The TASP Cult...is it THAT great and perfect?

Pre-College Issues Summer Programs
1

<p>Hi!
By looking at the TASP 09 thread, I can already see that we're all excited and people seem to have only good things to say about this amazing program.
Well, I've looked around in blogs, etc, and there is a TASP cult, and the monastic nature of things. </p>

<p>Is it really like this? No interaction with people not in TASP? Distant relationships with the factota? And is everything all intellectual.....and not too much social stuff going on? Are there any things that we should be aware of before applying?</p>

<p>I've been thinking of applying, but I just want to hear about what might stop people from applying, and maybe some of the negative things about this program.</p>

2

<p>In a word? Yes.</p>

<p>In more than a word, TASP is not perfect. There are things about TASP that will annoy you. There are times you will think seminar is boring, that your factota are crazy, and that you will die if you have to eat one of those round pizza things again.</p>

<p>It is, however, probably the best thing I have ever done in my life. I'm not sure where you got the idea that there's not much social stuff going on. Yeah, you probably won't be attending crazy dance parties (or if you do, you'll probably end up in the library talking and playing chess--true story, lolz), but the friendships you make--yes, through intellectual discussion, but also through late-night bubble tea runs, five-mile treks to cosmic bowling, and getting your factota's faces' painted--are such that you won't <em>want</em> to interact with people outside of TASP. My cell phone was lost for three weeks and I didn't care. The semi-monasticism is seriously not a problem.</p>

<p>That said, TASP is not for everyone. If you are not an intellectual, you will hate it. If you do not like being disagreed with, you will hate it. If you are so extremely extroverted that you can't imagine being with the same 19 people for six weeks, you will hate it. However, if TA lets you in, they probably think you're a good fit for the program, and you will have the best six weeks of your life.</p>

<p>PM me if you want more specific details about the program. There is nothing I love more than extolling TASP's virtue. :)</p>

3

<p>We'd joke that on the last day we'd be sat in a circle in cloaks and a gun would be placed in the middle of the circle. Then we'd be told that only 17 of us would be leaving. Hah.</p>

<p>I think lookbeyond makes good points, but there's a huuuuge difference between "You probably won't be attending crazy dance parties" and "At my TASP, we didn't have crazy dance parties".</p>

<p>Every TASP seminar is very different. Apparently the 2007 UT TASP had regular LAN parties. I think we only had one guy who occasionally played Quake II on his computer. At our TASP, very few people went to the library and our board game of choice was Taboo. Our discussions were serious and meaningful (at times), but I wouldn't say that it was intellectual at all. I distinctly remember one TASPer saying that she felt the TA misled her because the house was anti-intellectual. </p>

<p>Were there problems? Of course. Our seminar was very problematic to the point where many of us felt it was the worst part of the day. I think the seminar was a key reason as to why we weren't all that intellectual in the house. Towards the end some TASPers stopped doing the readings and almost all of us wrote half-assed essays for half-assed prompts. There are more issues that I won't go into, but I would be very surprised if the other TASPs didn't have different but equally "serious" problems.</p>

<p>That being said, I doubt (m)any of us would change a thing. Living, eating, going to class, and socializing with 19 other people for six weeks really does form close bonds. I think that the Telluride Association's emphasis on semi-monasticism and community helps reinforce those bonds in a way that might not happen at similar programs. At the same time, such a close-knit community is bound to have significant problems over the course of 42 days and part of being a member of a community is working with others to overcome those issues.</p>

<p>It's difficult to articulate how we socialized, but I can assure you that it's never an issue. There's always something to discuss or something to do, but what that is depends on the intangibles of communal living.</p>

<p>Seeing as you've looked at TASP blogs, there's a really interesting post on the Michigan 2005 blog.</p>

<p>
[quote]
I was in the Pierson College dining hall earlier this week when in walked a pack of freshman (they always travel in packs...I know I did). I could not help noticing that one of them was wearing a UMich TASP '07 shirt. TASP '07? I jumped up and greeted them (with perhaps too much enthusiasm), but underneath that enthusiasm I was running the numbers in my head. '07 TASPers are in college. '08 TASPers are high school seniors. And as for us, the magical specificity of our six weeks in '05 begins to fade and we become generic alumni/ae. For the '07 Michiganders I met, it is perhaps important that I appear generic. Their experience remains recent enough to be fresh (look at our blog from September of 2006) and so they must continue to believe that it was unique. I could see their unease as I reminisced with them about ΑΓΔ. Was their experience not special, not unique? I stopped short of reminiscing about the cult room, the couch room, the walls of watching sisters in the hallway. To share it with them would have been to take it from them.</p>

<p>We will always have reification and Christopher Small to ourselves. John Sinclair belongs to us and us alone. But Chris Alexander, Jason Chua, Henrik Herb, Meredith Hitchcock, Sophie Huber, Emily Jenda, Ridley Jones, Christina Law, Isaac Miller, Dylan Morris, Samyukta Mullangi, Matt Nestor, Sam Pimentel, Lisa Ruiz, Emma Slager, Matt Slayton, Charles Wu, and Bern Youngblood are not the sole property of TASP '05 UMich. We are claimed by, and claim, other people and groups. "TASPer" has been displaced as my lead marker of identity by "Yalie," "DSer," (now ex-DSer) "IPster," "Glee Clubber." This is good, in some way. By knowing me by ever-changing labels, those around me protect me from the fish-out-of-water nostalgia born of trying to live an old identity in new surroundings.</p>

<p>I wrote in a somewhat trite college essay of my conviction that "at Yale, I could find again the spirit of TASP." I have succeeded, to a point; I love Yale for many of the same reasons I loved TASP. And yet I realize now that what I really desire is not merely to find again the spirit of TASP, just as after Yale I will not merely desire to find again the spirit of Yale. I hope for a moment that can call up out of murkily-remembered themes and generalities a specific scene from our TASP and give that scene the vivid immediacy it had in the summer of '05 when it was a fresh-made memory.</p>

<p>I want my TASP madeleine.

[/quote]
</p>

4

<p>Yeah, I totally had a whole other paragraph about how every TASP is different, but I cut it because my post was getting lengthy. :3</p>

<p>I should probably qualify what I meant by "intellectual." At UM, we had some intense intellectual discussions, but discussing philosophy and great books wasn't really the core of our TASP. It was more like everyone approached our day-to-day existence with an intellectual mindset. There were certainly times when none of us did the reading, and we all procrastinated on papers like hain't nothin'. We also had some problems with people with intense video game habits that ultimately ended in video games being banned, which was somewhat traumatic for a few TASPers. Basically, we were all nerds. We didn't feel the need to prove our nerdiness or out-nerd one another. There were times when we bonded over our nerdiness, but basically, we were just a group of really awesome people who had a lot of fun.</p>

<p>On a side note, I totally think I know which UTer you are talking about, illuminar. lolz.</p>

5

<p>TASP IS THE BEST THING YOU WILL EVER DO.</p>

<p>Before you go to college at least (As far as I know. I'm only an '08er)</p>

<p>I think that lookbeyond hit the intellectualism right on the head. Beyond the first week (where everyone essentially has a simultaneous intellectual orgasm, which is nice, yet pretentious), Intellectualism at TASP is more of that general mindset. We talked about "regular teenager" things, but in a way that could only be achieved in an environment like TASP. It was like we were exploring our own lives, but on another level. A deep level that changes your understanding of yourself the longer you spend there. </p>

<p>Some people were definitely more standard "intellectual" than others, but for the most part if you weren't obnoxious about it you could find yourself wandering into deep philosophical discussions. I believe the most heated debates occurred no sooner than 1 in the morning on a weeknight. </p>

<p>People were all definitely in a way, kind of "nerdy". But strangely, as time went on and you were with everybody constantly, your perspective changed; these nerds were really really cool people. </p>

<p>Socially, when things are good, TASP blows anything else out of the water. But at times things did get socially restricting, and at times I did wish I could just go to a party with my friends or take a road trip somewhere. But those good times make everything more than worth it. Oddly, despite the fact that I remember feeling socially restrained as a whole at times, I can't remember any specific time when I felt "bored", outside maybe during seminar on some days. </p>

<p>One of my most vivid memories of a good time at TASP was the day we decided to have a water balloon fight. We spent a good hour and a half filling up water balloons, for a game that lasted... maybe 15 minutes. But I remember the entire time we spent filling up the balloons, dropping stealth bombs down to the girls floor, getting the entire room wet and not cleaning it up, I remember I felt so happy. Like I could never imagine leaving where I was in that moment. </p>

<p>That's what TASP was to me. A perpetual surreal moment, like a dream that when I woke up, I was a fundamentally different person. </p>

<p>To conclude my senseless ramble, I'll add a different perspective to seminar. </p>

<p>I personally liked seminar, well up until the last week and a half when the professor lost his mind and then stole our papers and never gave them back. But it is what you make of it. I think that with some seminars, what you learn isn't specific knowledge so much as it is how to think about a certain issue, or life in general. I've learned more as a result of my seminar AFTER TASP, then I did when I was actually in seminar at TASP. I'm actually writing a research paper on one of the topics discussed during my TASP because as I've realized its relevance, I've become intensely interested. </p>

<p>I think seminar also teaches you how to deal with college professors in a setting where you can make mistakes. Some are pompous @sses who know A LOT about their passions and can help you immensely if you can stand them. Others are nice, yet not what you need to get better. TASP also prepares you for a world where all of your teachers aren't drowning you with compliments for every bowel movement you make in their presence. I remember when we all got our first papers back. Several people cried. </p>

<p>To actually conclude my rant, I want to speak to the fears against the semi-monasticism at TASP. </p>

<p>Ostensibly, the secluded nature of TASP forces the group to work out problems; each individual is instrumental to the well being of everyone. It also taught me how to utilize and interact with a highly motivated and intelligent group of peers. I think I'm more prepared to gain the most from my college experience, and from life in general because of TASP. </p>

<p>But in reality, it serves to do so much more. Even the people you think you absolutely cannot stand, you will love more than life itself. And when they leave you, you'll cry and miss them everyday. Because even though they were among your least favorite at TASP, they are one of the 17 most extraordinary, most perfect people you will ever meet in your entire life. You'll miss them everyday. You'll hate your friends because they can never be that person. </p>

<p>Don't pass up this opportunity. I'm not just trying to put TASP on a pedestal. People will tell you that TASP isn't for everyone, but honestly if the TASPers who read your application see something in you, I think it can be for you, even if you have to work at it a little more (I know I had to work hard at it, and got visibly frustrated and slightly insane at times). The people who I thought probably hated their TASP experience are the same people who cried the hardest as we left. Don't miss this opportunity. I can't imagine any situation on this earth that will ever be quite like it. If we ever meet, and there is one thing I ever say that you listen to, don't miss this opportunity.</p>

6

<p>TASP IS NOT PERFECT BUT IT IS REALLY REALLY CLOSE.</p>

<p>(note: i went to the same tasp as tyler and illuminar. 17% of its student body has now posted in this thread. take that, cornell and umich. can you tell that texas had fun?)</p>

<p>i think that other posters have mostly summarized the intellectual and/or "academic" aspect of tasp, so i'm not going to discuss that further. what i think deserves more attention, and what was much more important to me, is the personal aspect. as other posters have also written, tasp is a place where you can make very very close connections with other people. but as important as the connections you make with others are the insights into & solutions for yourself with which you leave the program.</p>

<p>tasp is for intellectuals who happen to be high school students. as i said several times, if you're a high school junior and you are/you become an intellectual, it's usually because something is wrong. there's something about you, your community, or your experience such that you start thinking about difficult subjects for yourself. lots of taspers have very tense home lives. lots of taspers are immigrants who are centrally unsure about assimilation. lots of taspers live in very conservative and/or rural places where they or their families fit in poorly. you get my drift. anyway, i think that (again, at least for me) a very significant part of tasp is working out the issue(s) that made you into a driven overachiever in the first place. chances are that other people have had the same experience and can share their intellectual and personal perspectives, or that they've had analogous experiences. this sounds really dull in writing, but in person it becomes incredibly emotional. typically i am a really unemotional person, but i cried basically for two or three days straight at the end of tasp, because i was leaving the people and the support system that i had come to rely on.</p>

7

<p>Wow I have a pretty normal home life. I feel doomed now.</p>

8

<p>I have a pretty ****ty life. I think I've known since I was about three that I'm not like everyone else. And high school pretty much punctuates that fact. I think my family are the normal ones; I'm the odd-ball out at school and at home. I believe the word "tolerate" comes to describe me. Haha</p>

9

<p>This sounds pretty interesting, to hear all your experiences, but I have no idea about this exact program itself and cost, what it does, etc. Also requirements to apply, etc...any input on those?</p>

10

<p>I've thought about the second part of philoglossia's post before, not in the context of TASP though. Generally speaking, I think there are large issues at play when students overwork themselves in preparation for the SAT, pile on extracurriculars and get four hours of a sleep a night to get into a school a thousand miles from their family, friends, and community. Part of that might be the prestige and the academic experience, but I'm not entirely convinced. Of course, some of the things philoglossia (it's hard not to use real names) mentioned apply to me.</p>

<p>It reminds me of something from our TASP, actually (did the other TASPs do this too? I know we all did the quaker meeting).</p>

<p>In the second week we did an activity that the TASPers thought would be unnecessary. The factota said it was an icebreaker, but we were all "we tight 4 lyfe" and not really interested. The game was pretty simple. We stood in a circle and anyone could step in and make a statement. Anyone who had the same experience/belief as the person in the middle would step in and join them, and then in one or two seconds we'd re-form the circle . Although we were initially hesitant, two hours later we were still at it and some pretty personal stuff came out. Ok, really personal, from abusive relationships to family issues to religious beliefs to doubts about sexuality. I can't really articulate how profound this was to our little community, but I think most of us sat in the common room for a solid hour afterwards just taking in what we had just experienced. </p>

<p>The TASP community was tight-knit from the beginning, but I think that activity marked a shift from a more superficial dynamic of "omg we're all TASPers!!!" to something more serious and intimate.</p>

11

<p>I want to go to TASP so bad, i have to wait 2 years to even apply</p>

12

<p>not using real names is strange, for true.</p>

<p>no, as all of you can probably tell from this thread, i evangelize for tasp mostly because i started it lying in the personal gutter gazing at the intellectual stars. when i arrived at tasp, i had spent the last 10 years of my life trying very very hard to be a perfect student to make up for what i perceived as my deficiencies as a person. it generated a change of perspective that i don't expect to experience again in the next 10 years, if ever. part of the reason why tasp can begin to solve this kind of problem (which is really common) is that it lets you know just how many other people are trapped in the same vicious cycle of internal disappointment, external fulfillment, internal disappointment again. another part of the reason is that you develop a sense of self-worth as a person rather than an achiever; lacking this is, again, really common and potentially a very significant problem. another part of the reason is that you understand the relationship of emotion and straightforward "intellectual" activity a lot better, and make fewer (inevitably artificial) distinctions between them. i'm not sure if you can understand this before tasp or another watershed experience & so i won't explain it (much) further.</p>

<p>i still think about that "icebreaker" fairly often. as illuminar wrote, it definitely marked a shift in the taspers' relationships to one another & the tasp's relationship to itself--at the beginning both were ordinary and a little superficial; afterward they became much more meaningful.</p>

13

<p>I think the hardest thing about doing TASP applications is trying to write something that reflects who you are, but trying to condense yourself into a two-page essay. Right now, I'm trying to work on my goals and dreams essay, and thanks philoglossia for reading over it, but now it's like...I have the idea there but I just can't get it to make the jump you know? </p>

<p>I just don't see how you guys could've written yours in less than a week! Haha.</p>

14

<p>Lol TASP really must be incredible... I feel all sensational and poignant just by reading some of these posts...</p>

15

<p>Or maybe UMich TASPers just have better things to do with their time than be on CC. OH SNAP.
[Actually, ignore that, because it's Christmas and I'm here... but it's only because my family is boring. Honestly.]</p>

<p>We did the same icebreaker as UT, only it was on the first night. Which was a dumb idea, because we weren't really comfortable with one another yet to really get into it, but it was still fairly intense. We did a diversity workshop towards the end of the program that was a lot more... enlightening and meaningful.</p>

16

<p>@powerbomb: same here
I'm totally sold on the idea. Now to write those 5 essays!</p>

<p>thanks for all the help</p>

17

<p>After reading all this, I am so thankful I didn’t encourage my son to apply. It sounds exactly like a Large Group Awareness Training (LGAT)! Right down to not being able to explain it other than “it changed my life.” Scary stuff.</p>

18

<p>

</p>

<p>Are you kidding? *Most of the posts in this thread are almost essay length with specifics about how it changed their lives. *It is not a cult. *That is a joke. *TASP does not set out to change people’s mindsets in some kind of LGAT way. *Basically everything the people running the program plan are very normal things, just done on a higher level than they are at most summer programs (better professors, more in depth or creative academic topics and work, more freedom, etc.). *That icebreaker activity, which some TASPs do and others don’t, is not directed toward personal topics by the factota, in fact they don’t even participate. *It is all the kids. *The closeness that people talk about feeling to the people there–and I think this is what scares you (can’t imagine why)–is because of the atmosphere. *Discussion is encouraged (a lot), and the people there are ready to learn from each other, and not just intellectually. *Another factor is the fact that what philoglossia said is often true in my experience (though not always by any means). *Many people at TASP have not met people who can really understand that before, and it is tough to leave. *All this, plus group meals, group activities, planning the program as it goes on through self-government, intense conversation at two a.m., impromptu dance parties, adventures, and late night writing sessions (most of this, I will say again, is powered by the TASPers, not the Telluride Association), leads to really close bonds. *I cried when I left, I love everyone from UT TASP 2009, and I don’t go home and pray to the ghost of LL Nunn (at least not every night ;)).</p>

19

<p>Well, that is good news. And I don’t know who LL Nunn is, but I’m glad you don’t pray to him/her/it:) Sorry if I panicked over all the red flags I read in this post. </p>

<p>“A perpetual surreal moment, like a dream that when I woke up, I was a fundamentally different person.”</p>

<p>When you know someone who has “tricked” into a “leadership training” that turned out to be a LGAT, you tend to be wary. Glad TASP is not one of those groups:)</p>

20

<p>@ barracuda9: I had similar thoughts before my daughter attended TASP in 2007. I was nervous of the brain washing and how much she would be changed. Let me just say that she did change - she came back much more confident and comfortable with the person she was. She had just met 17 other individuals with similar ideals and had spent 6 exhilirating weeks discussing issues far beyond the seminar. She approached senior year with an enthusiasm she’d never shown before and went on to have the best year of high school. I am so glas she had the opportunity to experience TASP.</p>