What should count for course credit toward a university degree?

Parent Cafe
61

<p>^Another thing: isn’t it true that Ivies and some other mega-endowment schools funnel large amounts of money into extra-curriculars? I’ve often heard, for example, that there are excellent “club” theatre and music opportunities at Ivies. </p>

<p>Perhaps schools with less money can only justify some activities if they’re tuition-driven?</p>

62

<p>I am raising my hand for smart choice of "the hoi polloi of a “lesser” college… ", count me in.</p>

63

<p>"Perhaps schools with less money can only justify some activities if they’re tuition-driven? "</p>

<p>-As far as I know “club” type of activities, including “club” sports are paid separately by families. There are plenty of these at D’s “hoi polloi lesser” state college. It is also ranked #2 in undergraduate teaching in USA, beating Harvard. Yey, go “hoi polloi lesser” state college", go, we love you.</p>

64

<p>^Hmm…maybe I’ll change “Lesser League” to “Hoi Polloi League.” I liked the alliteration of the former, but I’m warming to the latter. Has a peppy ring to it, no?</p>

65

<p>^I love it too!</p>

66

<p>I apparently conveyed the wrong tone when I wrote about students at lesser schools being more likely to be first-generation college students, less likely to have traveled outside their native region, etc. While those things are true, they do not imply that there is anything wrong with those students. (To the poster who speculated that I must have gone to one of those schools: yes, I did.) But to think that Ivy League students are no more worldly and driven, on average, than students at local branch campuses of state schools is naive.</p>

67

<p>mantori,
Apparently you have a right to stand up to your opinion, and so do I with my kids’ experiences providing supporting facts for my opinion. It is actually very educational to encounter this type of thinking, I did not realize that it exists.
Go “Hoi Polloi League.” !</p>

68

<p><<but to=“” think=“” that=“” ivy=“” league=“” students=“” are=“” no=“” more=“” worldly=“” and=“” driven,=“” on=“” average,=“” than=“” at=“” local=“” branch=“” campuses=“” of=“” state=“” schools=“” is=“” naive.=“”>> </but></p>

<p>Well, actually, you said “…self-actualiz[ed], and driven, or at least open-minded…”, which is a whole 'nother sack of potatoes. </p>

<p>My personal experience (community, friends) and my professional experience (teacher) lead me to these conclusions: </p>

<p>Ivy/Uber Selective League: incredibly driven; nah, often not worldly; wide disparities in open-mindedness and self-actualization. </p>

<p>Hoi Polloi League: a wide range of all attributes listed above, which doesn’t mean they can’t be just AS if not MORE open-minded and self-actualized as higher-achieving students.</p>

<p>But, to stick to the OP topic at hand: I think kids at MANY colleges are interested in broadening their horizons and learning something new. No hand-holding necessary.</p>

69

<p>

yes, this is true and even some secondary schools in Canada and the UK use college in their name</p>

70

<p>

</a></p><a less=“” obvious=“” explanation=“” is=“” that=“” students=“” at=“” more=“” prestigious=“” colleges=“” and=“” universities=“” tend=“” to=“” be=“” self-actualizing=“” driven,=“” or=“” least=“” open-minded,=“” therefore=“” do=“” not=“” have=“” led=“” by=“” the=“” hand=“” toward=“” new=“” horizons.=“” kids=“” lesser=“” schools,=“” on=“” other=“” hand,=“” are=“” likely=“” first-generation=“” college=“” students,=“” never=“” traveled=“” outside=“” their=“” own=“” state=“” region=“” let=“” alone=“” country,=“” so=“” on.=“”>

<p>I read this and thought of all the kids attending a local CSU commuter college and the fact that they are often just checking the boxes, doing whatever needs to be done in order to get the degree, not necessarily looking for a mind broadening well rounded experience. That is what I did as did many of my friends, we did not know enough to go away to school and have a horizon expanding experience, and some of my GE classes, which I was forced to take, are some of my most memorable.</p>
</a>

71

<p>delted cause I fixed the previous post.</p>

72

<p>I skimmed the thread so forgive me if someone mentioned this; however, I (cynic here) always kind of thought that the varied requirements provided some job security and allowed colleges and universities to keep certain majors. For example: Who would take PE classes if they were not required? But schools have to have PE teachers so universities must offer PE education. </p>

<p>Colleges and universities might have only a handful of students in a certain major–let’s say meteorology–but can maintain a department because non-majors need science classes. I get the whole idea of having a broad education, but I have often wondered how much of it is required to maintain a wide range of major offerings.</p>

73

<p>By the way, it should be obvious that when I say “lesser school” I don’t mean “unworthy school” or “stupid school” or “school you shouldn’t care about”. I think it’s quite clear that I mean “not prestigious;” in fact, I said as much in my original post. I myself went to a lesser school, don’t mind saying so, and got a good education there. Sorry some of you don’t find that very PC, but a fact it is.</p>

74

<p>^Okay, I can understand that. “Lesser” is probably not an adjective I would choose to let stand alone when describing a school, but I get that it’s shorthand for you. </p>

<p>I don’t think that’s what provoked the comments-in-reply. For me, it was the double whammy. I was startled by the pairing of “lesser school” with intimations of lesser human beings. Just because somebody doesn’t have the level of achievement or intelligence of an Ivy student doesn’t mean that they’re not self-actualized or open-minded or even driven…or that they have a paucity of life experiences (I don’t believe worldly just means being well-travelled).</p>

<p>But we two products of these less-prestigious schools will just have to agree to disagree, huh? (Insert smiley here; too lazy to learn how.)</p>

<p>(Is it just me, or is anybody else feeling the urge to sign up for a tap dance class?)</p>

75

<p>I don’t think we have to disagree. I was careful to say that I was speaking of the average; without a doubt there are many highly intelligent, driven, and worldly students even at the least-regarded schools. I surely don’t disparage small, unknown state schools and hope I haven’t given anyone that impression. I still love mine.</p>

76

<p>I don’t understand why this is an issue. </p>

<p>If you see Bowling 101 on the transcript, and you are evaluating an applicant to your graduate program in Biochemistry, you just disregard the Bowling grade. Unless your department got its @$$ whooped by the Geology department at last year’s interdepartmental Bowling tournament, in which case you disregard the Biochem 101 grade.</p>

77

<p>Re: Post #42: “To many such students, a course in, say, 16th-century English poetry may be so alien to their interests and experience as to be worthless, whereas a for-credit experience in, say, caring for abandoned animals could be a life-changing experience that leads them to a fulfilling career that they never would have imagined otherwise.”</p>

<p>It wasn’t just the patronizing comments about self-actualizing and open-mindedness in that post; it also was the whole attitude of ‘poetry for elite and animal care for the non-elite’. By that same logic, working at Wal-Mart or in a factory could be a life-changing experience that might lead some students at elite schools to a fulfilling career that they never would have imagined otherwise. Maybe they’d benefit some for-credit field experience of the real lives of real people in the real world?</p>

78

<p>@vicariousparent: LOL! But what if Bowling 101 only covered the theory of bowling? The adcom would need to look for the Bowling 102 grade for Applied Bowling.</p>

79

<p>I grew up on food stamps and WIC, lived in public housing, and attended inner-city public schools. I assure you that the average person I went to school with is less self-actualizing and open-minded than the average Ivy League student.</p>

<p>In order to be useful, education has to be relevant. That’s all I’m saying. But please, by all means, keep telling me how patronizing I am. It helps.</p>

80

<p>In order to be useful, education has to be relevant.</p>

<p>The thing is- you don’t know * when or how* the courses you’ve had in college, whether for credit or not, will ultimately be relevant.</p>

<p>Sure I am agreeing , that if you have an undergrad chem degree , that will have a great deal to do with how you do on the MCAT, and you wouldn’t be applying ( probably) for a Ph.d program in engineering, if your undergrad degree was in modern dance- but while some courses are pre-reqs for the ones you really want to take & a 3 credit class may really require 12 credits worth of time & intensity, another class may seem like * fluff* at the time, but really have resonance 10 or even 20 years later.</p>

<p>I have to quote Steve Jobs again :wink:

</p>