UMKC 6-year BS/MD Program

Pre-Med & Medical School Multiple Degree Programs
6941

@OmGV2020,

So I think one of the goals of analyzing match lists, is seeing the endpoint/culmination result for that specific medical school’s graduates. In fact one of the questions on the “35 Questions I Wish I Had Asked” list deals with this directly in terms of where graduates place. Different medical schools have different strengths & weaknesses and areas of emphasis, & oftentimes this is reflected in a match list as residency program directors are familiar w/different med schools & residents they’ve recruited in the past from those schools.

The problem is as a medical school applicant, it’s hard to make those analyses on your own, since you generally don’t have the background information to be able to analyze a list, unlike say a further along medical student, a resident, a fellow, etc. Now add onto that if you’re applying as a high schooler, it’s pretty much impossible to do it on your own w/o some help.

In a program such as a combined BA/MD or BS/MD, where you’re committing to going to that med school as a high schooler much earlier than a premed, it’s important to be as much informed as possible when making decisions as to which route to choose or which Bachelor/MD to choose, if you’re lucky enough to have several acceptances.

The goal isn’t to look at any specific match year in isolation and extrapolate from there but to see trends. Is it more subjective? Sure. But this isn’t some randomized control trial with objective numerical endpoints.

I very much agree with @UIC4lyfe points/posts here but especially on his/her point that one should see where the AVERAGE medical student at that institution is matching into. Students at the tippy top of the class will almost always be getting really stellar matches, especially those who are AOA, but those students would have done that regardless of the institution they’re at. It’s not a good strategy to compare yourself to the exception, rather than the rule. I also think comparing it to match lists from previous years, as well as match lists from other medical schools in the same state and/or same tier also helps.

But having these conversations especially in a program which is 6 years in length (which runs year around w/o any real discrete separation between undergrad & med school compared to other programs, & w/limited majors allowed), I believe is helpful so that students understand the process & understand what they’re leaping into w/o blinders or rose-colored glasses on.

6942

I wonder if there is any correlation between the top programs and the students who entered the program through the most competitive OOS and Regional pools? Around 10 OOS students are likely to apply residency programs outside Missouri, while Missouri students may want to stick around the area for residency. you would not expect the majority of the students would apply for the big name programs in the East or west coasts. My guess is that those competitive OOS students may have matched into those top residency programs, along with a few Regional and Missouri students. Therefore, if you are a strong candidate entering the program, you should likely be able to match into top programs. So don’t be disappointed about the seemingly less stellar matching list.

6943

@BAMDHopeful,

I don’t believe there is a direct 1:1 correlation to being OOS/Regional and being top of the class and thus matching into a top program at UMKC. It’s really hard to make a predictive model from high school metrics like high school GPA & ACT/SAT score. Keep in mind that top programs can be in the Midwest too, depending on specialty.

You would think it would be more likely bc Regional/OOS pay higher tuition and/or have higher matriculating average stats so that may be motivation to work harder academically but that’s not necessarily the case. Again, as mentioned above, it’s always a good rule to not compare yourself to the exceptions but more to the rule (average) when it comes to seeing where the floor is in terms of quality of matches for students.

Also, Missouri students also apply out of state as it would be pretty risky to only apply to in-state programs, especially in the more competitive specialties.

6944

To Potential Class of 2026 and future applicants:
Don’t fall for the dime a dozen advise given against UMKC’s BA/MD program or its Matching, as I always stated do your own proper research before making any decision.

All program is not for everyone. Please look at my previous posts regarding the current experience of my daughter, who is finishing up 3rd year soon.

Also, I have seen top students from high school who gets into this progam (from regional/OOS) also separate or extend in the program. Just because you are a top student in the High School doesn’t mean you are going to excel in this program or for that matter any program you go to. College is a different beast.

Good Luck and hope the decision for the class of 2026 comes out soon!

6945

I am sure there are exceptions in each student pool, OOS, Regional and IS. The average student population are IS and Regional. What I want to say is that the UMKC program is a good program, and anyone who works hard can succeed. It depends on the students. The matching list has more to do with the students than the program.

6946

@UIC4lyfe is trying to point out that outliers are everywhere and that shouldn’t be portrayed as mainstream outcome.
For parents, it is very difficult to accept critical analysis for a program when your child is in that program, including myself as parent. Just like a dime a dozen critics are there so dime a dozen cheerleaders, but that is a mute point for upcoming applicants and decisions they have to make for their life.
@Roentgen I hope this year analysis doesn’t get lost in woods just like last year analysis (pages 338, 339)
High school success is not a guarantee in any college, however high school vigor definitely helps to stand out in crowd.

6947

@WGSK88,

With all due respect, my advice is not “dime a dozen” and neither is @UIC4lyfe’s w/regards to evaluating match lists. I’ve actually matriculated and graduated from the UMKC 6 year BA/MD program and I have had classmates & upperclassmen who have been through this program. I know what it’s like and I know what my BA/MD class went through while going through this program. I know good friends who have extended or left the program for a variety of reasons. Just because it differs from your point of view (as a parent who has a daughter currently in Year 3 of the program, which for the most part is still the basic sciences), doesn’t make my advice or my viewpoints “dime a dozen”. We’ve afforded your views as a parent with respect, so you should do the same for others, even if you may not agree with it.

These are very important & serious decisions that high school students are undertaking here and they should be well informed, and that means seeing the positives, negatives, & realities of any Bachelor/MD program. They’re not just agreeing w/matriculating to the undergraduate institution, but to the med school institution as well. That’s a lot & can be overwhelming to take on as a high schooler. That’s especially hard if your parents aren’t physicians or aren’t even in the healthcare field for guidance. Part of doing “proper research” is coming to forums like this, not just to evaluate the UMKC BA/MD program, but how to evaluate Bachelor/MD programs in general, and discuss issues. It’s why this thread has over a million views compared to other threads, which don’t even come close.

If people want cheerleading and advocacy only, students can go to institutional websites and see promotions & brochures. That’s not what College Confidential is for, and it’s not how this website/forum started. My role isn’t to promote or cheerlead for this Bachelor/MD program (or any program). Forums like these are to take off the rose-colored glasses and evaluate all types of educational programs.

The UMKC BA/MD program is quite different from a traditional college experience even entering in Year 1 & students/applicants should be aware of that.

@BAMDHopeful,

58%, so nearly 60%, of the BA/MD class is in-state compared to 29% regional and 13% out-of-state.

Vague platitudes like “UMKC program is a good program, and anyone who works hard can succeed. It depends on the students. The matching list has more to do with the students than the program,” which may make people feel good inside, aren’t materially useful to current applicants & matriculated students, especially as you’re currently a high school BA/MD applicant evaluating programs yourself.

Match lists have trends over years & decades. Different medical schools perform better or worse on specific objective metrics & it’s not solely student driven. Where you go to medical school/tier of medical school does have a contribution to match lists. Is it the entire contribution in full when applying for residency? No. But we’re talking about floors and ceilings here on how far med students can go w/o some type of external intervention (doing a year of research somewhere else, for example). Residency program directors aren’t naive to this reality of the caliber of different medical schools.

@PPofEngrDr,

LOL, oh I forgot about that one. I’ve been on this website just way too long (since December 2009, apparently, according to CC!), so my posts have tapered off dramatically w/just life in general (especially since it ends up just rehashing the same topics that are discussed thoroughly thru the pages of this thread which can be easily searched). That being said, the lists and analyses/conclusions supported by the data from the previous 3 years on that page have been pretty consistent from year to year anyways.

My post was talking about correlating high school performance to medical school performance. Of course the correlation will be a lot more meaningful in using high school metrics to correlate to college performance, as those metrics are used for admissions to college.

6948

After I interviewed and toured around different BS/MD programs, UMKC stands out as the one putting immediate and heavy emphasis on medical and clinical education from year 1, which is great! Why some of you think UMKC does not have the caliber to train top doctors? What’s short at UMKC, other than the years?

6949

Early clinical exposure/shadowing is not something new & innovative in medical education. Every medical school has it at this point as part of the curriculum. And “heavy emphasis” is hardly accurate in Years 1 & 2. The Year 1 & 2 Docent program is not something that leads to a dramatic shift in clinical experience or clinical acumen (if that was the case, MD only students who start in Year 2 Spring would be at a distinct disadvantage).

You, yourself in prior posts have made distinctions between lower-tier BA/MD programs and higher-tier BA/MD programs, so I don’t get what is so confusing about this as clearly you make this distinction as well.

6950

Thank you for noting my previous comments. I am trying to have a more positive outlook on residency matching. I still believe UMKC is a solid training program that good doctors can come out of it - and it’s true that 1/4-1/3 did match into top programs, even though UMKC is not top-ranked.

6951

Hi

Are results going to come out today???

6952

@sajju786 i really doubt it but a more likely date would be the 26th so thursday or so but i think we should get the results by this week

6953

@Roentgen, and others…
Thank you for all the posts!
When a student applies to BS/BA/MD, the medical schools evaluate the student based on GPA, SAT/ACT, essays, recommendation letters, healthcare volunteer, and/or research. When applying to residency, what do medical schools evaluate a student based on? TIA.
Another question: does the concept small fish in a big fond vs. big fish in a small pond apply when applying to residency?

6954

@gradedu,

So residencies evaluate you based on a combination of your medical school performance, letters of recommendation, a personal statement, USMLE Step scores, and maybe any research you have done, although it is in no way required to do the latter.

With regards to your second question, I’d say it all evens out bc residencies know about different medical schools in terms of caliber/tier so it’s baked into the cake. You’re better off going to the medical school that’s the best fit for you.

6955

@Roentgen , Thank you.

6956

as of now, whoever supports research to find a vacccine to Coronavirus will be rated first. Doesnt matter whether its Harvard or some medical univ in the middle of nevada desert.

6957

Admission decisions are out. Daughter gets in!
Thank you so much to all…, for your support.

6958

i got in as well! does anyone know if there is a facebook group or anything for admitted students, to get to know each other?

6959

are the desicions rolling or does everyone get the answer at the same time

6960

Congrats too all. My C got in too.