The Stand Partner

College Majors Music Major
1

<p>Hello,</p>

<p>I have been a "lurker" on this site for a few months now, and have found much of the information interesting and useful. I've yet to find a thread, however, that addresses a problem facing my middle child, a performance major (strings) at a LAC. Perhaps some of the more experienced student musicians and/or parents can offer some wisdom as to how to deal with an uncomfortable situation. </p>

<p>S concluded a reasonably successful freshman fall semester. His one lament concerns his stand partner (SP). This individual is someone he knew pre-college, and, to be honest, his heart sank a bit when he heard that they would both be attending the same college. The SP is a proficient musician, but is rather overbearing. In fact, the SP has pretty much aliented the rest of the section and has had some run-ins with his/her assigned chamber quartet (which, thankfully, S is not a part of).</p>

<p>S, because he has known this person, has been put in the position of either defending the SP or running interference to defuse some tense situations. Because S and his SP perform at about the same level, there is a strong likelihood they will be stand partners for the next few years, and he is definitely not looking forward to that. Yet he did not want to complain about another student to the studio teacher or orchestra director, especially during his first semester. </p>

<p>What S did do, however, was to take a rather circumspect approach and ask his studio teacher (someone who has extensive performance experience) about her experiences with stand partners. The teacher explained that she's found that abrasive behavior oft times stems from a lack of confidence or comfort in one's abilities. Although no names or specific incidents were mentioned, it was obvious to S that the teacher knew exactly to whom he was referring, so apparently the bad behavior has not gone unnoticed by the faculty. The teacher also stressed that being a capable performer is not enough - it helps to have a reputation as someone who is easy to work with. She advised him to try to be emphathetic, keep doing what he was doing, and that it would all work out. </p>

<p>I told S that learning to work with difficult people is a useful life skill. He agrees, but is still a bit discouraged about the prospect of sitting next to this person the next four years. Has anyone else here had to deal with a similar situation, and, if so, how was it resolved?</p>

2

<p>“similar situation, and, if so, how was it resolved?”</p>

<p>" be emphathetic, keep doing what he was doing, and that it would all work out."</p>

<p>EXACTLY . Sounds like he has a good teacher.</p>

3

<p>As someone who usually plays without a stand (or if there is music, I’m the only player on my part), I may not be the best qualified to answer this; but I’ve dealt with playing in groups with musicians I may not like very much for school. I would say tough it out and hope you get seated next to someone different next time seating auditions (is that what there called?) come around; and I would also avoid getting into any drama involving this person, because if they have alienated half your section you probobly do not want to get the reputation of being like that person.</p>

4

<p>Your son is on a path to becoming a professional musician. The best advice is to begin to act like a pro, and separate feelings from working relationships. Be on time, well prepared, be willing to listen, compromise and bend, respect the opinions of others, yet address the issues that effect the quality of the music in a professional and courteous manner, recognizing the pecking order and chain of command within a performing organization’s structure.</p>

<p>First advice is to have your son stop running interference or defending the malcontent/miscreant. If the sp is overbearing, obnoxious, late, unprepared, (you specified no specific term other than “overbearing”), son should let the other individuals or section make their feelings known. By tacitly coming to his defense or making excuses, perhaps the sp is under the impression that your son may actually agree with his opinions, behavior and this could only be reinforcing the scenario. If the sp is confronted with repeated criticism, admonishments, or rolled eyes, perhaps he may get the message and realize HE may well in fact be “the” problem.</p>

<p>Your son may want to talk to him in a constructive, non-critical professional way. Explain how he sees the sp’s behavior as being counterproductive. And if the friendship goes back a ways, there are times when you may need to 'splain to a buddy that at times they can be a real a$$hole. </p>

<p>Now if there’s a legitimate reason your son should support the sp in any particular “discussion”, by all means he should do so. </p>

<p>If the studio teacher is aware of it, the orchestral/ensemble directors are aware of it as well. It would not surprise me if the issues have not been addressed with the sp by faculty. Depending on how the orchestra is structured, the behavior may well have also been addressed through the principal, or through the chain of command to the conductor/director.</p>

<p>The sp will quickly develop a rep for being difficult, hard to work with, unbending, confrontational, etc., and will soon be the last on the list for gigs, fill in spots, extra opportunities, recital needs (wait till he needs fellow peers for a recital ensemble). The behavior may well come back to bite him on the bottom.</p>

<p>The orchestral seating is typically not cast in stone, and it’s likely that either or both chair positions will change, conceivably as early as the spring semester. It’s a good reason for son to really work and get as far away from the squeaky wheel chair wise. ;)</p>

<p>Small ensembles are another matter, and the quality of the rehearsals and results are normally a reflection of how well the partners mesh musically and personality wise. The best advice is to put the personality issues aside when the bows or the baton is raised.</p>

<p>Not directly related, but an interesting read of some of the learning pitfalls of becoming professional. <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/358420-know-before-you-go.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/358420-know-before-you-go.html&lt;/a&gt; Might be a tid-bit or two of advice in there.</p>

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<p>I think what others have written covers a lot, that there are going to be times/places where you are going to have to deal with situations like this if you are going to go into music. Ask any professional musician, and they probably will tell you stories about difficult conductors, fellow musicians who they had problems with, members of chamber groups not pulling their load, etc. It isn’t just in music, this is true in almost all facets of life, so it is a good life lesson (if it in fact sucks to be put through).</p>

<p>One thing where I differ is that you may find that offering constructive criticism, etc doesn’t do much, that the person in question has been like that a long time, and it may be a waste of effort after a while if the person doesn’t seem to listen (and you would be expending emotional and physical energy on something you cannot change). I agree with others as well, don’t run interference for this person if you don’t think they are right, don’t enable them in doing what they are doing that obviously others find problematic, including yourself.If you defend the person, it can give them the idea that they are fine and everyone else is wrong, you don’t want to get into dumping on them, but if you stay silent you are sending the message that you don’t believe they are acting properly and because they know you it will send more of a message (unless they are really blind, which is possible). </p>

<p>More importantly, by staying neutral you are also telling others you are not supporting the person in question, as others have written.</p>

<p>As far as the future goes, keep in mind that your current seating is not written in stone. One thing to keep in mind is that seating auditions are not purely scientific, there is no magic formula for seating, talent alone is often not the only criteria (though obviously it is a big one). From what I have seen with the groups my son has been in, the conductor also is looking for attitude, for kids who try, who are able to work in the orchestra, listen to guidance, etc, and I suspect if your assumption is correct that the conductor and the heads of the program know about you SP and his behavior, that it is going to affect his placement going down the road. I suspect even if your SP is on even par with you technically, that you may find he suddenly starts ‘dropping back’ based on his attitude (some programs use only a ‘blind number’ on a blind audition to place people, in which case my thought may have no meaning, for example, don’t know what they use at your LAC). </p>

<p>In some programs there are kids on solo instruments like violin who are at virtuoustic levels, but end up in orchestra being seated badly, because they basically don’t care about orchestra, feel it is beneath them, etc, and believe me, the conductors know it. In the professional world, from what I understand, people can do really well on an audition and not pass muster with the rest of the orchestra, and most orchestras have probation periods to make sure the musician fits in…</p>

<p>One other thought I offer is that maybe trying to get away from your current SP is motivation to make a real push to improve your skills, to really prepare for seating auditions, extra practice on getting your sound and so forth up to snuff, so that when you go in you are at a higher level (could also do that the other way, but I don’t recommend that:). </p>

<p>And not that it helps in the short term, but realize that your SP is not going to get away with his behavior for all that long, reputations are often made early, and music is a relatively small field, and when word gets out that someone is a pain, it hurts them, I can almost guarantee that. Even soloists can screw themselves this way and for a musician going into ensemble playing, it is poison.</p>

6

<p>Thank you, violadad and musicprnt, for your thoughtful and constructive replies. I like the suggestion of S working to raise his playing ability to a level that would shift him away from his current stand partner!</p>

<p>To clarify, S and the SP are not what he would consider friends, although the SP seems to think so. S has chosen not to socialize with SP, but is still on the receiving end of invitations. S also knows a little bit about SP and what issues are driving the public criticisms and diva-esque outbursts.</p>

<p>But S is somewhat reserved and dislikes drama. He is also not a gossip. (We’ve joked that if the music thing doesn’t work out, he could become a bartender since everyone tells him their secrets.) Part of the problem has been that his fellow instrumentalists have come to him to gripe. Basically, he’s said “I’ve played with so-and-so before and don’t take it personally, so-and-so does this to everyone” and then tried to change the subject. It hasn’t been so much him defending the bad behavior, as trying to explain it without telling tales.</p>

<p>And while he certainly has worked with people in the past that he’d rather not have, my mom instincts tell me that this current situation has been a bit tougher to bear in the context of a new setting far from home.</p>

<p>Interestingly, much of what you’ve both mentioned has already occurred. S won principal chair in an ensemble while in high school over a more talented peer because he was seen as a better section leader. So far this year, he has been invited by faculty to perform in a number of chamber recitals, whereas his SP has not. And, perhaps most telling, he just found out via e-mail that his is the only section doing orchestral re-seating auditions for next semester, so things may indeed be different next go round. I hope for the offending party’s sake that this is a wake up call - S says the SP is a good performer, just doesn’t seem to know how to “play nice.”</p>

<p>Again, thanks to all for helping to put this all in perspective!</p>

7

<p>Being “a good musician” isn’t necessarily enough. Even if one is lucky enough to win a chair at a pro audition, there is a one or two year tenure process which is not only used to judge whether the candidate maintains the artistic standard of the organization, but to also to judge how well the prospect meshes with the body in terms of work ethic, personality, etc.</p>

<p>Food for thought as well.</p>

8

<p>It sounds like your son’s chances of getting a new SP are very good. Be certain to let us know how things go after this next seating audition.</p>

<p>I would suggest if your son does end up next to SP again, that it would be worthwhile to speak with his studio teacher again. Teachers get very busy and there are so many factors to consider during a seating audition that frequently they can overlook something that they had intended to take care of. The conversation could begin with something fairly innocuous like, “What are the chances that I will get a new stand partner in the future?” Given that the teacher appears to be aware of the issue, this would probably trigger the teacher to take action and ensure that your son gets a new stand partner. </p>

<p>Your son might even suggest something like, “I am hoping to get a new stand partner because I believe I could learn more by playing beside a new person.” As posters have mentioned, one learns from everyone one has to deal with, but it sounds like your son has exceeded the limit of what he can learn from his current SP. </p>

<p>In the meantime, it may be a comfort to remind your son that his pain is probably relatively short-lived, but SP’s pain is probably going to be life-long, as he gets rejected and loses opporunities and jobs to players who are less skilled than he.</p>

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<p>D’s first teacher as an undergrad had an excellent point-----------“do you want to be known as the talented student who gets along with most people or the talented student who gets along with everyone? Who do you think gets the most opportunities?”</p>

<p>The music world is very small and as your student excels it only gets smaller…it sounds as if he is already on the right track.</p>

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<p>violadad: That is interesting about professional auditions - I was not aware there was a probationary period (still kind of new at all this). I cannot imagine going through an arduous audition process, only to lose the spot because of personality clashes! Thanks for sharing that info.</p>

<p>violindad: Thanks, I will post with an update once S returns to school in a few weeks. He has been practicing his excerpts like crazy.</p>

<p>musica: Yes, we are coming to realize that the music world is a small one indeed in which reputation plays a large part in one’s success. S has two peers from high school, pianists with distinctly different personalities. We’ve seen one accompany many local string players at recitals; the other, not so much. S says everyone wants the former because he’s so reliable and works hard to make the soloist sound his/her best. The latter, well - S said she doesn’t seem to enjoy accompanying and doesn’t always show up for scheduled rehearsals, so people don’t use her unless they are stuck.</p>

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<p>Clementon:</p>

<p>Can I offer a suggestion to your son, from something my son has found invaluable? He may want to take the score(s) for the audition pieces out of the library, and look at the exerpts in context of what the rest of the orchestra is playing. My son says that has helped him a great deal on his seating auditions in a really competitive youth orchestra, and it may help him (it may not, this is definitely a YMMV).</p>

<p>As far as personality and playing and such, music definitely is a small world and word gets around on people. A teacher my son has used who is also a pretty high level professional musician as well as teacher, said that one of the things that a lot of the kids she sees coming out of programs need to learn (and apparently aren’t taught or haven’t caught on to) is that so, so much of what you do as a musician is about working with people, about work ethic, about being willing to work with others/help them, etc…according to her (and more then a few other professional musicians) the biggest problem is on the soloist instruments, like violin and piano, where not a few of the really talented kids get this attitude like they are going to be soloists, that ensemble playing and the like are not where they are going, and as a result don’t try to develop that side…and often face big disappointment when they get out, they find they have a difficult time because they are hard to work with, etc. Hopefully the people at your s’s school will let SP know his behavior is hurting him and more importantly, enforce it in seating auditions.</p>

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<p>Looking back on all my years of studio voice teaching, I have had dozens of pianists play in the studio. Some have been wonderful, supportive, positive contributors to the lesson environment. Others have acted like we were wasting their time. All of the contributing pianists are making their living as musicians, and many are now in my Facebook community. I cannot say for sure what the others are doing, but nothing about which I have heard in the music world.</p>

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<p>Musicprnt, thank you for that suggestion, I will pass it on to S. We live in a somewhat rural area, so he may not be able to get his hands on a full score this go round, but I think your tip may serve him well once he has easier access to a music library. I know he does a lot of listening to various recordings of works his orchestra will be performing.</p>

<p>Oh, and violadad, I did check out that link you sent earlier in this thread. To say that saga makes for a compelling story would be an understatement. Absolutely unbelievable - poor binx and binxson! Their cautionary tale is a must-read for any aspiring musician.</p>

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<p>Depending on the repertoire, you may want to go ahead and purchase the full score online, especially if it’s a fairly standard piece performed regularly. While I moaned about the costs, it was money well spent.</p>

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<p>I’d like to add something from the news to this thread. The principal flute of the Chicago Symphony Orchestra spent the last few months trying out the principal job in Los Angeles, and has now abruptly left. There’s some “storm in a teacup” elements to the story. Just goes to show this kind of stuff never goes away:</p>

<p>[Mathieu</a> Dufour staying with Chicago Symphony Orchestra :: CHICAGO SUN-TIMES :: Classical](<a href=“http://www.suntimes.com/entertainment/music/classical/1975430,mathieu-dufour-chicago-symphony-orchestra-010509.article]Mathieu”>http://www.suntimes.com/entertainment/music/classical/1975430,mathieu-dufour-chicago-symphony-orchestra-010509.article)</p>

<p>[Flutist</a> Mathieu Dufour apologizes to L.A. Phil, slams Chicago Sun-Times article [Updated] | Culture Monster | Los Angeles Times](<a href=“Archive blogs”>Flutist Mathieu Dufour apologizes to L.A. Phil, slams Chicago Sun-Times article)</p>

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<p>Interesting, but not surprising, drama goes on like this all the time. Janos Starker wrote in his memoir that when he decided to leave the CSO after having been there and in the Met Opera Orchestra working with Fritz Reiner, that in the first rehearsal after he told Reiner he was going to leave to pursue a solo career, Reiner broke his batton (as a going away gift, his fellow musicians gave him a tie tack made in the form of a broken batton).</p>

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<p>Juicy, N8Ma. Very interesting. Thanks for sharing.</p>