@GnocchiB , when my kids were in high school, they volunteered with UMARMY, the youth service arm of the Methodist church. I was pretty shocked to hear some of the stuff their group had to do, including roofing, using power tools, and in one case, cleaning out a hoarder’s kitchen. They all had a blast, though, and I was only glad I learned about what they did after the fact.
I can say the same about hearing (after the fact) stories of my kids tying themselves to rafter to paint ceilings at Scout camp. Oh, and all the stories of killing copperheads were not exactly soothing either…
We lived by the trust is earned theory, so as time went along through HS more freedom was given to our twin DD’s, and while some outings resulted in learning opportunities the next morning they are great kids who did exceptionally well as students, athletes, and members of our community and we couldn’t be prouder.
Yes, their senior year culminated in a well earned prom weekend beach house with 25 of their closest friends - no fights, no fires, no arrests, and while I’m sure there was some wild times they worked their tails off and earned it so all good - they even got their full security deposit back.
And now they head off to college with a little more wisdom in their tool box as to how to handle life a little more on their own…
My attitude toward teens is super permissive about things that aren’t directly dangerous and don’t impose on other people (clothing/hair choices, food, movies and video games, protected sex within a relationship). But I would have to draw the line on cutoff shorts that let half the butt cheek fall out. Unless you are at: (1) the Pride parade, (2) the pool/beach, (3) Coachella, or (4) Brazil, I NEVER want to see your butt cheek. I just saw a woman get onto a COMMERCIAL PLANE with major cheekage. That is nasty. Call it a pet peeve…I’d keep my mouth shut when it comes to a mohawk or midriff, but I would die on Butt Shorts Mountain before I let a teen in my care wear those in public.
@Hanna, piercings and tattoos totally fine, butt checks never ok
@doschicos yeah my state has that law but it’s not enforced very well. Anyway, my parents would trust that I would drive with people who would either obey the law or we responsible enough to not get distracted/not distract the driver. They trusted that I valued my life enough that I wouldn’t risk it.
@hanna. You are not old enough to have teens though are you? JW? If you are I have to say you look amazing
As for me. I did not police my teens clothing. Not my thing.
In general, I think I was the parent who said yes when other parents were saying no. My son and friends wanted to see a concert at Madison Square Garden in NY just before or after graduation. The other parents said yes provided they took a 3 AM train home. They seemed to be insisting that the kids stay in Penn Station from 11-3 AM. The other parents seemed not to realize that the whole neighborhood would be busy. We were in NY the weekend before and I took my son to the neighborhood around there and showed him where the 24 hour Korean restaurants were and suggested he go there. Probably safer than sitting in Penn Station.
After the prom, they were going to be driving to an after-party where there would certainly be drinking and drugs. I encouraged him to have his friends over at our house IF I had their car keys. There was beer in the basement refrigerator, which was clearly sampled (I did not offer it but assumed it would go), but I preferred that to the party that they were going to drive to. They all slept over.
I did say no to my daughter and her equally thin pretty friend going to Bonnaroo (big outdoor music festival with drugs dispensed like soda) – just too much of a target for drunk or drugged out guys. She understood. Similarly, with the same girl, a trip to Eastern Europe (not sure I was right there). She went to Paris with family friends whose son was a lifelong friend of our daughter. In each case, I would have been happy had her 6’4" 200 pound brother been with her, but didn’t want to send her on her own with a companion who was a bit of a space cadet. When she graduated at age 23 with her BSN/MSN, I gave her a ticket to SE Asia for three months (she was traveling with two other females). By then, I was pretty confident that she could take care of herself. And, the region is much safer. [They had been thinking about South America and I told her that was a bad idea.] She had one of the best trips imaginable.
We also subscribed to the trust is earned model. Our son completely got it. He would call in advance if he was going to be getting back later than the deadline. He would call and say, “There’s alcohol here. If I drink, I won’t drive and will stay here. I’ll let you know if I am staying over.” He built up complete trust. Our daughter just saw the freedom he had and wanted it but didn’t quite get the “earning it.” So, it was rockier with her. She has matured and is a delightful, responsible young adult.
@shawbridge , thank you for mentioning the three-month trip to SE Asia. D2 is going there for three weeks in July and I’m kind of nervous, despite her having spent a term in Vietnam during college. So your comment is reassuring.
@shawbridge, our DD’s sometimes figure it out on their own and sometimes have had learning opportunities - I’ll call pucking on one’s shoes a learning opportunity; isn’t that why they are called kids and we are called parents - we finally evolved. Agree that by early 20’s they should have it figured out too or at least be well on their way with a much, much fuller tool box.
I" did say no to my daughter and her equally thin pretty friend going to Bonnaroo (big outdoor music festival with drugs dispensed like soda) – just too much of a target for drunk or drugged out guys."
Oh, my kids have been as have I several times. It is a very chill, respectful atmosphere actually with a great vibe. If you want drugs, you’ll find them, just like any other place but no one is forcing anyone. And actually, the vast majority are not wasted on anything much of the time. It’s too darn hot. Friday night is the biggest party night but most people calm down after that. You need stamina to make it through a 4 day music festival. Each their own on what we allow or don’t as parents, I just don’t want folks to get the wrong idea of Bonnaroo.
"I gave her a ticket to SE Asia for three months (she was traveling with two other females). By then, I was pretty confident that she could take care of herself. And, the region is much safer. [They had been thinking about South America and I told her that was a bad idea.] "
Again, chiming in to say much of South America is pretty safe - Argentina, Chile, Uruguay for example. Much safer IMO than some SE asian countries. A lot really depends on each country and regions within countries. Hard to lump regions together as safe/unsafe. 
Oh yeah, only group dating up until 16. Then you can have one on one dates.
@doschicos, my son went to Bonnaroo and I was judging by his description. Lots of drugs in his report – including among his friends – but I take your point that it is optional. My biggest concern was not drugs (although I’m not sure my daughter at that age would not have experimented) but for her physical safety. But, I don’t have direct knowledge about Bonnaroo.
I have been to most of South America for work and/or vacations – I’m missing a few countries including Chile. But, I’m in Brazil several times a year and wouldn’t send a single female there. I agree that it is hard to lump regions together – Uruguay when I was there seemed pretty sleepy and pretty safe. I haven’t been to Argentina in a while. Seemed fine, but I was busy working. Here is the State Dept report on safety there: https://travel.state.gov/content/passports/en/country/argentina.html. And, in a number of Latin American countries, what people get used to and consider safe does not meet my comfort level. In Brazil, everyone I know has bullet proofed their cars. In Mexico (where I’ve been probably 50 times for work and holiday), I was driving around with a client in Cuernavaca where we were having an offsite retreat. My Mexican colleagues assured me Cuernavaca was safe but as we drove past the zocalo at night, they expressed surprised that families were out there in the evening. I love Peru and have been there a number of times but was robbed at gunpoint there once many years ago. I love Colombia but there is a kind of tension in the air in Bogota even though it seems safe. In Thailand (I think) and Vietnam, families took my daughter in when she was traveling alone or in a small group. But, I take your point, you need to be careful wherever you are and there will be dangerous parts of safe countries and vice versa…
I still think physical safety is no more a concern than any other place and less so than many. It is a VERY cooperative, chill place. The first time I went I was expecting more craziness (it’s definitely not mainstream, though!) but the vibe is incredibly kind. It’s all about the Bonaroovian code and radiating positivity.
https://www.everfest.com/magazine/videos/the-bonnaroovian-code-video
I didn’t mention Brazil because I agree there are unsafe areas, but not the whole country. And, Mexico, well, not S. America. 
The sex trade in Thailand bothers me big time so I have issues with that country (plus the political/economic structure but that’s another thread).
@maya54, it’s an academic question (I have no kids), but thanks for the compliment! I am 42, so plenty old enough to be ignored by a teenager. They happen to be my students instead of my children.
I’m interested to see that co-ed sleepovers are happening in the US! I have only raised my kids abroad (and they were NOT a think when I was growing up in the US.) I had assumed it was a European thing because all the French/Dutch/Norwegian kids my daughter knows seem to think they are a normal thing. I am generally a fairly liberal parent - but before I was even asked I made it clear that co-ed sleepovers would not be happening.
I do let my 16 year old go to parties and bars. Situation here is different - kids have drivers who wait around for them and bring them home. I don’t expect her to be drinking at this age and she knows the freedom she enjoys now can just as easily disappear.
I would not allow her to attend a party at a “farmhouse” - code for unsupervised party in a remote location.
@CValle, where we live my DD’s fully admit that parties are rarely held when one’s parents are home - so beware of sticky floors when you return…
I definitely let my kid do things other parents absolutely put their foot down about - like allowing him to ride his bike to school 1 1/2 miles by the end of first grade. I’m sure there are many more things but can’t think of any off the top of my head.
I never called parents of kids where parties were because I knew there wouid be no parent home. All I did was tell my kid to call us no matter what , no questions asked, before getting in car with someone who had been drinking.
I also sent him to overnight camp for seven weeks every summer for 8 years starting when he was six. This likely saved me from saying no to lots of stupid things kids want to do.
LOL, @chembiodad, when I was growing up, the way my parents knew we’d had an illicit party was that the house was super clean when they got home!
Another thing we said no to was travel sports teams. We didn’t have the time or money and I thought they were ridiculous anyway.