Given the lower cost and reported easier path to your desired major, I would choose UNC. There is no shortage of opportunities.
Even though I said go Unc there have been some comments about not staying in Michigan after graduation. First thing lots of people do. They have some of the nicest suburbs around. People have also been moving into the city to areas like Midtown that are booming with young professionals.
Saying that, schools like Michigan are an international brand. Don’t want to stay in Michigan then don’t apply or interview with companies with positions in Michigan. It’s as simple as that. Other schools are regional brands and staying local is more common.
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Absolutely true! Do lots of graduates stay in New Jersey and Connecticut after attending Princeton and Yale? Many on CC sing the praises of Notre Dame, yet it’s just located outside a pretty dismal city in Indiana. Dartmouth in upstate Vermont, etc. It doesn’t matter where you attend school as long as it has a national/international reputation.
This is all very true and will continue to grow from here. The pandemic has shifted so many virtual. Virtual career fairs, info sessions, interviewing, etc. At first I didn’t care for that, but it appears to be a more cost effective / productive way for firms to recruit.
When S was going through his internship search, he was overseas during the key semester (fall of junior yr). I wasn’t happy about that and had advised him to put that off until the spring as he would miss out on OCR, in person networking, etc. Thought it was a major disadvantage. Well he was hired by a leading company in its industry all from afar. Everything was done online. This was pre-pandemic. Ironically the next semester was the pandemic so good thing he went when he did. Then all the virtual career fairs started and I’ve noticed many schools have continued that format because the employers prefer it. I’m sure they still visit certain schools but the tech and a positive experience have opened up access to many more schools. If the school is on the firm’s radar, it can have a national, international reach. Other less prominent schools place better regionally.
@Knowsstuff and @rjkofnovi I don’t believe I said that no out of staters ever settled in Michigan, and I provided an actual example of an elite college located in an area where few if any graduates will take up permanent residence.
The distinction here is that Michigan is a public university, hugely funded by (even full-pay OOS do not cover the cost of their education) and operated for the benefit of the state, and that it has an enormous OOS population.
I think it is a slightly strange, then, for a NY/NJ/CT (or IL, CA, MD, etc) resident to attend Michigan, spend zero time in the state (and even speak dismissively of it) beyond their 36 non-consecutive months of academic instruction, and then endlessly hype the school and paint their face blue and gold to watch football games at Michigan bars on the Upper East Side, in NW DC, Back Bay, etc, well into their 30s and beyond. I understand that this is a very niche gripe, and I don’t expect everyone to agree.
Hi, I hope you don’t think my comments were directed at you per se. Just the notion of staying local. Michigan is also not hugely financed by the state. It get some money but one reason it is 51%instate /49% out of state is due to the lack of funding for a large public. It also is not a typical public. It runs like a private school. The endowment is not a typical public one. Avg family wealth is something like $160,000. Not typical at a public.
The advantages are 45 majors in top 10. Outstanding facility and faculty. It’s really one of the best bargains out there for an instate kid.
People make a big deal out of alumni and their there but you got to go after them also.
Tons of public ARE regional schools and nothing wrong with that at all. Michigan is just not one of them.
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“Hugely funded” by the State of Michigan? Is 13% huge?
https://publicaffairs.vpcomm.umich.edu/key-issues/tuition/general-fund-budget-tutorial/
“U-M continues to rely on funding from the state of Michigan as an integral source of financial support. In FY 2021, state educational appropriations returned to pre-pandemic levels and totaled $373 million. We are extremely grateful to the residents of the state of Michigan for their ongoing support of higher education and the University of Michigan.”
Seems like the school considers it pretty huge, but I am sure they would love to hear your ideas on where ~$400 million can be cut without a massive reduction in headcount, decreasing undergraduate FA, substantially increasing tuition, and/or imprudently drawing down the endowment.
I’d add that upon graduation students at either school can likely find employment anywhere they like. The other thing is, there are more graduates who settle locally at UNC/UMichigan than a non-state school like Princeton.
Since there are more students as a % who are in state. You are going to have more stay after graduation than at NYU with more people from out of state to begin with.
UMichigan and UNC are great schools and very similar in outcomes in my opinion but having lots of local folks can help a lot when you first graduate. My '22 applied to and was accepted at UMichigan. I had no idea how outstanding it was. So if people don’t know the reputation of a school it can hurt outcomes. I had also barely heard of UNC before visiting. We live in NE so there are hundreds of colleges in Boston and the area. People tend to stay local as they can find all shapes and sizes. That’s changing but slowly.
You can get anywhere you want to go from either school. And that’s the bottom line IMO. I wouldn’t pay a premium for UMichigan. On the other hand, there are schools which I would pay an extra 100K. Program would have to be a solid fit and top in its field.
That sounds like pleasantries a company puts into an annual report.
According to the Washington Post, Michigan has the 10th largest college endowment in the US at $17 Billion and, I’d bet, if they had to, they wouldn’t miss $400 Million. But they’ll happily take it, since Michigan gives it to them.
Ironically 13% is about the same as the State of CA funds UC Berkeley and OOS students and parents were complaining on a the “UCB lawsuit” thread that the State of CA contribution was insignificant.
So, 13% being “huge” is a matter of perspective, which I personally don’t share.
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Michigan’s endowment per student is somewhere in the middle of the top 100, around the same as schools like Holy Cross and Trinity (CT). Ironically the contribution from the endowment in FY2021 was $404 million, which by your reckoning is not huge ;-).
There is a 20% cap on high-tuition OOS students at UCs, whereas OOS already comprise 40% of Michigan’s undergraduate population and there is no cap (45% of the Class of 2025 is OOS). California is also a dark blue, ultra-high GDP state, whereas Michigan is a deeply divided Rust Belt state in the bottom half of per-capita GDP/income. Context matters.
And yet, amazingly, Michigan with such a middling endowment per student has still has moved from #29 to #23 in the USNWR rankings over the past 5-ish years.
Moved up? Michigan and Berkeley both used to be in the top 10 when US News started their rankings.
45% of the freshman has been the standard over the last many years. And Michigan receives only about 11,000 apps from in-state applicants whereas CA received about 132,000 from in-state applicants to UC’s. That’s 12x.
Good knowledge. 
If you look at Cal’s and Michigan’s PA scores at USNews you will see that both of them remain virtually unchanged. That was the original metric used to rank universities by the magazine. When they realized that they could appeal more to snobby coastal subscribers in the northeast (the kind that actually pay to read their rubbish) they started to add metrics that totally favored private schools. Thus no publics in the top 15 and only 4 in the top 25. That’s why both schools have dropped. Academically, they are better than most of the top 25.
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You do realize that Michigan, more times than not, has an equal or better department than most of the private universities you would pay an extra 100K for right? It’s a good thing that employers and hiring managers don’t take your attitude.
Michigan also has been very self selecting in state. Most students who know they don’t have the academic chops to be admitted won’t even bother to apply.
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Absolutely @rjkofnovi . UVA also gets many times more OOS applicants than instate. If you’re not a top instate student to begin with, you are unlikely to apply.
UNC at instate price sounds like a great opportunity. Good luck to the OP with the decision!
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Ah, actually they didn’t have a better program. I think you need to read my post carefully. I said.
To me that would have to be top 5 in the nation. For what my kid applied for UMIchigan wasn’t in the top 5. I don’t think it’s worth it for our family. And I certainly wouldn’t pay a premium. YMMV.
UMIchigan is very good might be in the top tier in some things, even the best in something. We only checked the subjects our kid was interested in. Plus, you have no idea what other options our kid is weighing so how could you EVER know if something was worth an extra 100K to us???