Deciding between these two right now, planning on majoring in math and econ (with the goal of eventually going to grad school for economics). I’m an international student by the way.
UofR is more expensive, costing me about $30k/yr. Their financial aid office is unresponsive to appeals. Overall I think their academics are (marginally) more rigorous. They’re also much stronger in STEM and hard engineering than BC, but I don’t think they’re as highly regarded by employers, and they don’t have the same ‘man-on-the-street’ prestige BC does.
Boston College is cheaper at $20k/yr. I love their size, liberal arts core, and school spirit. Their location is also perfect. I’m not Catholic though, or even Christian, so I’m worried I might not be able to fit in with a student body largely from East coast Catholic boarding schools. Overall I’m leaning toward BC, but the culture shock and lack of STEM offerings is holding me back.
Both schools also have stellar economics and math programs. Ultimately I’d prefer whichever one is more research intensive, has a better track record of placing kids into grad schools, and strong recruiting so I have options in case academia doesn’t pan out.
Other schools I’ve narrowly eliminated from contention:
UW-M+L&S honors (too expensive), UIUC (Waiting to see if my residency petition is approved), CWRU (not strong enough for my major).
I think BC is an amazing school!! I do not think UR is worth the additional $10K/year. Congratulations
Additionally, Boston is a great city to be a student in (and I extend that to Chestnut Hill, because the T makes it a quick trip). UR is bordered by a river, cemetery, and highway which isolate it from everything else, and the bookstore is a mile away from campus proper.
If you are international, you likely will not be staying. So not sure how BCs prestige will help. I’d say both are equal but BC is more well known, in part due to sports. But not to academics.
Not sure about your residency for UIUC or how that will work if you are international.
If UOR is unresponsive to appeals….appeals are a long shot so one shouldn’t assume you will get more.
If money is an issue, your decision is made.
However I would not choose BC if I were you. Not even sure why you applied. You need to spend four years there day after day after day.
As you say - you are not catholic nor Christian and then you defined their student body. That’s a huge red flag in my opinion and you’d most likely not be happy. In this case, Rochester would be worth the extra loot.
I’m a US citizen living abroad and plan on working in the States. I used to live in Illinois, and my father still does so I’m trying to claim residency as his dependent student. Sorry should’ve clarified that earlier.
I see - makes sense - I just saw “I’m an international student.”
BC is not for you.
Both have you great offers.
But this alone - tells me - you shouldn’t go there - and as a Jewish person myself (and yes, many of these schools have Jewish populations), I get it. I would not have applied. Not sure your description is correct - but - the fact that you have this feeling is enough.
“I’m not Catholic though, or even Christian, so I’m worried I might not be able to fit in with a student body largely from East coast Catholic boarding schools.”
In this regard, and I don’t know the answer on research but I’d suspect Rochester, but from an undergrad POV, I’d assume a tie…put it this way, you can only get one job…and both will have ample connections:
Ultimately I’d prefer whichever one is more research intensive, has a better track record of placing kids into grad schools, and strong recruiting so I have options in case academia doesn’t pan out.
We are all different - but if you said Brandeis, NEU, BU, Clark or wherever - I’d get it. But the fact that you even mentioned it - I would stay far from a Jesuit and Catholic school.
Yes about the river, cemetery, and a road (hardly a highway) isolating UR (this is what many students love - the campus bubble), but the bookstore is a mere stroll away in College Town next to the hospital - nowhere near a mile. Quite a few shops and eateries are right there too. It’s a popular place for students. Googling it, to get to the admissions office (campus proper?) it tells me 0.7 miles. A lot of campus is between the two.
To the OP, if finances are a consideration, go with BC. If not, choose which one you like. They are both respected for math and econ. I’m not sure how much BC puts an emphasis on undergrad research, but I know UR puts a very high emphasis on it - so high I’m not quite sure why those not interested in research even consider the school TBH.
My niece went to BC and not only was she able to do research but it was at a high enough level that she got to present her work at a national conference in Atlanta. Today she is on the verge of completing her PhD.
That’s where it helps if others can fill in gaps. I just don’t know about BC from personal experience. No one I know well from school or otherwise has gone there (just a regional thing - not at all a remark against the school).
All I can say is more than 75% of undergrads do research at UR last I heard. It’s a culture there, not just doing it, but talking about it in casual conversation among each other, etc. Presenting research at conferences is very common.
The OP can use what I know and what you know (plus others) to figure out if it’s worth the cost difference to them.
D knows several students who have been/are students there. Nowhere near all are Christian, let alone Catholic and none attended Catholic school. One was able to do research at Dana Farber and another was able to do cancer research at another firm in Boston both through connections with professors.
It’s more than that. It’s the symbolism on campus. Crosses etc. it’s the religious bent of much of the student body. It’s the direction from the administration.
It’s not bad of course. It is after, after all, a Jesuit and catholic school . But if that stuff makes one uncomfortable it’s clearly not right for that particular student.
When someone expresses concern, it’s likely not right for that student albeit Jewish, Muslim or otherwise. They do have groups for 15 faiths but Catholicism will still permeate their campus in imagery and life.
Obviously OP has to decide what’s for them but that would give me huge pause to the point if regretting that I applied.
The purpose of my post was to provide information for the OP based on this part of the original post.
‘I love their size, liberal arts core, and school spirit. Their location is also perfect. I’m not Catholic though, or even Christian, so I’m worried I might not be able to fit in with a student body largely from East coast Catholic boarding schools.’
BC is less expensive and offers a lot that seems to interest the OP. I’m just providing some information that I thought the OP might find useful.
‘But if that stuff makes one uncomfortable it’s clearly not right for that particular student.’
Although a valid point, I did not get the sense that the religious symbolism was bothersome to the OP based in the post.
I have first hand experience with BC both as a student and as a parent. It is not a place where you are made to feel uncomfortable based on your religion or lack thereof. I totally get attending a school with a religious foundation is not for everyone, but i didn’t get the sense that the OP was as worried about the Jesuit philosophy as not being able to fit in because everyone is Catholic.
Well, when UR screwed my daughter and several of her acquaintances out of need-based aid their second year, one or two of them transferred to BC. Maybe they’ve changed their ways but I’d do some digging around on Google to see if there are any recent stories. They used to be known for it from the articles we found. And while I’m still a fan of the school, I can’t imagine paying $40k premium for it over the four years.
Symbolism, theology courses etc. don’t make me uncomfortable, I knew it was a Catholic school when I applied. My parents were educated at Catholic institutions too (outside the US). My concern is more about the student body and the lack of shared experiences I’d have with them which might make it harder to fit in (in terms of understanding references and things Christians would relate to). I get the feeling that most students self-segregate into their own ethnic groups in college, and as a non-white non-Christian it would make the social aspect more complicated.
This is worrying. Since I probably won’t directly enter the workforce after college, money is definitely a concern. My parents will pay ~$15k/yr out of pocket with the rest coming from student loans/work-study. I don’t want to be forced into a paying career I’m not interested in just to pay off student loans, so if my aid is reduced significantly at UR it would be a problem.
That’s fair - I personally think, when you’re a religion that few are, it makes the social aspect, it makes most aspects more difficult. It’s all interrelated. At least that was my experience - I had more of my religion growing up and my group was my religion whereas my kids had a harder time in a Christian environment. Even when you had friends, they weren’t true, hang out outside of school friends. Everyone is different - I just don’t see that the experience could be what you want - but you are the one that needs to be good, not me.
As for UR and aid, I’ve heard this, perhaps from the same poster- but the school meets 100% of need. So if you get a need based scholarship, unless income or something financially changes, this shouldn’t happen. But you may express your concerns to a financial aid advisor. If this were the case, their grad rate would be low because people would be dropping out right and left. But for any “merit” scholarships - schools have rules - and you would have to meet those rules - i.e. maintaining a GPA.
As I said maybe they’re not doing this anymore but when we found out and did some digging, lots of articles came up, including an expose in the school newspaper. D was very close to deans list so nothing to do with grades. We appealed and agree with your assessment that FA is very difficult to deal with. In the year inc summer prior and after we had 4 different FA reps. Serious turnover in that dept. yes they meet need but what we read seemed to point out that they loaded up freshman year (perhaps meeting more than need?) and then lowered in subsequent years. It was a lot of money. Things may have changed; I’d just check out the current situation.
Update: Rochester FA ended up being very flexible. They increased my merit & need aid so that it’s now about $5k cheaper than BC. Parents are pushing me toward BC though because it’s more prestigious and has better job placement.
I definitely like Rochester’s open curriculum and academic/research focus more, but I feel like I should be prioritizing overall school strength over something that may never affect me if I decide not to apply to grad schools four years later. In conclusion, I’m no closer to figuring out where I want to go than I was 2 weeks ago…
To be fair, if I recall correctly, @taverngirl 's family financial situation changed, which was why UR changed it’s aid package. Forgive me, and correct me, if I am misremembering. I think that the issue came down to the fact that UR thought that the change meant less aid was needed, and @taverngirl disagreed. To be clear, I am not saying @taverngirl was wrong! Just giving a bit more context.
Often people associate prestige with ranking position in U.S. News, in which UR places higher than BC. In any case, putting rankings aside, UR’s historical academic level and current academic atmosphere contribute to making it at least as prestigious as BC, in my opinion.
