Our son was accepted to both. Now the difficulty of choosing. He is planning to major in actuarial science. At Penn State he’d be in Smeal. I feel like they have a great reputation and wonderful resources for internships and job placement. He’d also get a business degree. At UD he’d be in the College of Arts and Sciences. Not sure if that would look as good to potential employers in his field. Then we have cost. Penn State would cost almost twice as much as UD. We could make it work without loans, but it is a difficult pill to swallow. At the end of the day we want him to get the best education possible in order to have the best start in life. What is everyone’s opinion of these two schools and the specific colleges that he was accepted into? Also, any thoughts on how to get money from Penn State? UD offered him a pretty nice scholarship.
Penn State gives very little merit (or need-based) aid, so I wouldn’t expect any. Has he applied to Schreyer (honors)? Students accepted to Schreyer get $5000 a year. He might get some departmental aid as an upperclassman, but that’s certainly not something you can count on. In addition, Penn State charges higher tuition to juniors and seniors. Also, remember that there are very few direct entry majors at Penn State. No one is actually in Smeal until they have completed the Entrance to Major requirements (specific courses and GPA). I think that actuarial science graduates of any school have excellent job prospects.
My daughter who wants actual science had the same conflict, she chose Clemson for actuarial and switched to business (finance, accounting) but still plans on becoming an actuary (from what I hear it’s a solid major). She applied to 20 colleges (not Penn state because she needed merit), half and half, because she was so unsure. My 20 year old is a health science senior at UD and absolves everything about her school.
Congratulations on two good acceptances, and the UD scholarship! Without direct knowledge of the actuarial programs at these two schools, I would say that “getting the best start in life” also involves hitting the world without debt (especially since the look and feel are pretty similar, and reputation of both are good overall).
In general go to the best fit…where does he feel best. And finances = fit.
You note spending double is a difficult pill to swallow.
These are both solid flagships. You can’t go wrong. Neither are Harvard so it’s not a huge deal either way.
Penn State is known for their alumni. But kids can still struggle. I know a recent grad in their highly rated cyber security…can’t get a job. I’m just saying there are not absolutes.
I think, short of your student disliking UD, being under the daily financial strain it sounds like you’ll be in would answer the question for me.
It’s bad enough that many kids struggle in college emotionally…both mine did. It shouldn’t have to hit the parents too…other than worrying about the kids part mentally.
Good luck.
Delaware would be the easy choice for me regardless of cost.
First, it is the rare State school that feels more like a private university than a public. The main reason is that most of the students (60%) are from out of state. Second, it is smaller than most state flagships (18,000). Penn State has more than double the undergraduate enrollment. Third, it has a lower student:faculty ratio (12:1) than Penn State.
The education at Delaware is excellent. (Full disclosure: my cousin’s son went there on scholarship and has gone on to a successful law career.) The fact that Actuary Science is in A&S is irrelevant since this is common for actuaries with many of them having been math majors as undergrads. A successful career as an actuary is not going to be determined by one’s alma mater but by his success in passing the long series of rigorous actuarial exams. Attending Seams isn’t going to help with that. Getting a strong base in math and computer science will matter much more. He can do that at either school.
UD’s location gives it access to the banking & finance sector since Delaware has so many banks and their division HQs in Wilmington. It also has relatively easy access to Philadelphia with all that city has to offer.
Most students live off campus. If on campus housing is important to you, then you should have a conversation with admissions and/or res life in advance.
Thanks so much to everyone for replying on this holiday! I truly appreciate all of the advise. You’ve given us a lot to think about.
So I guess the other part of the question should be about the importance of the Society of Actuaries. The SOA ranks Penn State as a CAE (center of actuarial excellence) their highest ranking. Though UD has a major for actuarial science they aren’t on the SOA list. I’m not sure if this is important. I know that the schools have to apply and meet certain criteria I don’t know if they have to pay as well. Penn State says the students are prepared to take “several” of the exams upon graduation. Some students take as many as five before graduation (though I don’t know how realistic that is). UD says that students will take two before graduation. Penn State seems a bit vague but sounds like it could be a substantial leg up in the testing. UD sounds more definitive but you will have to do more of the testing out of school and probably won’t have as high of a salary upon graduation.
Let me be clear, we can afford to send him to either school. We’re just trying to figure out if Penn State is truly worth the much higher tuition. It makes me happy to see so many fans of UD replying. It is much closer to home, two hours vs. five. My son felt comfortable on their campus. He felt like it would be an extension of his high school. For some reason though he has Penn State as his top pick. He said that he feels that Penn State would push him out of his comfort zone a bit and give him a challenge. We are planning to go to both admitted student weekends and hear what the schools have to say. We are also still waiting for decisions from Florida State (another CAE) and Virginia Tech (there it is a minor) though he doesn’t seem as excited about those schools.
Thanks everyone for your help with thinking this though!
If your son loves Penn State and it makes sense financially, then he should go to Penn State.
But he should NOT go there on the basis that it is a Center for Actuarial Excellence. There are 32 colleges in the US dubbed as CAE, many of them decidedly mediocre and there are many other such “centers” worldwide. While it is laudable that the SOA has identified minimum standards for preparation to enter the profession, that’s all they are - minimum standards. The fact that a college is not on the list means absolutely nothing in terms of the quality of their program. It simply means that they haven’t been motivated to seek out that credential. On your tour, you can ask them why. My guess is that this designation has become a promotional tool to market these programs.
I find Penn State’s claim that they have students taking 5 exams while they are undergrads to be highly suspect. I’m not saying that it’s not true, but I’m guessing that these are extreme outliers and that there are circumstances to explain these individual cases. I find UD’s claim that they prepare students to take the first 2 exams to be more credible. I imagine that the same is true at Penn State.
I suggest that you talk to an actuary to get the best insight on preparation for this career and what the exams are like. My limited knowledge but taken from the actual experience of an actuary is that these exams are extremely rigorous and that many fail exams and have to take them more than once to pass.
There is an interesting discussion of the acuarial career on Quora.
I know kids in that major at Penn State - and while I don’t know the exact number of exams taken prior to graduation, I know it is more than two. Actually, I think 5 is pretty reasonable, because I know kids started with the first one in sophomore year and it seems like they are spending break studying for the next round. Of the kids I know in the major, the pass rate has been good since far.
Sorry if that is OT, but just wanted to share experiences of kids I know in that major.
(I will also chime in - while I don’t know what recruiting is like at UD, I know the kids at Penn State had multiple job offers for summer internships and full-time).
I get your son’s point about seeing so many kids from high school. It’s likely not as extreme as he thinks with 18k plus undergrad. But he wants to grow and sees a heavy amount of kids going there - and growth is what college is about.
Is him leaving in your comfort zone ?? 
I get your consternation on $$. I had the same issue - it’s not a question of affordability. It’s a question of do I want to afford it?
So you threw in a wrench or two - Va Tech and FSU. If he loves PSU he’ll love Va Tech. It’s also an isolated school (not insanely far from Roanoke though). It is huge like PSU and in my opinion the nicest campus in the country. It doesn’t hurt that their dining is rated top 5 in the country!! If he got into PSU he’s likely an in there.
FSU is not an easy In OOS but if you get in and have a 31 ACT or somewhat equivalent SAT you’d likely get an OOS waiver. Tuition is cheap without it but dirt cheap with. They are flying up the rankings and many from the NE are choosing.
Wherever he ends up he’ll have opportunities to learn, grow and meet people.
You might see if the departments at your first two schools are offering online info sessions. Some schools have that for academic areas.
If not, I’m sure you can call the dept chair and set up a zoom. Or admissions can set up an in person for you. Sounds like UD is close enough. You might also ask to speak with a student from the major. We did this at several schools and it was very helpful to my son…FSU was one where he had a great meeting (with meteorology at the time…he now majors in mech engineering). Make sure you come with questions!!
Edit: just checked both websites. UD says at least the first two exams. PSU says several. To me that’s just word-smithing. There’s likely the same opportunities at all schools but that’s why you talk to the depts and get those questions answered.
Good luck.
With regard to UD feeling like an extension of high school (did he mean that in a good way?), the majority of students (60%) are from out of state. UD serves as more of a regional university, drawing students from all over the Northeast
Hub and I both graduated from Udel in the late 90s and were hoping our D22 may choose that route, but has opted for Pitt. She also felt like Udel would be “more of the same” as high school, and wanted to explore outside of that. But it’s a more urban diverse campus, so I get that. The good news is, he can’t go wrong with either option. Delaware is a fantastic school and an awesome campus. Did he receive a notification about Honors at Udel? Could that swing his decisions at all? Penn State is a great choice too. If all else is “equal” I’d go for the financial fit.
UD for half the cost. It won’t be HS 2.0. Way too many kids both OOS and international.
Smeal isn’t a direct admit.
Grad/professional school could be on the table. Saving that money would be nice.
Wait for the FSU decision. S21 picked it over Penn State. Five minutes into our visit he said “this is PSU with palm trees”. If he gets the OOS waiver it’s a no brainer unless he really wants to stay close to home. What about Temple? Might get some scholarship money.
You stated exactly everything that I’ve been thinking! Makes me feel better to know that it’s not just me.
I think he meant it in a good way. It was very comfortable on his first visit.
It’s really helpful that you know others with first hand experience. Thanks for that!
Looking at the course requirements at the 2 universities for the actuarial science majors,
it looks like Penn State has courses specifically for “Actuarial Mathematics” - possibly targeted toward the respective exams. UD has general courses in the area but not quite as focused - which may explain why they say that students can pass two exams. If the student is deeply interested in this field, it would help to do a deep dive into the 4-year curriculum at each school and compare against the list of topics needed for the SOA exams.
It is possible to still pass all the exams without being in a specialized program, as already mentioned by Bill Marsh. We have one or two students a year passing these exams and we don’t offer anything close to the stuff at UD or PSU.
Also, if the student decides to change majors, you’d want to know if it’s easier to switch into a general business major, or some other major, at each university.
Good advice! We will definitely do that.
I can’t thank everyone enough for all of your suggestions and words of encouragement. We will definitely be looking deeper into these two schools, as well as FSU and VT. These boards have many great people with a wealth of knowledge that they are willing to share. For that I am extremely grateful. Thank you each and every one for your time.