<p>I’d also put Texas ahead of Florida.</p>
<p>1.Cal
2.UCLA
3.UVA
4.UMichigan
5.UNC
6.Georgia Tech
7.UWisconsin
8.UIllinois
9.Williams&Mary
10.UWashington</p>
<p>UCB
U-M
UCLA</p>
<p>and then the rest…</p>
<p>IMO UCLA’s prestige is overrated in most of the rankings above.</p>
<p>I look at departmental rankings at the graduate level. IMO they do translate to undergraduate education. Schools like UNC and UVA, who are relatively weak in important disciplines like the natural sciences, are the one’s who are a bit overrated.</p>
<p>Important disciplines? How very arbitrary.</p>
<p>Hardly. UNC does better than UVa on this BTW. UVa went so far as to hire a consulting firm to assess many of their important disciplines and try to determine what they needed to do to improve. A plan was put into place but has since been polaced on hold as they found it very difficult to just go out and hire superstar faculty–and too expensive.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>How? Most grad students and profs could care less about undergrads, and this includes TA’s.</p>
<p>Most profs spend equal time with UG and grad students and are happy to work with serious undergrad students. Your assertion is just BS.</p>
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</p>
<p>So shouldn’t profs that teach undergrads be covered in undergraduate rankings?</p>
<p>It would be nice but nobody does department rankings for undergrad except in business and engineering. The general undergrad ranking is very broad and covers more than just faculty quality. The grad dept rankings focus very much on faculty in each dept.</p>
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<p>Didn’t realize that, but it seems to make sense. Thanks.</p>
<p>barrons,
With an undergraduate student population of 18,000, how many of them do you think the faculty would consider “serious undergrad students?”</p>
<p>UCLA, UCB, Michigan, UVA, UT-Austin, UNC-Chapel Hill, Georgia Tech, Illinois, William and Mary, the state school parts of Cornell</p>
<p>Anyone who wants to be. Most would complain about the other side of the equation–too few students who want to spend extra time getting to know and work with a professor. Many are happy to take the classes, do the work and move along. Only a few take advantage of office hours and getting to know profs on a personal level.</p>
<p>I’m not disputing that this stuff is available. I’m just curious to know how frequently students avail themselves of these opportunities. For kids above freshmen year, what percentage would you guess are seen by faculty as “serious undergrad students?” How do the numbers change from sophs to juniors to seniors?? And would these numbers be materially different at a U Wisconsin vs a U Virginia (two that you know well) or vs a U North Carolina (which has no engineering)?</p>
<p>Hawkette, why would it make a difference whether a school has 18,000 undergrads or 6,000 undergrads. At smaller schools, it is common for a professor to teach two or three different intro-level classes at once. That would never happen at a school like Michigan, UNC or UVa. Bottom line, for intro level classes, faculty will be stretched, regardless of the size of the school. </p>
<p>Typically, faculty will not have much time to give for students taking intro-level courses. However, for intermediate and advanced classes, faculty at any top university will meet the needs of all their students.</p>
<p>I think there are many serious students at both. 70-80% of those are probably very happy taking the classes, getting good grades, having a social life and doing some ECs. The others are intensely interested in their major or a topic and plan to go on in that area and want to get very in depth–do research, get on a first name basis with profs, etc. It might be a little greater in engineering because they spend lots of time on projects, do co-ops, and join some of the many competitive clubs that are active in national engineering competitions all of which include some faculty advisors. Also a terminal BS in engineering is more employment ready than one in history or biochem.</p>
<p>alex,
I’m trying to learn the scale. I’m trying to understand the context as well. Are we talking about 5% of the sophs, 10% of the juniors, 20% of the seniors who faculty would consider as “serious students” and who merit their attention/assistance/mentorship/recommendations? General numbers. And does the experience differ sharply by institution or by departmental custom? I don’t know the answers. Maybe it’s not possible to generalize. I don’t know.</p>
<p>^ hawkette, no one can answer your silly question. Top public universities admit 100% “serious students”.</p>