Ugh...LSAT advice...

Graduate School Law School
1

<p>Alright, I hate asking this question but I'm doing it anyway b/c I'd really like some outside opinions.</p>

<p>I took the Sept. LSAT and scored 164, which is along the very bottom range of "not totally unsurprising" for me. Previous scores had been 167-170ish, but had occasionally bottomed out around my actual score. My GPA is 3.87 or so from Scripps, which is not renowned for inflation. I'll graduate with Latin honors as well as an honors major. I have better than average ECs that are relevant to my future goals.</p>

<p>My PROBLEM is that the schools I'm aiming for are, by and large, out of my LSAT range. Hoping to have scored in the top part of "not totally unsurprising," I felt justified in looking at Georgetown, NYU, Berkeley, USC, UCLA (noting that even with a higher score, some would still be good reaches). I'm also looking at a few safeties/matches that I should still be totally fine with (Chapman, most notably). My concern here is with reach schools.</p>

<p>My question is whether or not to retake the LSAT in December, knowing that it's generally frowned upon. Logically, I don't feel that it could really hurt me. If I do better, which is most likely, then a few of those schools will take the highest score, and even an average will be good. If I do worse, then I feel like I'll be just as out of the running at those schools as I am now, while I'll still be totally fine for the lower ranked schools at which I'm looking. I really, truly don't want to take the test again, but I'm also unsatisfied with my score from the first set b/c it doesn't seem like it leaves me much hope of getting where I want to go.</p>

<p>So, opinions are very welcome here. Am I justified in thinking that this is something I should really do, or is it naive to think that retaking it will help?</p>

<p>ETA: I recognize that 164 is a respectable score. It was a disappointment, but was also within my range of expectation. Juuust clarifying...my problem with the score is that I don't think it'll get me where I want to be, not that I think it's poor.</p>

2

<p>I think I see the situation the same way you do. Your very respectable score will get you into some great schools-- but if your "dream" schools are Georgetown, NYU etc. a 164 ain't gonna do it.
If you feel the 164 will get you into some schools that you can see yourself going to, I do not think you have anything to lose in taking the test again. As you have had higher practice scores, I think you should give it another try.
My d may very well find herself in a similar situation. She is going to take the test this December and her score will dictate what schools she has a shot of getting into. As we live in the NYC area, a 164 should get her into Brooklyn or Cardoza- but as she too would like to go to NYU or Columbia, I would proably suggest she take the test a second time especially if some practice test showed she could score higher.
I would hate to think that one sitting of one test can really derail your dreams. I think you should at least give it a second try.
Take note- they are suppossedly changing the format of the LSAT exam starting 6/07. The reading comprehension portion is going to be a bit different. Therefore I think a bit of strategy may come into play--
If you are relunctant to take the current test again, might it be beneficial to take the new formatted test?? It could work in your favor-- but then again, it may not. It really is a gamble as no one has seen the new test format. I do not mean to confuse your choices, but I just want you to know the LSAT's are changing soon. As I said my d could def. be in a similar situation, so I too am curious what others have to say.</p>

3

<p>Law school, unlike undergraduate, will offer different opportunities at different schools. On the west coast, you can have a fair number of opportunities at lower-ranked schools than you would on the East Coast, but, generally, the better the school, the more doors that will be open. (Whether or not you want those doors to be open or even care about those doors is a topic for another thread.) Generally, grad school matters more than undergrad.</p>

<p>Generally, law schools cost the same no matter where you go. I do think that it is worth it to, since you're going to spend $150,000 or so on your degree (at least at a private), that you do it right.</p>

<p>Given that, I would suggest re-taking the LSAT if you are positive that you can do better. Seriously consider taking a year off and doing a February or a June test to ensure that you get the best score that you can get. You are in the situation where the LSAT that you've gotten on the practice tests v. the actual LSAT score really will make or break you. It is, in the long run, really worth it to do law school right. Don't do it halfway; don't settle for what you can get after undergrad. (Of course, I'm a huge, massive, enourmous fan of taking time off during your education!) </p>

<p>No one on this board can answer your question for you, but we can give some related advice and rephrase the questions that you are asking. The questionn that you should ask yourself is, "What is it worth to go to a top-tier school?" If it's worth an extra year delay for law school, worth spending two or three or six months, holed up, doing the LSAT until you can ace it, and worth spending a year figuring out how to make a decent use of your time while you apply, then re-take the LSAT. If a top-notch law school is'nt worth much to you, then you could re-take in December or not; submit apps anyway. </p>

<p>I do think that a lot of people (and I was one of them) didn't get enough practice with a one-shot, winner-take-all, timed test so that the actual LSAT was a bit unnerving. (I knew in high school that the PSAT didn't matter; my scores on that were good enough for the SAT, and when I took the SAT, I knew I could re-take. The LSAT threw me for a loop, and I wished I had practiced more so that it would be second nature.) That is why I would not really suggest December, especially if you have not been prepping up until this point.</p>

<p>Just my take.</p>

4

<p>Aries- I am going to agree with your sentiments too. If d's score is not what she is hoping it would be, we may also suggest she take the year off to work and gain experience and then tackle the LSAT's again.<br>
You may as well do Law school "right". If it means starting a year later but going to the Law school you really want to be in, then I think it is worth the re-test and starting the following year.</p>

<p>Of course after 2 tries and if the results are similar, I think it is then necessary to re-evaluate where you can realistically get into Law School. But I really hate the idea that one sitting of this one exam can have such a tremendous influence on the rest of your life. </p>

<p>And that sentiment holds true for everyone, not just the OP.
Be very proud of your score- it really is a good first attempt at the LSAT's-- and I am sure you will find success with the whole Law school admissions process. Good luck.</p>

5

<p>
[quote]
But I really hate the idea that one sitting of this one exam can have such a tremendous influence on the rest of your life.

[/quote]
Not that I disagree, but there's at least a good reason for it. Law school exams are one per course, end of the year, and grades matter a lot. People who perform well in an LSAT situation can probably handle the fact that they have exaclty one shot, per course, at a good grade. People who need several small tests or several shots at the same material will struggle with the set-up of law school (not necessarily the material).</p>

<p>If/until law schools change their grading schemes, the LSAT and the suggestion to take it exactly once will have a lot of validity. The problems that you have with the LSAT echo those that are found in law school.</p>

6

<p>this is somewhat unrelated, but about 75 percent of people i've heard from scored lower than they expected (including myself).</p>

<p>I would try to replicate the test conditions better when you take practice exams (even take 5 sections like the real thing).</p>

7

<p>Thanks for the advice. Bearing it well in mind, I did sign up for the Dec. test. I wanted to register sooner than later at this point (in part b/c a highly unfortunate aspect of the Sep. test was that my test center was quite far away. 6am is so not the way to begin that day). </p>

<p>Before the Sep. test, I'd taken a good number of practice exams under realistic conditions (all sections, classroom exams, proctored, unknown "experimental" and so forth). While it would be great to wait and take the June test, and while there are obvious benefits of waiting before law school, it's not an ideal option for me at this point. I might not GO to law school next year, but I do need to apply now, which I realize is kind of bizarre (and not wonderful). If it turns out that I just need to rethink my whole situation, then that's a bridge I'm prepared to cross. We shall see.</p>

<p>Meanwhile, thanks very much for the input. Between CC, parents, career services, and my own intuition, I'm sure enough of doing this that I'm willing to suck up my distaste for the whole affair! Kicks in the right direction never hurt.</p>

<p>And Marny, good luck to your daughter!</p>