Thoughts on these LACs for Econ/Finance and Job Prospect?

College Search & Selection
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As a high school senior who wants to study econ/international relations and work in New York/Wall street after graduation, are these schools highly regarded in New York/employers and do you have any information/opinions on these colleges?

I love the LAC small class sizes and support system but I’m also looking for a prestigious yet pre-professional/career-oriented LAC as well since I do not have the money to go to grad school.

I want to either be a journalist or work in finance, I know the 2 are completely different but I love both and I hope to figure out which one I’d like to focus on in college!

Connecticut college (it’s my top choice after my interview, i love how diverse it is and the pretty campus and just school culture/community) and heard they have good connections in MUFG in NY and just in finance in general from their info session but what’s the reputation of this school like and any thoughts? I know it’s not as high in rankings but would this affect my job prospect?

Gettysburg college

St Lawrence University

trinity college ct (heard they have lots of finance connections but not sure if i totally vibe with the school)

Whitman College (everyone seems really happy here!) and

Franklin and Marshall/Dickinson ( I heard these schools are strong in business)

Any other info on these schools would help as well,

Thank you so much for your help! :slight_smile:

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This site views LACs by their faculty scholarship in economics: Economics rankings: US Economics Departments at Liberal Arts Colleges | IDEAS/RePEc.

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Ask their career offices about Wall Street - i’d venture to say these schools are not generating wall street folks in general…they are great colleges but pedigree wise 2nd tier.

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Trinity is your best bet of those. I seem to recall that Gettysburg placed a fair number of students with one of the fund managers (Vanguard maybe?)

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I think the OP is asking specific about Wall Street, so likely IB, so Vanguard is probably not in their purview.

One can get there from anywhere but likely needs connections.

I’d start with taking their list and talking to career services and getting a lot of outcomes.

I have no doubt that hundreds of colleges place on Wall Street but there are the haves (Michigan, NYU, Penn, etc.) and the somehow got lucky.

Again, their list of colleges is excellent - but I’d assume (and don’t know) that just like it’s the top major universities that place on Wall Street, the same would be true from LACs - of which their list is fantastic (really great schools) but not top tier.

According to this list only Middlebury (#23) is in the top 25.

Also, OP, remember a lot of investment banking is leaving NY. It will always be there but Alliance Bernstein, as an example, is now in Nashville.

Investment Banking Target School List (Using Data) (peakframeworks.com)

Good luck - with hard work, dedication, and a great recruiting strategy, anything is possible for you.

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It is also quite possible to go to a target school, go through the process, and not be recruited.

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This Bloomberg headline referred to Trinity as a “Wall Street Pipeline”:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2013-05-06/wall-street-pipeline-trinity-sees-president-quit-amid-frat-fight

Regarding the comparison to Middlebury, note that Trinity grads earn more in their early careers than those from Middlebury based on information in U.S. News:

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/trinity-college-1414

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/middlebury-colleTge-3691

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I think the sample sizes for data regarding LACs with alum on Wall Street have got to be taken with a grain of salt. Suffice it to say that all of the schools mentioned so far have the potential to reward someone who is interested and willing to do a lot of networking, the opportunity to land a job in finance. In this case, it’s less a matter of academics and more a matter of whether the school has a good career resource center.

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Wharton has as many undergraduates as Midd has students, and many more than WIlliams does. Berkeley has 1,300 economics majors, Notre Dame has 1,750, etc, etc.

This means more total hires, and more occurrences of >2 at any given firm. So calculating those without controlling for the number of undergraduates is intellectually dishonest. Similarly their decision on what is considered “elite boutique” is pretty opaque and seems based on the activity of these banks in Canada. Also, why does the table show these 11 firms? They also do not share their selection criteria with us. Of course, he is looking only at the number of “Investment Banker Analysts”. Why this particular job title? Again, we do not know, but I again have my suspicions.

Oh, the also claim that their list “only represents 50-60% of the actual Investment Banking Analyst population”. Where did he get this figure from? Again, he chooses to just throw it out at us.

Basically, this table is a “I have ranked these colleges based on some figures that I have, and using some criteria that I have, and I used an equation that I have. I am not sharing these criteria with you, I am not controlling for anything, nor am I considering any other factor which may determine my results.”

Unsurprisingly, Ivey, the Alma Mater of the person who created this absolute trainwreck of a “ranking” system, appears within this table. It also ends up at the top of his “Canadian list”.

I have a sneaking feeling that his entire methodology for ranking was created backwards - he started with his university, and built a methodology which put it at the top of the Canadian list. He then used the same methodology on American colleges.

My point is that neither @hapi_daze789 nor anybody who is looking to select a college at which to pursue a degree in Economics should take this list seriously.

Just when I thought that I had seen the worst rankings systems in existence, this article pops up to demonstrate that there are many more out there that are even worse…

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The IB list logic would suggest those looking for a career in engineering should avoid Cal-tech.

As someone who has hired inside of 2 Big 4 firms and a Fortune 10 financial firm, I’m always amazed by the sheer numbers willing to accept lists and stats as proof. On-campus recruiting is a numbers game. Recruiters don’t go solely for quality, they are looking for critical mass. Where can they go to generate the largest number of heads for interviews. Wharton is a great school, because it has both quality and quantity. Penn State is great because of its size. Each of the firms I’ve worked for targeted schools for different reasons. My financial firm in NY targeted Clemson, because the guy running Ops globally with 65,000 people reporting to him was a Clemson grad.

My advice to the OP…go where you want to spend 4 years, not where you think you’ll have the best options for a job. When you get there, network. Talk to professors…spend time in the career office…find out where young alums work and make contact with them. Get yourself a summer job as early as possible (post first-year is the golden ticket…but no later than sophomore / junior year).

In the meantime…give yourself skills for the jobs you want. Learn the apps used in the departments you want to work in, and then learn the apps. Get certified at even a basic level. If you have any technical / computer aptitude…learn a coding language (python, R). Microsoft and Google are table stakes…learn the visualization and analytic tools Ibanks are using. The kids who really get ahead in finance firms are the ones with the technology skills. Learn those on your own…and go to school where you want. You’ll be fine.

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Is anyone willing to list the IB target schools from the list being criticized by @MWolf ?

Thank you in advance as this should facilitate further discussion.

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It’s a pain, since the table in the article is saved as an image, so whoever does it would need to copy each and every one of them…

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Target Schools

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The list seems reasonable based on what has been shared on other websites such as P & Q and Wall Street Oasis.

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It simply takes a bunch of colleges which are well known to have great programs in business, and arranges some of them in a ranked list. No added information, no added value, and many questionable omissions.

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The schools on the list are fairly well documented by lists posted on Poets & Quants.

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These discussions amuse me almost as much as the HS juniors posting “where should I go for undergrad in order to become an anesthesiologist”-- and then the junior gets huffy when he or she learns that FIRST you have to go to med school before a residency, fellowship, etc.

IB, Hedge Fund, Private Equity, VC, M&A, Bond trading, these are all different, and getting hired by DE Shaw or Bridgewater is a pretty different animal than getting hired by Credit Suisse. And most of these discussions seem to assume that you get “plucked out of obscurity” by some fabulous and prestigious institution and handed a huge salary and a pat on the back.

For anyone interested in a finance career- the most important element is YOU. You can grind your way through four years at Wharton focused on Finance and on the “right” EC’s and not get the offer you want from the institution you want. Or get the offer you want- and flush out quickly (yes, it happens) because it’s not what you thought it was, and you can’t bear to work 100 hours a week doing something you thought you’d love but which is hideous and dreadful.

“My advice to the OP…go where you want to spend 4 years, not where you think you’ll have the best options for a job.” This is great advice. Nobody saw 2008 coming- when banks frantically cut recruiting targets mid-cycle (when the world was collapsing), nobody saw Covid coming, many people saw 2001 coming (early in the year, not the 9/11 piece). You can graduate into a 2009-like trough when the really smart finance wannabee kids quickly retooled themselves into Tech/Startup folks; you can even graduate into a good old fashioned recession without a black swan type event (like the one I graduated from in the late 70’s/early 80’s) when the I-banking hordes were heading to Pepsi and calling themselves Financial Analysts.

Get an education. That’s the most important thing. The grinding and polishing and twisting and contorting only works if you know what you want to do. And how many 18 year old’s understand the difference between being a Metals and Mining analyst vs. an M&A Associate vs. developing high speed trading algorithms? All these folks can work at the same institution with RADICALLY different professional lives and career trajectories.

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@hapi_daze789: The reason that you are getting mixed responses with no clear answers is simply because none of your listed schools is a target or semi-target school for Wall Street recruiting.

Can you get to Wall Street for IB from other schools ? Yes, but it is a more difficult road in that you must take the initiative rather than having recruiters come to your school.

Odds. It’s all about playing the odds. The odds are better at target & semi-target schools.

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There isn’t a whole lot of IB recruiting still happening on campus even pre-Covid at targets and semi-targets. Networking to get Hirevues is the new name of the game. Then you have to nail the Hirevue to progress.

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