<p>If you're referring to my friend, he didn't get into Dartmouth.</p>
<p>I meant any prestigious Ivy-caliber school, I think the person mentioned MIT in the post I was actually responding to, but then I saw "Hanover" and thought about Dartmouth...sorry I'm at work and I'm numb lol</p>
<p>It might come across as being "elite" or "snobbish" to state that Denison over a top school is a bad choice, but I think its absolutely true. If financial reasons are driving the decision then of course things change significantly. </p>
<p>For certain students, such as students wanting to go to med school, a school like Denison will serve them incredibly well. But for someone looking to do big things in business (and I mean almost anything in business), there's no question a Denison student is at a disadvantage compared to top LACs. Sure you'll have your Michael Eisner, but you'll have many less of these types of people than from the top schools. </p>
<p>Then consider the effect a quality peer groups has on your education and personal network.</p>
<p>Have I been sleeping?</p>
<p>i'm sorry but i have to agree with slipper on this one..</p>
<p>"many less" must be that "elite education". Try far fewer next time.</p>
<p>You seem to define "Top LACs" as just Amherst, Williams, Swat, etc. You say that these schools are necessary to business networking - but that's just not so.
The networking at Trinity, for example, is at a very close level to that of those schools. I'm sure there are a few others like it.</p>
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"many less" must be that "elite education". Try far fewer next time.
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<p>Dude, he's posting on an Internet forum...leave him alone.</p>
<p>Resorting to ad hominem attacks isn't going to settle this debate.</p>
<p>Correcting grammar on-line is probably the lamest thing ever Barrons - you might be the smartest person in your high school but no one will like someone that makes annoying comments like that in real life...especially considering Slipper's a finance guy from an Ivy who must have taken the SAT 2 Writing at some point</p>
<p>I agree with Slipper. It is a sad but true fact of life. Nobody said it was fair. granted, we could pull a Continental Europe and ensure all our universities are roughly equal in their mediocrity, but that kind of defeats the purpose...</p>
<p>Umm I don't think European universities are mediocre but OK.</p>
<p>please, barrons is not in high school.</p>
<p>I'll have to second slipper's evaluation as well, especially if you're going into a prestige/networking oriented field - Law and Business come to mind.</p>
<p>I am not going to debate Denison's merits or lack thereof, because as I suggested I don't know it that well. But a friend of mine at a top 4 econ. PhD program with students from the Ivy League, Stanford/Berkeley/MIT/Michigan/Chicago said the best-prepared students were generally from the LACs. </p>
<p>I agree that in college you are partly educated by your peers, but it could well be that the teacher learning/peer learning ratio is significantly greater at an LAC. And this is one the most decisive elements in getting into a good grad school -- i.e. working closely with and impressing professors who will write your recs.</p>
<p>I was objecting to slipper's blanket assertion that Harvard would always be a better choice without regard to the specifics. One specific being that apparently the student may have preferred Denison. If he was smart enough to get into Harvard, and Harvard's so be-all-end-all, why are you inclined to think his choice to go to Denison was stupid? </p>
<p>Additionally, it's nice to see that he wanted to stand on his own two feet as quickly as he could and that he didn't want to ask his father to pay for two years at Harvard. If his Dad was all that rich, I doubt he'd have to borrow his way for the other two years.</p>
<p>Barrons- Do you think I honestly think people on message boards take the time to make sure their posts are grammatically correct? </p>
<p>Anyway, this might sound awful, but students at lesser schools aren't even aware of the true career opportunity set. How many kids from Denison know that Wall Street Traders make 7 figures in their thirties or that Hedge fund managers make hundreds of millions a year. How many will be exposed to the path to becoming a high-level official in a political administration? How many will know that McKinsey is the premier consulting firm and working there can lead to a C-level job in your late thirties? How many know that Insight and Summit are the Northeast VCs that hire undergrads (and only from Ivies)? How many Denison kids are building clinics in Kenya and understand the microfinance process that Kiva and globalgiving have created?</p>
<p>At top schools the awareness level is much higher. Your expectations change because when you go to dinner with your friends or see people at a wedding everyone is incredibly successful. I was at dinner with a bunch of Dartmouth friends the other night and it seemed like everyone there was doing something incredible whether it was raising 200K for a clinic in Kenya or working in venture capital. A friend of mine at that dinner (age 26) just raised 10 million for his start-up from one of the top firms in the valley. When I need legal advice I talk to my friends who went to Harvard and NYU law. </p>
<p>These posts are hard to right because we all want to fight for the underdog. But truth be told I'd send my kids to an Ivy or top LAC anyday of the week over a lesser school regardless of the costs. Top schools change lives in a way that lesser schools don't.</p>
<p>My peer group from Dartmouth wants to change the world. My brilliant friends who went to places like Illinois or Denison just don't have that mindset.</p>
<p>I'll chime in--a blanket statement like the one you're making is ludicrous. Peer groups do not encompass the entire class at a college or university, but rather a much smaller subset thereof. Your peer group is who you want it to be. If you got to Dartmouth, there may be 1000 really, really smart kids in your class, and you'll pick 25-50 to know well--if you're a Dartmouth caliber student, but go to, say, Illinois (to use one of your example schools), there will be 6000 kids in your class, at least 1000 of whom will be at the level of the Dartmouth class, and the rest of whom will be bright but below that level. If you want to, you can choose your 25-50 person peer group to be the ones who were Ivy material but who, for financial, comfort, or other reasons, chose Illinois. Or you can choose another group.</p>
<p>I went to Michigan, and to Northwestern for law school. I was surrounded by brilliant kids, some of whom are changing the world. It would never occur to me to make a blanket statement which posits that more prestige=correct choice.</p>
<p>Michigan and Northwestern are top schools. I'm arguing top school vs. lesser school.</p>
<p>I have a controversial opinion but I believe it to be absolutely true. You are going to have to find the successful people at a lesser school. AND those bright people will still have a far lower awareness level of real opportunities. A great majority of your classmates from a place like Dartmouth or Columbia, on the other hand, will fit into this category. Expectations are much higher.</p>
<p>I think you're being very hard on Denison. Suppose all the person in question were interested in was was getting into med school? It doesn't take a glamorous undergraduate degree to pass Organic Chemistry. I think -- all things being equal -- someone's chances of getting into a U.S. med school are just about the same no matter where they get their baccalaureate.</p>
<p>Med school is the one case where it doesn't matter that much. I'm speaking more in terms of law, business, academia, etc.</p>
<p>yeah for med school its all about GPA and MCATs - grade inflation helps and so does having weaker competition</p>