<p>Johnny K, I imagine there is mild resentment. But the more they gripe the more they actually make Harvard look bad. They make it sound as though Harvard has let a diploma mill operate under the FAS for 100 years. I mean we're not talking about Devry or University of Phoenix. HES is accredited under the same standards as any other college in Harvard. So I dont understand the big fuss. </p>
<p>The anamosity towards the Extension school only makes Harvard look like a money grubbing machine willing to whore out its name. This is not the case and hasn't been so for the last 100 years. </p>
<p>If there is ANYONE willing to name me a person who has gotten into Harvard Law, Georgetown Law, NYU MBA, Brown, Yale and Columbia through Devry, University of Phoenix or any other diploma mill then I too will join the anti-HES bandwagon. Until then, can someone please explain to me the reason why HES grads go off to such great grad schools?</p>
<p>
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RubenB84 - there are at least a few of us. I'm in Classical Studies through Penn CGS.
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</p>
<p>how is CGS? Are you pretty much given access to alot of the resources the traditional students get? </p>
<p>And has anyone found that Devry/U. of Phoenix success story yet?</p>
<p>"Has anyone found that Devry/U. of Phoenix success story yet?"</p>
<p>Ruben,
These schools only focus on the professional career track. I don't believe that a person would EVER compare Harvard ES or Penn CGS to Devry/U. of Phoenix. They cater to a different audience as far as a specialized focus is concerned. </p>
<p>I personally would not go to either Devry University or the University of Phoenix because they don't have the program that I want to study. It would not make any sense to me, since I am a liberal arts student.</p>
<p>I am sure there are successful students coming from either Devry University or the University of Phoenix. But I don't believe that one would ever compare it to Harvard ES or Penn CGS. It all boils down to the students' interest.</p>
<p>Red,
when detractors speak of HES or CGS its almost in the same light as they would Devry or U. of Phoenix. what else could they possibly mean when they say that HES is "illegit" or CGS is a backdoor?</p>
<p>It's better not to listen to the detractors. They are not attending either HES or PENN CGS. They can't talk about a school that they have not attended. Any one whose going to either school would say otherwise.</p>
<p>Like any other college, the experience is what you make of it. As a college student, you're responsible for your education. Not the critics.</p>
<p>RubenB84 - </p>
<p>Academically you have full access to everything that Penn has to offer. I scored a competitive research grant last spring so even at that level, there is no bias. In most cases your professors won't know you're in CGS unless you tell them for some reason.</p>
<p>I think that access to career services is limited until one reaches senior status, but that is unlikely to be a problem for most CGS students since we're primarily working adults anyway. </p>
<p>There may be housing limitations also, but again, that's irrelevant in most cases.</p>
<p>career services is limited until you're a senior? bummer. I am not in the working adult category per se yet, so that would be a slight setback. But if you can score competive grants then that makes up for it. I like the fact that the lines are blurred between CGS and the traditional school when it comes to profs. Penn is simply one of the best schools.</p>
<p>
[quote]
It's better not to listen to the detractors. They are not attending either HES or PENN CGS. They can't talk about a school that they have not attended. Any one whose going to either school would say otherwise.</p>
<p>Like any other college, the experience is what you make of it. As a college student, you're responsible for your education. Not the critics.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>True. There are alot of HES students and CGS students that make the most out of these programs.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.thecrimson.com/printerfriendly.aspx?ref=214927%5B/url%5D">http://www.thecrimson.com/printerfriendly.aspx?ref=214927</a></p>
<p>President Alvaro Uribe and his VP Franscisco Santos Calderon are both extension school alumni. even harvard's continuing ed programs are pushing out Presidents. great school!</p>
<p>That is good news. However, despite the impressive acheivements of these individuals, very few people here in America could care less about The Harvard Extention School in comparison to Harvard College. People in the USA, only cares about name brand recognition, which is quite sad. </p>
<p>Nevertheless, HES is a great school indeed. Most people go there to take classes. Not many go for the degree programs.</p>
<p>Actually the Crimson is the only paper that refers both Uribe and Santos as Extension students. All other media outlets that Ive read have just listed them as plain Harvard grads. </p>
<p>Even in one Crimson article I found, Harvard was trying to outmatch Yale in how many world leaders they've churned out and they included both Uribe and Santos on their list. Apparently, they have no qualms about the Extension School when it comes to them becoming world leaders.</p>
<p>if i transfer to penn CGS from another school and take some classes there, am I still allowed to transfer from penn CGS to penn CAS (i guess as an external transfer)?</p>
<p>i've gotten mixed responses about this....</p>
<p>hmm that'd be a pretty blatant back-door move into CAS. Given the low transfer rate, I doubt they'd accept you just because you already have the resources of the university at your disposal.</p>
<p>I know that if you receive special student status at harvard ES you can take any harvard college course you want. the bad thing though is that you can only take up to two courses. </p>
<p>But I did talk to admissions advisor at Penn, and she told me that you cannot transfer to CAS from CGS. Its called a double transfer and CAS doesnt allow that. But she said that it could depend on the specific college and if they allow that.</p>
<p>see I heard that too, but two admissions people from penn that I talked to on the phone said it was allowed....</p>
<p>Personally EasttoWest,
You SHOULD just apply to The College of Arts and Sciences. Unless you're planning to take your classes at night, it would be a waste of time to apply to CGS in hopes that it will help you to get into CAS. Once you apply for that division, that's it. Weigh your options very carefully. </p>
<p>The question is WHY do you want to apply to CGS in the first place? It's certainly not a backdoor to CAS. It's getting to the point where the intense competition for admission is NOW spreading to the non-traditional units in hopes that some could use it to transfer into the regular traditional division.</p>
<p>However, you should look into Columbia: School of General Studies, as well as Brown RUE Program, and Yale's Eli Whitney Program. These programs should work in your favor. In addition, they integrate their students quite well with their traditional counterparts, if that's what you're looking for. Check out their websites.</p>
<p>
[quote]
see I heard that too, but two admissions people from penn that I talked to on the phone said it was allowed....
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Transfering to CAS only works by individual department and that department would weight your record. So some departments dont accept double transfers. I know for a fact Wharton does not. But something like classical studies, English, might. Im not sure.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Columbia: School of General Studies, as well as Brown RUE Program, and Yale's Eli Whitney Program.
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</p>
<p>Columbia SGS are hard asses and want the near same standards for the non-traditional as the College. To get into Yales Eli Whitney, you would've had to have done something spectacular like save a whale, or rescue someone from a burning fire or be a international politicians son to get in. Brown RUE programs is usually geared for people over 25 with significant work expierence. </p>
<p>UPenn, NorthWestern, UVA and Harvard Extension are possibly the best non-traditional programs out there.</p>
<p>actually, I am not planning on applying to CGS for myself, I was wondering about this option for my friend who is a non-traditional student.</p>
<p>regardless, redline, since you seem to be the expert on CGS here, does anyone know what the admissions standards are? i know two people potentially applying, one with a 3.5 and one with a 3.0.. is that competitive?</p>
<p>on the same subject, would you consider me a non-traditional student? </p>
<p>I went to Carnegie Mellon for freshman year, and then transferred to USC for sophomore year. i took a year off to study abroad on an independent program last fall semester and this semester I am working.</p>
<p>I want to go back to school but I do not want to return to USC. I have the option to return to Carnegie Mellon, but I am from the Philadelphia area and want to stay here. Also, Penn has the strongest program for my major (international affairs).</p>
<p>With all that being said, a have a 3.96 gpa (4.0 at CMU, 3.92 at USC), a 1320 SAT score, and I had a 3.5 high school gpa in all honors with 2 AP (my school offered 8 total).</p>
<p>I have decent ecs and work experience and my recommendations should be very strong.</p>
<p>Is Penn CAS an option or should I be looking more at CGS?</p>
<p>Hi EasttoWest,
I feel that your interests are better served at UPenn's College of Arts and Sciences. My feelings are that you really WANT to go to Penn CAS, and not Penn's CGS. Therefore, apply to Penn's CAS!</p>
<p>As for CGS, with regards to admissions, they don't publish that information. They mentioned that they require a 3.0 GPA or higher. You never know. CGS standards are much different than CAS as it only caters to working adults who have not been able to attend college at the traditional age due to personal circumstances. It's still a very competitive program, but the vibe is quite different from CAS. At least, that's the impression I've read about the program.</p>