Awesome info @MTLUVER ! Congrats !
@MTLUVER - Congrats! That is a nice feather in your cap 
@monkey13 - Josh Gad was just the 1st MT character actor who came to mind- you are right that certain types can break traditional molds. JMHO - but I don’t think the fact that he was an acting vs MT major really plays into it- the programs at CMU are so integrated- after all, how many years have we seen them fill a good portion of the Acting majors with MT applicants? And Christian Borle is hardly conventionally good looking. (though he is SEXY as Shakespeare)
I don’t think it generally hurts anyone in any profession to be good looking. There is a “featured” thread I keep seeing as I log onto this site that talks about how good looking students get better grades- I have not read thread, but can guess what it says. BUT that isn’t the end all be all. One thing frequently discussed on this forum is the idea that colleges have an idea of what shows they are planning - and therefore what people they will need. If they are looking to do Dreamgirls or Hairspray they are going to need an Effie and/or a Tracy…
@crc500 @toowonderful thank you!
@toowonderful, I’ve seen a college production of Hairspray where Tracy was played by a pretty girl wearing padding! I’m not even kidding. And most of the the black characters–including the young girl–were played by olive skinned Caucasians and Hispanics. This was a few years ago–but I did very recently see a mixed race character played by a Caucasian girl at a very highly respected college.
@toowonderful, I do agree that acting and MT are highly integrated at CMU, which I think is great. It just seems to me that with girls, CMU takes very, very commercial looking ones.I’d love to be proven wrong…but I just haven’t seen it. It’s a fabulous programs and good on the kids who get in there! I’m not saying they get in b/c of their looks…they are also extremely talented. But CMU’s MT girls are all gorgeous, IMHO. CMU can afford to look at the universe of talented girls and take the most commercial looking ones if they want. I think that if your D is not commercial looking, her chances of getting into CMU’s MT go down.
However, I cannot imagine that it’s a good idea for a college program to accept a class based on what shows they are going to do. First, I don’t think that the shows beyond a year in the future are known/written in stone for any college. They can lose rights if a show goes back on Broadway, or whatever. Second, that is pretty short-sighted. What are they going to do with a 4’10" Asian girl they accepted specifically and only for Connie in A Chorus Line, unless she is fabulous and they will use her in a bunch of other things? Third, and perhaps most importantly, college is for education. Colleges pick kids based on who they think has potential and is a good fit with their philosophy/program, and who will be successful. That may or may not mesh with a casting choice for one show. The shows colleges put on are for educational purposes. They don’t always cast the best person for the best role. I really think they pick their class based on talent and fit and type, but not type for a particular show. I would love to hear from someone like @KatMT or someone else at a school who knows how they do it. Do you accept kids for particular shows?
@monkey13 - let me be clear, I think accepting kids based on future casting is a poor idea. But it is something I have read about many times on CC…so I was just putting it out as a possible factor. And I don’t deny the idea that CMU, Michigan et al accept really attractive kids as their primary group. I was just mentioning that there are exceptions to almost every rule- not making a declarative statement about the MT universe
@monkey13 – I can only speak for JMU, but we do not accept students based on shows we would like to do at school in the future. We only know our season about a year out, and only the mainstage at that (for example, we know our 2016/ 2017 mainstage season, but not the student directed season of shows, nor any of the particular readings/ workshops of new works). Freshmen at JMU can audition for shows and be cast, but larger roles are much more likely to go to upperclassmen because they have more training, maturity, and experience.
Like I said… I can only speak definitively for where I teach… but, I imagine many schools also work this way. I mean many schools do not even allow freshmen or sophomores to audition for productions, and I do not think they are planning their seasons two years out. Maybe they are, I don’t know. Kids change and mature so much between the ages of 17/18 and 20/ 21, that I am not even sure how you would know when looking at a HS senior that they were going to grow into a college version of “Sweeney Todd,” for example by the time they were a junior or senior.
We do look at admissions for our MT program based on current level of ability, apparent potential for development, perceived fit for what we have to offer as a program, and how the prospective seems that they will learn and grow within this environment, and general type.
We then choose shows that will challenge our students, expose them to different styles of performances over fours years, and that we think we can cast in a way that will nudge students our of their comfort zones as artists in a way that will empower them, but not damage them.
Admitting students based on looks isn’t just about who looks like a model. My D is pretty/adorable/beautiful (not just mom bragging–she gets that all of the time) and petite. Yet, we know for a fact that she was denied at one school because the program head goes for a more sophisticated look; my D still can look like she’s 13! Some programs go for sexy, some go for build/svelte body type, some go for sophisticated, some balance looks amongst those admitted and those already in the program, some don’t pay much attention to one’s looks. You can sometimes find out what programs go for by talking to people “in the know” and looking at photos.
I just don’t want people to come away thinking that they weren’t “good looking enough” for certain programs. As with everything in this process, there’s so much variance and so much that goes into it!
Thank you, @KatMT! That is what I suspected. And I love that schools nudge students out of their comfort zones. That’s what the educational process is all about.
And I apologize, @myloves, I didn’t mean to imply that you have to look like a model to get into a program. I was saying that IMHO, ONE program (CMU) takes VERY commercial looking, gorgeous girls. Other schools can take a variety of looks. And, since looks are very subjective, it is just my opinion. Broadway is getting better and better about using all sorts of looks/body types, especially in the ensemble (Priscilla, Queen of the Desert, Ghost, and Curious Incident all come to mind). But, the majority of females on Broadway - particularly in leads - are good-looking with nice bodies. It is a fact of life. Yes, there are exceptions. But in general, I think that is true.
MTLUVER First, my sincere congrats on your success!
Stagedoor Manor opens lots of doors and is, in reality an exclusive club, so to speak, so you did have some great cred and connections from those many years of experience there. Muny, even the children’s, is also a superior credit to have on your resume. Beats any high school production. I can also imagine you are quite attractive.
This is not in any way a slam against your well earned success. But the thread was making the point that without beauty, connections, semi pro or pro credits, talent is not enough.
I have confidence you are going places!
@mtmcmt so why is Stagedoor minor considered an exclusive club? Other then it’s a bit exclusive by the $6000 price tag…do schools take that into account for admittance? Sigh…
I don’t know if I agree with the "without beauty, connections, credits " talent is not enough statement either…
Oh, no apologies, @monkey13 ! I wasn’t refuting what you said at all; I was completely agreeing with it and adding onto it!
Oh–and I do think that, at some (not all–but I don’t think anyone meant all–they meant a few) programs, without beauty/a certain look, connections, credits, talent is not enough. Add to that what type programs “need” that year, academics at some programs, and some other factors, and talent is just the base requirement at all programs.
@myloves It’s exclusive in the way that everyone would certainly benefit from having the $$$ that the camp costs each year for 6-7 years running. There is no doubt that the connections -, see alumni from Stagedoor, puts one in an enviable position, as does the training with that faculty.
No, schools don’t have to take that into consideration. The contacts and experience coming out of Stagedoor pay dividends regardless.
And beauty of face and figure is always a big asset to have in show business. Or any business. It’s foolish to pretend otherwise. One can always “dumb down” one’s looks for a part but pretty is pretty.
Show business is all about looks, talent, connections, timing, (luck) and ambition. Money helps.
I’m not begrudging. I’m a good capitalist/free marketer. But we can’t pretend it’s a Peggy Sawyer world.
You have said your daughter is beautiful, petite and talented. In what world would that put her at a disadvantage to the plainer and plumper girl who aspires to be an ingenue?
@mtmcmt, anyone who gets into CCM is extremely talented. Anyone who does Muny is extremely talented. I know, therefore, that (as you said) @MTLUVER’s success is due to her talent and hard work.
Stagedoor does not have an audition for entrance. ANYONE can go. Yes, it is expensive. But there are scholarships. I know that here in my hometown, we pulled together and raised money for a local boy to go to Stagedoor. Where there is a will, there is a way.
I know a girl from a southern state who did one high school production. No coaching. No summer stock. No camp. No connections. Just talent. (Well, she is gorgeous.) She got into Juilliard for acting, and is now on a big TV show. If you are really talented, and work your butt off, and are nice, it happens without the money and the connections.
Huh. I don’t get that post, @mtmcmt . I didn’t say anything about Stagedoor, I wasn’t complaining, I didn’t say anything about my D’s talent in this (although, since I’m on this forum, I guess that’s a given), and I was simply saying there are many factors that go into this, not just talent. Sometimes people get into places with pure talent; often, they don’t due to other components.
@monkey13 , I love hearing stories like that!
I’m trying to not take anything personally during this process because I know talent level is not the only thing that goes into it to be honest
I’m the one that commented on Stagedoor @myloves , I think @mtmcmt just got the person wrong…& yes I know you can do fundraisers to go to $6000 summer camps…
Yes, I had that wrong, it was theater work I was responding to.
Well it’s good to know that poor, fat homely kids blessed with as much talent as gorgeous, well connected ones have a level playing field. You have restored my faith.