<p>What do you think the UC system will be like in 2016...in terms of admisison and cost?</p>
<p>It's damn hard, especially for HS students, to get into the top tier UCs now....a decade ago it was significantly easier. Ten years from now I forsee the top UCs, Cal, LA and SD, being almost impossible to get in for the majority of CA highschoolers. With increasing population and competition it will only be accessible to the very top of the HS students. Consequently, this will also bring increased enrollment to the middle and lower level UCs. And excpect to see schools like UCI, UCD and UCSB shoot up through reputation nationally. The lower level UCs, UCR and UCM, will also gain significant reputation. </p>
<p>I was also looking at the estimated student budget, living in residence halls, in UCLA. In 2002 it was like 14K...now it's over 20K. In 10 years I see it going up to atleast 30-35K, and this is a conservative estimate. This would mean that the middle-middle and upper-middle class, those who get next to nothing in financial aid, will be shut out of public education altogether. </p>
<p>With raising deficit and national debt, along with the competition brought about by globalization, public colleges in CA is in a dire situation. Maybe Cal States then would be a more desirable choice for the majority of Californians...</p>
<p>With the ample evidence we're receiving that millions of California's high school studnets are struggling to prove their proficiency in middle school level math and language skills, I think that the future for UC and CSU schools looks kind of grim. Why?</p>
<p>They're tethered to the state's public secondary school system and its students by law (they're even responsible for admitting a certain percentage of those students according to state law). Unfortunately, between No Child Left Behind's effects, the rather poor quality of a great many of the state's teachers, the political clout and uncomprising nature of the teacher's unions, and the coming strain of retiring "baby boomer" staff, the public school system is a sinking ship. If nothing changes--and quickly--even the elite campuses are going to be forced to admit poor quality students in the future if they're going to honor the law.</p>
<p>If that happens, which is likely given the public's aversion to any and all forms of further taxation and the system's own unwillingness to change, the campuses will start to lose their pull in terms of attracting stellar faculty and generating meaningful alumni contributions. In short, I think the state schools are screwed if we don't start paying serious attention to our k-12 schools.</p>
<p>I'm in agreement with Citan. I coach highschoolers and I know many of my runners that got rejected from Cal and UCLA would have gotten in with the same stats 2 or 3 years ago. I also wouldn't be surprised if more kids started choosing UCLA over Cal. Cal will still be on top academically, but I think UCLA will attract more applicants because it is looked at as "cooler" than Cal. </p>
<p>This is the same reason why I think community colleges are dropping in popularity for UC transfers. It was this year that applicatations throughout all UCs (except Cal which saw an increase) actually dropped. Throughout the media, community colleges are viewed as trash schools where only losers, criminals, and dumbasses go. Most people our age or people who have already graduated college don't view cccs with this sort of stigma because they have matured and expanded their views in life. But for most highschoolers, it seems that going to a community college automatically means "loser." So unless the stigma generated by the media changes, I continue to see community college popularity sink lower.</p>
<p>also gabe, i know u're proly reffering to the number of apps UC received, but i can tell at SMC admission rates are increasing and they're actually building 4 new class room buildings and trying to arrange to hold class in various HS.</p>
<p>Concurrent enrollment is becoming huge too. SMC holds classes at Venice HS, Beverly HS, and Santa Monica HS.</p>
<p>I also see CC getting more popular....regular admissions will get next to impossible in a few years...I myself know many smart people who chose the CC route to get into UCLA and Cal...</p>
<p>yea, i'm also under the impression that CCs are still popular, if not becoming more popular...its starting to make more sense, and i feel as if the CC stereotype is beginning to shift positively, and away from the 'stupid students, unmotivated druggies and criminals, etc' and its turning more into 'the smart choice, in terms of the money saved and the improved chances at getting into a top UC'...i think a lot more people are open to that option these days than a few years ago, and people are learning to respect that choice..(or at least in the bay area and maybe california as a whole)...because i know CCs still have a horrible rep in other states bc other states aren't used to such a great system of transferring</p>
<p>You can't make determinations about the ENTIRE SYSTEM and its popularity without statistics. You guys are making judgments based on too much personal experience, or just one school, and not statistics. SMC and other feeder schools could be gaining popularity while the vast majority of schools are not. </p>
<p>
See, I don't think it's good to refer to them as "elite." These ARE public schools, and that means they SHOULD take in as many students as possible; they should take in struggling students if the students can succeed there. With the high competition, I don't think UCLA or CAL will have a "poor quality" student problem in the future, and if anything, they SHOULD admit more and more students with lower scores: remember, SAT scores and gpa are hardly conclusive indicators of performance.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I also wouldn't be surprised if more kids started choosing UCLA over Cal.
You live in Southern California, right? I'm not sure that's really the case if you look at the entire state; Cal and UCLA will probably continue to be the top schools, increasing their endowments and competition, not sure if UCLA will really increase their matriculation number compared to Cal.</p>
<p>Actually, Time Magazine did an article about 18 months ago about the alarming rates of students choosing CCC's over UC's, Cal States, and also privates. They actually did include statistics but theres no way i can dig up that article now, but to sum it up, there are a couple reasons why people like me choose CCC over directly going into UC or CSU's</p>
<p>1) You cant really beat $26 a unit to get the same education ( I know most of you will argue that UC classes will be harder, but who really gives a crap when most of the 60 units are all GE's anyways)
2) If you go to a CCC with an honors program that recognizes TAP or the other articulation agreements with UC's, the transfer rates into UC is almost 100%. At my CCC honors program, we have 98% acceptance rate into UC's and a 93% acceptance rate into UCLA this past year.
3) Honors programs are recruiting high caliber honor students straight out of HS these days. We have a division here on campus where we specifically go out to local HS and reach out ot them and tell them the truth behind CCC's and how much simplier it is to get into their dream UC's</p>
<p>The article was about 18 months ago? So they must have been surprised when TRANSFER APPLICATIONS TO UCS WENT DOWN (AGAIN). The trend has been a DECREASE. Most CCCs dont even have serious honors programs, and those that do have very, very limited programs (compared to a high school honors program for instance). I find what you're saying extremely hard to believe, even the idea that Time had an article about this.</p>
<p>I think you're letting your personal experience color your idea of the entire system, a system you clearly don't have anything close to a complete understanding of. You're probably basing your conclusions on your school, which is likely a feeder school with an honors programs, many students who transfer to UCS, a good transfer center, etc.</p>
<p>I don't know if you are or once were a CCC student G1a2b3e, but the truth is that most CCC students do not transfer within 2 years. It usually takes 3 now and do you know why??? Classes are so difficult to get these days. Most transferable classes at my CC fill up within a week or two. And besides that, all entering freshmen are required to take math, writing, reading tests to get placed into certain classes. Most students do not place into college level math, reading, and writing on their first try. This is why it takes longer to transfer. Also, just because USC's transfer applicants went down doesn't mean that there is a decline in the popularity of students going to CCC. I can name so many CCC's around my area with dedicated honors programs so don't even get me started on that. Most programs require eligibility for college level writing, 3.5 GPA, and a teacher recommendation these days so they aren't very limited compared to high school honors. </p>
<p>And don't even say that my college is small because i attend CA's biggest community college. Mt. San Antoinio College with 40,000+ students</p>