Top 10 Public Universities

College Search & Selection
41

<ol>
<li>Berkeley</li>
<li>UCLA</li>
<li>Univ. of Mich. </li>
<li>UCSD</li>
<li>Univ. of Virg. </li>
<li>Univ. of Texas-Austin</li>
<li>UNC-Chapel Hill</li>
<li>Univ. of Wisconsin</li>
<li>Univ. of Illinois-Urbana Champaign</li>
<li>UC Davis</li>
</ol>

42

<p>While UCLA is a great school, it benefits from California using a common application to submit records to as many UC schools as a person wishes to try to attend. I sincerely believe that this is what put UCLA above Michigan this year for the first time. If you look at individual departments by college/school, Michigan is higher rated overall academically. The sheer numbers of students that apply to UCLA among other UC schools from the most populous state in the country are what factor in to make it more selective. This is why I feel selectivity is overrated in some cases of the USNWR ratings.</p>

43

<ol>
<li>Michigan</li>
<li>Berkeley</li>
<li>UCLA</li>
<li>Wisconsin</li>
<li>Texas</li>
<li>Illinois</li>
<li>UCSD</li>
<li>Virginia</li>
<li>North Carolina</li>
<li>Washington</li>
</ol>

44

<ol>
<li>UCLA</li>
<li>Berkeley</li>
<li>Virginia</li>
<li>Michigan</li>
<li>Wisconsin</li>
<li>North Carolina</li>
<li>Illinois</li>
<li>Washington</li>
<li>Penn State University Park</li>
<li>Texas</li>
</ol>

45

<p>I have to disagree with some of these lists because UNC Chapel Hill and UVA are definitely higher than Michigan.</p>

<p>For the UCs, UCB then UCLA then UCSD or UCD.</p>

46

<p>


</p>

<p>Wow... I mean I can agree with the population/demographic/economic trends you mention, but do you really think Michigan would fall that far? As it stands now, it relies on tuition more than other publics and has the largest public university single campus endowment (~$6-$7.5B), so wouldn't it be sufficiently insulated from negative Rustbelt economy trends?</p>

47

<p>joewii. Tell me all of the programs at UVA and UNC that are higher rated then at Michigan.</p>

48

<p>JWT86. It's all wishful thinking on hawkette's part. Notice how she introduced a topic that had nothing to do with the original point of this thread? Anything that makes Michigan appear to be a top school she has to put a caveat in it. This has been done many times by her, a fact she always likes to deny.</p>

49

<p>JWT, I would not worry too much about Michigan. Not only is its endowment the 6th largest in the nation (behind only Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Princeton and MIT), but in the last 20 years, its endowment has outperformed that of all other universities by a sizeable margin and I do not foresee major financial troubles in the near or distant future. </p>

<p>Furthermore, the University of Michigan has no trouble attracting faculty and talented students from all over the nation and from all over the world. It is one of the most desirable and prestigious academic institutions on Earth, and the city of Ann Arbor is very attractive and appealing for both students and professors alike. </p>

<p>From a corporate recruitment and placement point of view, Michigan manages to attract recruiters from all industries from all over the nation. Whether Investment Banks or Management Consulting firms from the East Coast that plunder the University of Michigan annually or Tech (IT, Aerospace, Biotech) companies from the Midwest and West Coast that hire heavily from campus. </p>

<p>Recently, Michigan purchased major real estate and facilities from Pfizer for the bargain price of $108,000,000. We are talking about 2 million square feet and 200 acres of state-of-the-art, world-class, path-breaking facilities and labs worth close to half a billion dollars right off of the Engineering campus. </p>

<p>U-M</a> to buy Pfizer's former Ann Arbor property</p>

<p>On top of that, the University of Michigan has spent $500 million on developping the Life Sciences initiative over the last 6 years. All of this, along with the University's top 10 Medical School and top 10 hospital will ensure that the University remains a medical centre for the decades to come. </p>

<p>In short, if the future of humanity lies in the sciences, Michigan's top 10 Engineering programs and Life Sciences programs along with its extremely powerful, spreadout and loyal alumni base, its significant and rapidly growing endowment and global reputation among academics and corporations will keep the university at the top of the academic ladder.</p>

50

<p>
[quote]
1. Michigan
1. Berkeley
3. UCLA
4. Wisconsin
4. Texas
4. Illinois
4. UCSD
8. Virginia
8. North Carolina
10. Washington

[/quote]
</p>

<p>winner winner, chicken dinner.</p>

51

<p>For undergrad:</p>

<ol>
<li><p>Berkeley</p></li>
<li><p>Michigan</p></li>
<li><p>UVa</p></li>
<li><p>William & Mary</p></li>
<li><p>UCLA</p></li>
<li><p>UNC</p></li>
<li><p>UT-Austin</p></li>
<li><p>UIUC</p></li>
<li><p>UC San Diego</p></li>
<li><p>Wisconsin</p></li>
</ol>

52

<p>I anticipated that my ranking would be challenged and that is why I added a few of the reasons. If it is helpful, here is a fuller explanation of my list:</p>

<ol>
<li>William & Mary</li>
<li>UC Berkeley</li>
<li>U Virginia</li>
<li>UCLA</li>
<li>U Texas</li>
<li>U North Carolina</li>
<li>UCSD</li>
<li>U Wisconsin</li>
<li>U Washington</li>
<li>U Michigan</li>
</ol>

<p>First, I like schools that have shown a strong commitment to undergraduate teaching and those that have consistently shown up in various surveys/measurements are William & Mary, U Virginia, and U North Carolina. </p>

<p>Second, I prefer colleges that have stronger student bodies as I believe that the learning from one's peers is often an important aspect of the undergraduate academic experience. UC Berkeley leads in this category today and the demographic changes in the USA favor their holding and perhaps even building on this. Ditto for what I expect will be improvements at UCLA, U Texas, UCSD and U Washington as Asian and Hispanic immigrants bolster the populations and student selectivity in California, Texas, and Washington.</p>

<p>Third, I prefer colleges that provide smaller class sizes for their students. W&M clearly wins on this metric and has an 11/1 student/faculty ratio. Also, most folks probably don't recognize that U Washington also has an 11/1 S/F ratio.</p>

<p>Fourth, while ten years might prove too short a time frame, there are large trends affecting the USA and which work to the detriment of northern, industrial states like Michigan. Population and jobs are leaving states like Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania and, barring some unexpected changes, they're not coming back. State budgets are already under severe pressure from the poor economy and these trends will accelerate the financial cutbacks. </p>

<p>Fifth, the degree to which public universities enroll OOS students may be increasingly impacted by comparatively high tuition rates. Public universities with high tuition rates (particularly for OOS students) will find it more difficult to raise rates while those with large OOS populations (30%+) at relatively low rates will have more latitude to raise rates, eg, U Wisconsin. </p>

<p>Immigration trends can work both ways for states. Large numbers of Hispanics coming into Texas/California and large numbers of Asians rolling into Western states can create financial/infrastructure burdens for those states. But many of these immigrants come from a culture that values education and my belief is that this could ultimately work to the benefit of places like U Texas, Texas A&M, the UC schools, U Washington, etc. by improving their average student quality. </p>

<p>As for the placement of U Michigan in my rankings, partly this reflects my view of U Michigan (very good state undergrad, truly excellent grad programs which are the primary reasons for its strong rep among academia) and where I see these trends affecting a school like that. To a degree, U Michigan will be able to mitigate some of this as they have a large endowment (though not nearly so big when measured on a per capita basis). But I see them as swimming upstream against these negative, long-term demographic trends. Others may see it differently and I would expect that the Michigan partisans on this board will strongly disagree.</p>

<p>Other states also face financial pressures and it is clear that state funding for higher education is a problem that, in most states, will get worse and potentially far worse. California is also under great pressure, but there is a much larger population and a much bigger and more diversified economy. Parts of their system will be impacted, but IMO the top UCs of Berkeley, LA and SD will remain excellent places.</p>

53

<p>No hawkette, you shouldn't be able to post things like factually based opinions when you discuss Michigan....Michigan is and will always be just as good as any school in the country and Michigan people won't hear it any other way, right rjkofnovi? </p>

<p>Hawkette, your posts are, as always, refreshing and very well thought out. I wasn't surprised that rjkofnovi has started to attack your character as a person for your beliefs on Michigan, as he did with me recently. I'm sure it will not be long until you go from being called "pompous" to just being called an "idiot" that has no idea what you're talking about. </p>

<p>Wow rjkofnovi, you can't stand other people's opinions when they disagree from your own and when they don't hold Michigan is such high esteem as you do. You are content with just calling all of these people that disagree idiots, or some of variation of criticism, and living in your own reality. You really are sad.</p>

54

<p>Not everyone here is an idiot. I never called hawkette an idiot. I just said that she has an agenda. Which she does. That's my opinion and I'm entitled to it. Now if someone stated that PsU is as good as Michigan, that is where the idiot remark might get inserted.</p>

55

<p>Ha, wow, you never cease to amaze me. Michigan is nowhere near the school you think it is, at least not on the undergraduate level. I doubt you would have even been able to get into any of the graduate programs. rjkofnovi, everyone that does not think as highly as you do of Michigan does not have an agenda, nor are they idiots. You are entitled to your opinion, even though it often seems to be far from anything resembling the truth. The problem with discussing something with you is that you are obviously not a rational person that can think reasonably. Ha, another slight, this time directed toward Penn State and its graduates. Your insecurity must eat at you terribly. Penn State UP is a great school, just like Michigan. I sincerely hope that you are not the best "Michigan Man" that michigan's undergraduate eduction has produced.</p>

56

<p>While there is no denying that Penn State is a great school, I think Michigan is head and shoulders above PSU when it comes to academics (although not so much when it comes to football). And believe me, I'm pretty impartial when it comes to the two.</p>

57

<p>Actually until this year, Michigan had a 9 game winning streak against PsU. This past season however they did indeed stink.</p>

58

<p>Let's check on some facts here...</p>

<p>
[quote]
Second, I prefer colleges that have stronger student bodies... UC Berkeley leads in this category today

[/quote]

Please explain how's UCB holding the lead today. And please tell who's #2.</p>

<p>
[quote]
what I expect will be improvements at UCLA, U Texas, UCSD and U Washington as Asian and Hispanic immigrants bolster the populations and student selectivity in California, Texas, and Washington.

[/quote]

Asians I can understand as that's the stereotype today. But Hispanic? How would having large inflex of Hispanic immigrants help boost the selectivity of the state? Are they not going to count as URM any more 10 years from now?</p>

59

<p>Although Penn State is a good school, Michigan is definitely better academically. </p>

<p>It's always been Michigan and Berkeley standing as the best public universities in the nation. The University of Michigan has excellent reputation in almost every aspect:
1. Academic strengths ==> almost all of the academic departments are ranked top 10 in the nation
2. Athletic pride
3. School spirit
4. One of the largest and best alumni networks
5. Location ==> Ann Arbor has always been known as one of the best college towns
6. Huge endowment value that surpasses most private colleges
7. Excellent and well-diversified student body ==> Michigan's ranked as one of the top 20 most selective schools by the US News ranking
8. And above all that, the university is still spending billions to grow!!
<a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/31/realestate/commercial/31michigan.html?_r=1%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/31/realestate/commercial/31michigan.html?_r=1&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

60

<p>[ul][<em>]College of William & Mary
[</em>]University of California-Berkeley
[<em>]University of California-Los Angeles
[</em>]University of California-San Diego
[<em>]University of Illinois-Urbana Champaign
[</em>]University of Michigan
[<em>]University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill
[</em>]University of Texas-Austin
[<em>]University of Virginia
[</em>]University of Washington
[li]University of Wisconsin-Madison[/ul]</p>[/li]
<p>Honorable mentions:
Ohio State University
Pennsylvania State University-University Park
University of Minnesota-Twin Cities</p>

<p>One can get an excellent education at any of these universities, so I refuse to rank them.</p>