<p>so are you calilng my best friend's brother a terrorist?</p>
<p>becuase he's over there right now serving in the marines.</p>
<p>Willingly serving a terrorist is terrorism. I applaud the 5,500 that have deserted and fled to Canada.</p>
<p>We don't care what you do to your own people, as long as you're giving us oil. When that stops, look out because we're comin for ya!</p>
<p>PS I don't exactly support Alvie's views, and neither do most liberals. </p>
<p>I assume he is Canadian or European.</p>
<p>Give us oil: Yep, so we're best buds!</p>
<p>uh that really isn't the case so much n e more, adn definitely WON'T be the case for long...and hey you're right... i don't liek Saudi Arabia, I don't liek the fact that we're so dependent on them. I don't liek that we pay them for their oil. I want us to stop. Becuase their country is so rich, there isn't as much thirst in the population for democracy and whatnot. Right now their government has been somehwat cooperative in terms of helpilng us find and capture terrorists...Similar to how our relationship is with Pakistan (even though they don't have that great of a rap either) </p>
<p>a coutnry i believe we shoudl support mroe and ally with more with is India. They are sort of a quiet ally, because they can relate to all the stuff our country is dealing with right now. Islamic extremists have attempted to wipe out their entire culture, religion, and history. </p>
<p>andrew d. do you drive? where do you think is a better place to get oil? becuase i bet you don't agree with the whole Alaska drilling etc... are you willing to stop driving your car? until you are, why complain so much about the fact that we need it and get it from bad places...because it's the basis of every single economy in the world and without it, we'd be nothing....but hoepfully one day we'll figure out a way to not be so dependent on it cuz obviously oil will eventually run out.</p>
<p>Today, none of us expect our soldiers to fight a war on our own territory. The immediate threat is not conflict between the world's most powerful nations.</p>
<p>And why? Because we all have too much to lose. Because technology, communication, trade and travel are bringing us ever closer together. Because in the last 50 years, countries like yours and mine have tripled their growth and standard of living. Because even those powers like Russia or China or India can see the horizon, the future wealth, clearly and know they are on a steady road toward it. And because all nations that are free value that freedom, will defend it absolutely, but have no wish to trample on the freedom of others.</p>
<p>We are bound together as never before. And this coming together provides us with unprecedented opportunity but also makes us uniquely vulnerable.</p>
<p>And the threat comes because in another part of our globe there is shadow and darkness, where not all the world is free, where many millions suffer under brutal dictatorship, where a third of our planet lives in a poverty beyond anything even the poorest in our societies can imagine, and where a fanatical strain of religious extremism has arisen, that is a mutation of the true and peaceful faith of Islam.</p>
<p>And because in the combination of these afflictions a new and deadly virus has emerged. The virus is terrorism whose intent to inflict destruction is unconstrained by human feeling and whose capacity to inflict it is enlarged by technology.</p>
<p>This is a battle that can't be fought or won only by armies. We are so much more powerful in all conventional ways than the terrorists, yet even in all our might, we are taught humility.</p>
<p>In the end, it is not our power alone that will defeat this evil. Our ultimate weapon is not our guns, but our beliefs.</p>
<p>There is a myth that though we love freedom, others don't; that our attachment to freedom is a product of our culture; that freedom, democracy, human rights, the rule of law are American values, or Western values; that Afghan women were content under the lash of the Taliban; that Saddam was somehow beloved by his people; that Milosevic was Serbia's savior.</p>
<p>Members of Congress, ours are not Western values, they are the universal values of the human spirit. And anywhere...</p>
<p>Anywhere, anytime ordinary people are given the chance to choose, the choice is the same: freedom, not tyranny; democracy, not dictatorship; the rule of law, not the rule of the secret police.</p>
<p>The spread of freedom is the best security for the free. It is our last line of defense and our first line of attack. And just as the terrorist seeks to divide humanity in hate, so we have to unify it around an idea. And that idea is liberty.</p>
<p>We must find the strength to fight for this idea and the compassion to make it universal.</p>
<p>Abraham Lincoln said, "Those that deny freedom to others deserve it not for themselves." ~ Tony Blair</p>
<p>
[quote]
andrew d. do you drive? where do you think is a better place to get oil?
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Automobile don't use oil because they don't have anything else. They use oil because it's profitable for oil companies.</p>
<p>BTW I drive an Insight.</p>
<p>I'm not saying these people don't love or want freedom. It just has to come from within, or else it will be unsuccessful and unpopular. Another thing that is universal is a desire to not be told what to do and think. If Iraq is going to become a TRUE democracy, the revolution has to come from within.</p>
<p>they tried once in 1991 (after Kuwait's liberation) and we abandoned them...a whole bunch of people died and it didn't work.</p>
<p>This isn't fantasy, it is 21st-century reality, and it confronts us now.</p>
<p>Can we be sure that terrorism and weapons of mass destruction will join together? Let us say one thing: If we are wrong, we will have destroyed a threat that at its least is responsible for inhuman carnage and suffering. That is something I am confident history will forgive.</p>
<p>But if our critics are wrong, if we are right, as I believe with every fiber of instinct and conviction I have that we are, and we do not act, then we will have hesitated in the face of this menace when we should have given leadership. That is something history will not forgive.</p>
<p>But precisely because the threat is new, it isn't obvious. It turns upside-down our concepts of how we should act and when, and it crosses the frontiers of many nations. So just as it redefines our notions of security, so it must refine our notions of diplomacy.</p>
<p>There is no more dangerous theory in international politics than that we need to balance the power of America with other competitive powers; different poles around which nations gather.</p>
<p>Such a theory may have made sense in 19th-century Europe. It was perforce the position in the Cold War.</p>
<p>Today, it is an anachronism to be discarded like traditional theories of security. And it is dangerous because it is not rivalry but partnership we need; a common will and a shared purpose in the face of a common threat.</p>
<p>And I believe any alliance must start with America and Europe. If Europe and America are together, the others will work with us. If we split, the rest will play around, play us off and nothing but mischief will be the result of it.</p>
<p>You may think after recent disagreements it can't be done, but the debate in Europe is open. Iraq showed that when, never forget, many European nations supported our action.</p>
<p>And it shows it still when those that didn't agreed Resolution 1483 in the United Nations for Iraq's reconstruction.</p>
<p>Today, German soldiers lead in Afghanistan, French soldiers lead in the Congo where they stand between peace and a return to genocide.</p>
<p>So we should not minimize the differences, but we should not let them confound us either. ~ Tony Blair</p>
<p>Wow, Tony Blair beleives that he did the right thing. What a surprise.</p>
<p>And then reflect on this: How hollow would the charges of American imperialism be when these failed countries are and are seen to be transformed from states of terror to nations of prosperity, from governments of dictatorship to examples of democracy, from sources of instability to beacons of calm.</p>
<p>And how risible would be the claims that these were wars on Muslims if the world could see these Muslim nations still Muslim, but with some hope for the future, not shackled by brutal regimes whose principal victims were the very Muslims they pretended to protect?</p>
<p>It would be the most richly observed advertisement for the values of freedom we can imagine. When we removed the Taliban and Saddam Hussein, this was not imperialism. For these oppressed people, it was their liberation.</p>
<p>And why can the terrorists even mount an argument in the Muslim world that it isn't?</p>
<p>Because there is one cause terrorism rides upon, a cause they have no belief in but can manipulate. I want to be very plain: This terrorism will not be defeated without peace in the Middle East between Israel and Palestine.</p>
<p>Here it is that the poison is incubated. Here it is that the extremist is able to confuse in the mind of a frighteningly large number of people the case for a Palestinian state and the destruction of Israel, and to translate this moreover into a battle between East and West, Muslim, Jew and Christian.</p>
<p>May this never compromise the security of the state of Israel.</p>
<p>The state of Israel should be recognized by the entire Arab world, and the vile propaganda used to indoctrinate children, not just against Israel but against Jews, must cease.</p>
<p>You cannot teach people hate and then ask them to practice peace. But neither can you teach people peace except by according them dignity and granting them hope.</p>
<p>Innocent Israelis suffer. So do innocent Palestinians.</p>
<p>The ending of Saddam's regime in Iraq must be the starting point of a new dispensation for the Middle East: Iraq, free and stable; Iran and Syria, who give succor to the rejectionist men of violence, made to realize that the world will no longer countenance it, that the hand of friendship can only be offered them if they resile completely from this malice, but that if they do, that hand will be there for them and their people; the whole of region helped toward democracy. And to symbolize it all, the creation of an independent, viable and democratic Palestinian state side by side with the state of Israel.</p>
<p>What the president is doing in the Middle East is tough but right. ~ Tony Blair </p>
<p>i luv this guy...not his social policies or economic views...but hsi foreign policy. he inspires me because he's not afraid to go against the crowd to do what he feels in his heart is the right thing.</p>
<p>Wow. No wonder our country is so split. Pixie how can you even argue with these people who feel that Iraq was better off under Saddam Hussein who tortured and killed hundreds of thousands of his own people. "The only terrorists in Iraq is the U.S PERIOD." Haha wow. </p>
<p>You know what i fear. For 50 years, the US has actively been involved in the world. If there ever is a Democratic backlash in this country, the government is going to take us into a whole new period of isolationism. "Don't fix problems abroad until you have fixed them at home" is NOT a good argument.</p>
<p>"This is ********. North Korea are not supporting terrorists? Where you got the notion that DPRK = terrorists? They are actually anti-imperialist, and they have helped poor african nations with arms..."</p>
<p>i have disagreed with almost every liberal i've posted with on this board...but i still have respect for their views. </p>
<p>alvie, i'm not gonna waste my time trying to change ur mind or anything i know i wont...and u probably don't care what i think...buti 'm still gonna say it</p>
<p>you're an absolute idiot. you're an embarassment to whatever country you hail from. you don't deserve respect. and i wish you moved to North Korea, Iran, Syria, or Saudi Arabia and partied with commies and/or terrorists all you want.</p>
<p>You know what? We don't have to respect each other's beliefs. I don't respect your beliefs. If the country is so fundamentally divided, if we see things so differently, we can't work together politically. Right now, its majority rules, and the majority in Congress is Republican.</p>
<p>
[QUOTE]
"This is ********. North Korea are not supporting terrorists? Where you got the notion that DPRK = terrorists? They are actually anti-imperialist, and they have helped poor african nations with arms..."</p>
<p>i have disagreed with almost every liberal i've posted with on this board...but i still have respect for their views.</p>
<p>alvie, i'm not gonna waste my time trying to change ur mind or anything i know i wont...and u probably don't care what i think...buti 'm still gonna say it</p>
<p>you're an absolute idiot. you're an embarassment to whatever country you hail from. you don't deserve respect. and i wish you moved to North Korea, Iran, Syria, or Saudi Arabia and partied with commies and/or terrorists all you want.
[/QUOTE]
</p>
<p>Wow you really convinced me, thank you George Dubya Bu$h.</p>
<p>hmm i wasn't trying to convince you anything...just telling you like it is.
not my fault you present yourself as a blatantly ignorant human being not worth arguing with. yet i'm not gonna call you evil for wishing more 9/11s on this country...maybe you'e just ben misguided all your life and taught that America is this devil nation that has actually done the wrong stuff..and everybody in the world is simply a victim. </p>
<p>you might be brainwashed and i guess ic an't blame YOU for it ya know?</p>
<p>
[QUOTE]
hmm i wasn't trying to convince you anything...just telling you like it is.
not my fault you present yourself as a blatantly ignorant human being not worth arguing with. yet i'm not gonna call you evil for wishing more 9/11s on this country...maybe you'e just ben misguided all your life and taught that America is this devil nation that has actually done the wrong stuff..and everybody in the world is simply a victim.</p>
<p>you might be brainwashed and i guess ic an't blame YOU for it ya know?
[/QUOTE]
</p>
<p>LMFAO! you never fail to amuse me. I have learned today that trying to argue with dumb Amerikkkans is like talking to a wall. </p>
<p>**** it. I'm not going to continue this ****, I am tired of arguing with pre-pubescent bourgeois white hicks about politics. </p>
<p>I will start keeping my beliefs to myself or sugarcoat them in front of politically ignorant people or dangerous people, because there isn't much Tolerance in the Western world. I guess you have a bit of amnesia when it comes to "Western tolerance"s history. Huey Newton ring a bell? August Spies? The Rosenburg's? Martin Luther King? Some ****in' tolerance!</p>
<p>Hating yankees, the Japanese, and Western Europeans is progressive because hatred makes us fight better and eliminates all guilt that comes with killing an imperialist. In Korea, in Vietnam, in WWII, in post-WWI intervention, bay of pigs, and other proletarian anti-imperialist wars we have had to fight the same enemies every time. Do you really think its a ****ing coincidence? We've been waiting for the western "working class" to overthrow their bosses for 70 years, and IT NEVER HAPPENED. NEVER WILL until we totally isolate these imperialist cesspools and deprive them of the profits created in third-world countries, until then hoping for the Western "saviours" to overthrow their governments is a pipedream.</p>
<p>then why are you on a WESTERN site relating to AMERICAN colleges and using a WESTERN product: the internet. you hypocrite. quit enjoying the delights of our <em>imperialistic</em> societies. </p>
<p>go get a freakin life.</p>
<p>and check where the articles of clothing you are wearing are made, your shoes, are they made in any 3rd world country? </p>
<p>and for your info ...i'm not a white hick. but if i had to pick being a trailer redneck over a culture-less, classless and cowardly fool like you, then i'd do so. Even "trailer-trash" people have tons more class than you do. Definitely more character. </p>
<p>i bet if invading troops from another country invaded wherever you are, you'd just run away and scream and cry and know no way of defending yourself or fighting for something you believe in. </p>
<p>Americans have more class than you. ;-) </p>
<p>period.</p>
<p>Is the fact that Lenin wore a suit make him a hypocrite?</p>
<p>why didn't u make ur screename mr. lenin jr.</p>
<p>that would've been more appropriate</p>