<p>This thread is interesting, it shows how wide a range of perspectives there are out there (which is not a bad thing, for a lot of reasons). I agree with the posters, in many ways what we are seeing with kids from Asian backgrounds mirror what happened with the Jews, among other groups, and a lot of that has to do with being immigrants from places where quite frankly opportunities are limited, and competition is fierce, and to get anywhere takes a lot of effort. Yes, more then a few Asians in past generations came here as grad students in highly educated fields, I went to school with their children, and that culture was passed down to their kids. In the last 30 years, it has gotten a lot broader, as anti Asian immigration laws were repealed and you started seeing more ‘traditional’ immigrants, poor people who started with nothing as so many immigrants did. And as one poster wrote about his family, a lot of these recent immigrants are not rich, they work tough jobs in restaurants and the like or own small businesses, and they have to work incredibly hard to support their families, and they like the Jews and other groups, want their kids to succeed, and they believe there is nothing that is going to do that but hard work and getting a good education. And from what I can tell as with the Jews there are both strong family networks and extended networks in the community (In my dad’s era growing up, in the 30’s, Temples didn’t just exist as religious centers, it was a social network within the local community. Besides going there to learn hebrew, Jewish kids also if they were having trouble with something might go there to get tutoring from an older boy or member of the congregation, and so forth). </p>
<p>The other thing that Asians have is a perspective that their kids education has to take priority, whatever the kid is doing, and it is very different attitude then many people in this country have (and I am speaking as both a non Asian and as someone who was born and raised here). For many people, school is sending your kid to public school, and maybe making sure the kid does assignments and paperwork, and their view is basically “education is up to the schools” and their involvement in my experience is limited to going to back to school night and the like and that if the kid goes to school, and the teacher teaches ‘the right things’ and the kid does his work, well, everything will be fine. Likewise, to suggest to parents that education go beyond the school (other then maybe with things like sports) would be looked at askance, whereas with many Asians these are assumed. Whether it be programs like Kumon or special programs, to many Asians these are essential to their kids success (again, in part, because in countries like China and India and Japan and Korea, your future is decided by exams, that track where you go, and getting the highest marks on these tests literally sets your future if what I read about and studied in grad school still holds). In those places, parents scrape up the money for schools designed to get their kids to the head of the list, and it continues on here. Sometimes it seems on the deep end, I have seen parents fly their kids in from the west coast to attend weekly music programs on the other coast, and the like. (And before someone thinks I am bashing native born US people, I am not, believe me, there are a lot of crazy parents doing similar things with their kids, I am talking generalities here). If it means working long hours, giving up things a lot of people consider necessities, like fancy cars or fancy homes or vacations, Asians IME are more willing to do that, because they put so much hope on education for a better future. </p>
<p>Like any stereotype, though, the image of the hyper-excelling Asians, of the ‘model minority’ is as bad in its positiveness as negative stereotypes are for others. As these are positive stereotypes, few will deny them, and frankly more then a few Asians will make out like this is a solid fact across the board, because no one likes to discuss the negative side, any more then some people want to discuss the negative sides of big time college sports. But Asians (which as a general term is problematic, since Chinese and Koreans and Indians and Pakistanis et al are not monolithic, and even within those groups there are differences based on local culture and so forth, as anywhere else) are fully human, and there are things that aren’t often discussed either. </p>
<p>The incredible pressure put on kids to succeed, especially when a family pools its resources to help the one ‘promised child succeed’ doesn’t always produce success. With this pressure comes a cost, kids burn out, rebel, some end up drifting, others can’t take the pressure and attempt or are successful at suicide. Others end up questioning what they are doing, and have a hard time finding themselves, or go along with the life they kind of have been ordained for but end up miserable. Likewise, there are ills within Asian communities, like gangs and organized crime, things we normally would associate with ‘less model’ minorities and so forth.The other negative side is this single minded obsession with grades and test scores can work as a negative as well, because life is a lot more then simply getting good grades and then you succeed. You can get through school with spectacular grades and get the degrees, but is that person going to be able to work with others, or to create new things? When applying to a school, if all they bring are perfect SAT’s, more then a few AP’s and a 4.x GPA, are they going to bring something to the school environment? These are real questions, and sometimes the way kids are driven to succeed might in fact fail…</p>
<p>I think the other thing we have to be careful with is looking things at the perspective of a single generation, and when doing so with immigrants, the first thought is to think like “these people aren’t going to fit in”. One of the things to remember is few groups I can think of, of any of the waves of immigrants we have seen, have failed both to put their mark on the country and also to adopt to it. I disagree with some, who argue that Asian kids sacrifice their lives to be super students, I think that is a rule that doesn’t bear close scrutiny. Especially with kids who were born here, I see more of a hybrid model, where the math science geek also does sports, or activities, or band, etc, play little league and the like. I think the image others are giving is probably more prevalent, if my experience holds, with the kids of recent immigrants and kids who weren’t born here, from what I can tell like with academics a lot of the Asian kids seem to embrace what we often see as ‘being american’ more vigorously then I certainly did:). From everything I am seeing and hearing in fact, from my more then a few Asian friends, acquaintances and colleagues, I hear the same complaints about their kids I heard growing up, complaining that the kids are lazy, don’t want to do the work they should, they want to play video games and hang out, etc…I am not sure that the work ethic and the view of education and success is going to die out completely, or where it more matches ‘the average’ out there, but it definitely gets tempered by being American. And these kids, when they grow up and have their own family, are not as likely to push their kids into material success, they are going to be more open to the view that success is measured many ways; some of them may have wanted to study philosophy, but instead became a doctor or engineer, and therefore might be more willing to see their kid do what interests them…</p>
<p>The other thing that tempers things is when the next generation starts realizing that opportunity in this country is a very different kind of beast, that because of the nature of our society things like grades and what college you went to are not necessarily an indicator of success, that for example a lot of CEO’s of big companies did not go to Ivy league schools and the like and still succeed, they finally figure out that getting into Harvard or Yale or MIT, while it is an accomplishment, doesn’t guarantee success (as opposed to, for example, Japan, where what university you get into to a large part dictates your success down the road) and that once you are out there, things like SAT scores and GPA’s basically mean next to nothing once you have a track record out there, if someone shows they have the skills and work ethic and whatnot to do the work and create and get ahead. Yes, there are jobs where what school you went to does matter (investment banking, some law firms) but they are not the majority, and it becomes apparent when you see people like Bill Gates and Steve Jobs, who never even graduated from college and what they did;)</p>
<p>And btw, despite popular stereotypes, it isn’t like Asians and Jews were the only ones like this, believe me, though it might work out differently, most immigrants had similar concepts tempered by their own experiences and cultures. Think about Lou Gehrig, and the kind of work ethic he had, and you get the drift. The problem is most of us grew up where there just weren’t a large group of immigrants coming into the country or are separated from immigrant roots enough that we never faced that, so we see in this case Asians and the work ethic and such and say “wow, where did that come”…and want my guess? Give it another 20 or 30 years and the descendants of this group will look at newcomers and say “wow, look at what they do”…:)</p>