream school. Her stats. put her clearly in the middle mid-50%. She was definitely not one of the overqualified. It was truly a fantastic "fit" for her. She had numerous reasons why the school was a great match. Knowing that the level of interest was important, she visited twice from a distance, went to any information session offered, interviewed, and applied for the numerous scholarships (all with separate applications), and applied early (but not ED). It was in no way a safety or a back-up. WE forced her to apply to other schools, knowing the reputation of Wash U. She was admitted everywhere (except WUSL), including one school we never thought she had the chance. But her heart is not anywhere else. And to be honest, none of the other schools provide as good a match with her interests!</p>
<p>Like nearly everyone else, she was waitlisted. I don't know how to advise her. Based on many more years of life's experience, I want to say move on. But she cannot. She doesn't know if she has even a slight chance, or if, like the lottery, she would be throwing her dreams away, for no chance at all. Just like the lottery, we know that she has NO chance if she does not include her name on the waitlist. But we don't know how to steer her heart in another direction when there still is a glimmer of hope. A simply deny would have been so much clearer of course. </p>
<p>But I don't know if it is a soft deny, or if there is any chance for her. The shear number of students on the waitlist is intimidating! That's our biggest gripe. It truly seems like a lottery to me, and with most lotteries, I believe it is a waste of your time, effort, dollars, and worst of all hope.</p>
<p>it just occurred to me that maybe i'm just kidding myself about having the right stats, etc...perhaps the optimism has gotten to me</p>
<p>is 2200 SAT, 3.95 GPA unweighted, 3rd in class, 3 yrs hockey, NHS, bowling, deep church committment, and 2+ years job as admin at an engineering firm considered not good? is that worth me actually calling up the adcoms at WashU?</p>
<p>Brutal honesty would be greatly appreciated</p>
<p>didn't see that last post. maybe i'm not entitled to admission... all in all it's not a huge deal heartbreaker for me. i'm still debating on saving my money for grad school anyway.</p>
<p>it was my top choice, for sure, but i'm totally fine with going somewhere else. hope that doesn't dilute any of my previous argument.</p>