Trip Report, Rensselaer Polytecnic Institute (Long)

Parents Forum
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<p>We returned last night from Troy, after having attended the Rensselaer Medalist visiting day yesterday, and I thought I'd post some info and some impressions. Naturally, they put their best foot forward for these kids and their parents. We were told that Medalists made up 24% of the class of 2009 of about 1200.</p>

<p>Facilities: The buildings and grounds were impressively maintained. Even the oldest buildings c. 1850 were absolutely immaculate. The architecture is a blend of old and new, with many of the new buildings designed to be "old" outside. My H had the impression that it was "dark," but I think this was partly a matter of the exceptionally bright day and that we were constantly moving in and out of shadow. The campus is primarily rectangular, and is on a slope that ranges from slight to precipitous in the longer direction. This results in most of the buildings being asymmetical in design, with half floors and wings depending on the slope. Landscaping is nothing special, but adequate. All over the campus one sees reminders of how old the Institute is--there is tradition everywhere, from the football field given by the class of 1886, to the huge water turbine built into the lobby of the main engineering building, to the sepia photos of 19th century scientists holding class which adorn the various buildings.</p>

<p>The classrooms and labs were very impressive--everything completely up to date with the most modern accoutrements. H, who is a chemist (Ph.D), was amazed at the organic chem labs--they looked spitshined. The computer center is astounding, having been placed inside a lovely gothic Catholic church previously acquired from a small seminary, complete with stained glass windows. Every technological advance was evident, & the entire campus is both wired and wireless outfitted, including the oldest buildings. The newest building is the Biotech center, opened this year. It is one of a very few modern buildings I have been in that manages to be futuristic and at the same time in scale with human beings. They are in the process of building a new Arts Center, which is scheduled to open in 2007, and if it's half as well done will be marvelous.</p>

<p>There are a lot of athletic facilities, including a SOTA fitness center (although we did not see it). The student union was attractive and appeared to be well used. We toured the most recently built freshman dorms. The rooms were large and mostly suite-style with 2 doubles sharing a central bath. There were well equipped common rooms with TV, game room, laundry, rudimentary kitchen on one level, and smallish glassed-in "meeting" rooms where study groups could meet. We were told the most desirable upperclassmen dorms were the oldest ones, mostly because they were centrally located on the oldest part of campus. There are, though, a variety of living spaces for upperclassmen.</p>

<p>Academic Ethos: We attended a panel discussion of the deans of the six schools--IT, Management, Science, Humanities & Social Science, Engineering and Architecture. They all seemed to be very down-to-earth, unpretentious, and completely enthusiastic about their own domains. There was much good-humored poking at each other, but also much respect. There is a tremendous focus on interdisciplinary teaching, learning, and research. </p>

<p>S, H, and I all got the impression that RPI is a very serious place. They see their graduates as going out and making a difference in the world. They are very focused on making sure the students emerge sort of as ambassadors of technology, docents to non-techies, as it were. We definitely got the feeling that RPI grads have a mission to give back to the society.</p>

<p>Next section, student life--got to go get some brunch :)</p>

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<p>We met quite a few students, from freshmen only 2 weeks in to grad students, many of whom we just stopped in the middle of the campus to ask questions. Even so, we didn't get an overly rosy version from the student admission representatives either.</p>

<p>The social life seems to be fairly well grounded--most of the kids we talked to had a variety of interests, rather than just one. We were told that about 30% of the student body pledged a fraternity or sorority, and the biggest appeal seemed to be to be a part of a stable group of people that wasn't based on academic or avocational interests, like a house system at other colleges. We watched the second half of the season-opening football game (Div3); not great attendance but we were told that the real passion on campus was hockey (Div1). Since it was the beginning of the year, there were lots of posters & signs to entice students to clubs of every description. There was a lot going on.</p>

<p>The male students complain about the lack of girls--only 27% female students. The female students don't complain at all--I pointedly asked a few if they ever felt overwhelmed by it. They feel safe, appreciated, and, if anything, over-represented in leadership positions in clubs and student government. We met several senior women, and they were all tremendously confident.</p>

<p>We were told that although far-away students were greatly outnumbered, that by midway first semester, the students stayed on campus weekends for the most part. </p>

<p>The biggest disappointment was, hands down, the downtown of Troy. We went walking at about 4:00 pm Saturday, and it was deserted. There are lovely old buildings, mostly vacant. Most shops, even bookstores, were closed. It was really quite amazing, considering that there was an academic community of 6500 students + faculty and staff less than 1/2 mile away up the hill. OK, up the exceptionally steep hill ;). Troy needs a lot of practical renovation to make something happen here. With my "city-planner hat" on, it looked to me like basic infrastructure and safety had been compromised in favor of glitzier projects such as public housing, fancy government buildings (town hall, visitor center, and the like) and parking garages.</p>

<p>Other notes if you plan to visit:
We flew into Albany airport & rented a car. We stayed at the Century House Hotel (independent) in Latham, about 1/2 way between airport and campus. Much nicer than the Best Western in Troy, less expensive than the chain hotels in Albany, full breakfast included.
Had a great meal at LoPorto Italian restaurant on 4th Street in Troy. It's in an old rowhouse, has marvelously fresh homemade Italian food, and a TON of it, moderate in price, very good service, but no ambiance to speak of after you get past the bar which is right in front.</p>

<p>I guess that's it--if anyone has questions I'll give them my best shot.</p>

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<p>I just browsed through their website. Do you know percentage of merit aid? $43,000. looks like a lot of money to us!!!!</p>

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<p>It is a lot of money.</p>

<p>$60,000 over 4 years per Medalist winner, and that's not the only merit aid available. They are very generous with merit aid. They mentioned about 1/4 of this year's freshman class are Medalists, so that's about 300 x 15,000 = 4,500,000 there. I imagine they lose a few over 4 years, but probably not a whole lot. They did not give us stats on other merit money, but the catalog is full of named merit scholarships.</p>

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<p>Thank you for the report. My son is interested in RPI, but is just entering his junior year. If he is awarded the medal, he will certainly go look at it. I am concerned about the lack of girls, and the fact that a close of friend of ours, who just finished a PhD there, says he doesn't think it makes a good school for an undergrad experience (he went to Michigan State). So, I don't know what to think about that. Maybe it depends on the kid - how singularly focused they are?</p>

<p>Troy has long been considered possibly the worst city in all of upstate NY. It has been in a severe depression for as long as I've been alive. It is too bad, but there are lots of struggling upstate communities and it is probably too late to save Troy.</p>

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<p>My husband failed to graduate from RPI (because he started his first company in their incubator program and it took off) and over the years I've met many RPI graduates. My son had it on his short list and I've recommended it to several students who didn't meet MIT or CalTech standards. Yes, Troy is an armpit. Many student choose to go to Montreal, NYC, or Boston for city-type recreation as a result. However, RPI itself is excellent and rising in its reputation in engineering circles. It's received massive donations in recent years and seems to be putting the money to good use.</p>

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<p>Yes, RPI is a great school. One of our son's friends got in there with a medalion scholarship worth 50K over 5 years.He chose not to go there for following reasons, which you mentioned somewhat:</p>

<ol>
<li>He hated Troy. It was considered by him to be the armpit of NY.</li>
<li>He really didn't like the male-female ratio.</li>
<li>Even with the scholarship, it was much more expensive than the University of Maryland even if he had to pay full instate tuition,which he didn't since he got a partial scholarship from Maryland</li>
</ol>

<p>However, I have always considered it a very top notch school of the caliber of MIT or CMU.</p>

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<p>Taxguy, you're on target. At the panel discussion one of the questions was "who are your competitors for students?" It varied somewhat among the six schools, but always there was CMU and MIT.</p>

<p>Birder, I'd take your friend's assessment in stride. After all, his undergraduate experience was in a completely different setting, with many more students, Div1 sports, and so forth. It's not comparable at all. On the plus side, we were assured that professors teach ALL classes, that 99% of all classes are capped at 55 students and that most are well under 30. Every student is required to do original research in order to graduate. There's no way Mich State could do that.</p>

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<p>Wyggal, yes, you are right in that professors teach most classes. However, check out the campus dirt web site for RPI. You will need to register, which is free, before you can get info. YOu would then click on each category to see the comments. The professors got 2 starts out of 5. The main reasons were as follows</p>

<ol>
<li><p>complaints that many faculty didn't speak english well enough to be understood. This is a very thematic problem found in technical schools. RPI seems to have a real problem with this according to the site.</p></li>
<li><p>Lack of undergraduate focus: Some kids felt that the professors were much more interested in research than in teaching. In fact, one teacher didn't even show up for his own tests!</p></li>
</ol>

<p>I can't give you the url campus dirt because it violates the TOS policy here. Just do a search for campus dirt and register your name. Also check out Students review.</p>

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<p>Originaloog, a parent here, has a son at RPI. His son chose RPI after receiving a terrific scholarship and is quite happy and satisfied with his experience there. You might want to do a search here in the parents board for Originaloog's past posts on his son's experiences--</p>

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<p>I was so glad to see this post. My son attended the Open House on Saturday as well and was very impressed with RPI. I had also seen the comments on campusdirt.com and would be interested in comments from other parents and/or current students on how the professors interact with the students.</p>

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<p>One of my best friends graduated there in 99. He went to Columbia for his Masters, and now works in New York City.</p>

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<p>First, regarding campusdirt: I am not a big fan of that site. They do not tell you how many students gave comments - was it a single student? Five students? A hundred? You have no way of determining and thus can not tell if this is really how a majority of students feel, or if it is just a tiny number of students. Also remember that the site "edits" comments so you don't get to put the comments there in context. Therefore, I'd take any so-called "ratings" there with a grain of salt. </p>

<p>A better site, in my mind, is studentsreview.com - they let you know exactly how many students have participated, they do not edit student comments, and many of the students who post list their emails so you can contact them directly to follow up. There are 80 student comments on the site for RPI, and academic quality has an A- rating from them. (Social life does get a C) But at least you can read the comments within context, and know they have not been edited.</p>

<p>Even then, however, keep in mind that unhappy students are much more likely to spend time posting on these sorts of sites than happy students. And, let's face it, no school is going to fit everyone. I would use sites like this as a data point, but I'd do my own investigation to see whether any particular school is a fit for any particular child.</p>

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<p>Campus, I think you are especially correct about the campus dirt site. However, it should be reviewed to see if there are any complaints that need further investigation. That is all that I use it and students review for.</p>

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<p>I totally agree Taxguy (first time I've been called campus...does that mean I am actually starting to turn into a college? :) )</p>

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<p>Damn, I was typing without my reading glasses. I guess I was thinking of "campus dirt" when I typed your name. No Fraudian slip was intended. Sorry :)</p>

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<p>Good for a chuckle. :)</p>

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<p>First lets be honest and acknowledge that Rensselaer is not a good "fit" for many students, even for those interested in the physical sciences and engineering. However is does offer its students excellent academics, a fact known by both grad schools and industry. It offers a number of unique interdisciplinary undergraduate majors and some majors permit students to begin graduate studies senior year provided they have a gpa which qualify them for graduate admissions. Our son has worked out a preliminary schedule with his advisor which will enable him to complete 15 of the 30 credit hours required for an MS degree which would be nice seeing as how he receives $25,000 in merit scholaarships per year. BTW, none of his merit scholarships are dependent on maintaining a certain minimum GPA which was a factor in choosing RPI over Case. In addition his interdisciplinary compsci/cogsci program requires a senior thesis via the Rensselaer Artificial Intelligence and Reasoning(RAIR) Lab.</p>

<p>Regarding the professors, informality seems to be typical as he has been on a first name basis with most of his professors thus far. He has not encountered a language problem either. Checking thru the college catalogue about 25% of the faculty may be from non-english speaking countries and of these a large majority received their PhD at US univeristies. Therefore I doubt this should be much of a problem. If it crops up anywhere it would be with TA's responsible for recitation and lab sections.</p>

<p>Now about the social environment. Like all colleges today, there are lots to do on campus. However at Rensselaer men outnumber women 3 to 1. However coeds at Russell Sage and, further afield, at St Rose, Skidmore and Sienna seem to fill some of the void. I do not know how common our son's social life was, but his social circle regularly went to off campus shows, several which were at nearby colleges such a Albany and Amherst. They also took weekend road trips to Prividence, the Finger Lakes, Boston, NYC and Montreal twice. </p>

<p>While there is on-campus housing for only about 55% of undergrads, many upper classmen, our son included, seem anxious to move into an off campus apartment. Also I suspect that about 20% of the men live in fraternity houses. The bottom line being, that I suspect few upper class students are closed out of on campus housing if that is what they desire. </p>

<p>Troy is better than many old cities along the Hudson river but, yes, it is nothing to write home about. Because it sets high above downtown Troy, the campus does seem separated from the town.</p>

<p>The weather?? Hey, its about 30 miles from Bennington, Vt and Amherst, Ma so it is a recipient of those New England winters and the spring mud season. Want better weather, you'd better head south.</p>

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<p>Originaloog, thank you so much for relating your son's experience. It is great to hear that he has a great relationship with his professors. I was quite surprised that my son was so excited by RPI - he has all along wanted a rural environment. He did comment that there wasn't much "green" space, but he didn't seem to mind it. One question he forgot to ask - is there chem-free housing. I couldn't find anything on their website. Thanks again</p>

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<p>Palermo, I do not think that they have chem-free housing. For whatever reason, Rensselaer has not gotten on the theme housing bandwagon. Because of the nature of the "Tute" I do not believe that drug or alcohol use is as prevelent as most other colleges. Don't get ne wrong, it is a factor with its students but a little bit less widespread. I believe all dorms are coed too, segregated by floor or wing.</p>

<p>About 1/3 of the male student body are in fraternities but there is no "fraternity row" so their influence on campus is not as significant at other colleges. I'd estimate that about 1/2 of the houses are close to campus and the remainder scattered about various neighborhoods. Our son pledged a fraternity but did not become an initiate, though he is still friend with a number of the brothers. Their house was at least a mile off campus.</p>