Agree with the good Cardinal- an excellent chance to prove his “debugging” chops.
What’s going on and what’s the most efficient way to put additional resources?
Like I said, it sounds a bit like an excuse to “blame” multiple choice tests, but on the other hand, you can’t address a problem if you don’t identify it first. “I suck at multiple choice tests,” is the problem … and having just looked at his grades yesterday, he was venting. If he stops there, then I’ll call it blaming something outside himself; if he works on getting better at it, I’ll call it articulating the problem. Studying more may be part of it, but honestly, so may just approaching the test strategically … which he himself has said he doesn’t do and needs to learn to do. Studying more without changing his approach to multiple choice tests may not net him huge improvements … but dealing with both very well might.
Regarding the multiple choice tests, how did he do well on AP and SAT tests in high school if the multiple choice format is the problem? Multiple choice tests are often easier, due to the possibility of being able to reverse engineer the answers, or quickly eliminating incorrect answers.
Yes, as mentioned above, an auto-grader for CS assignments is like a automated testing program that one will see and write in industry software jobs. And often the exact output format is necessary to be correct in industry software work.
He needs to disabuse himself of that idea right now. Auto-grading is not unfair in evaluating computer programs; as ucbalum and I have pointed out, that’s how the pros do it. And I doubt the multiple-choice engineering and physics tests are unfair, particularly if they are problem-set type questions. In engineering, one has to get the details right.
^^ MC tests are potentially easier if you approach them strategically, as you describe. If you approach them directly as you would a free response, then they aren’t really any easier and often harder. He only looked at his grades yesterday and we’ve spent a grand total of about 20 minutes chatting about them and the way forward, so it’s early in the process … we’ll see what he does as far as specifically addressing learning how to do MC tests strategically. On the SAT math he did great … problems were either logic or 1-2 steps, not triple integrals with trig substitution ;-). And he knew the SAT was a strategic game, so he approached it strategically; it doesn’t sound like he’s been approaching his technical course tests the same way. SAT reading comprehension he struggled with (okay, not really “struggled” … because he got a 740 … but relatively speaking, it was harder for him to improve his score there) because he had a difficult time identifying “the best” answer for some of the questions … he’d get it down to two good ones and invariably chose the wrong one. We told him he needed to adopt the George Costanza Mantra: “Do the opposite of your instinct.” He did, and did better. AP’s he did okay, but always better on the free response than the MC section. So, this is not a new thing. The cost of it is just higher now.
^^Cardinal Fang, he never said college tends toward the unfair in grading … that was another poster.
Just a thought on this: a lot (many? most?) of my students copy their homework solutions from solutions manuals available on the internet or from each other. They get good grades on the homework, but they often don’t understand a word of it. After all, I could get kindergarteners to copy something down. If your S is not struggling mightily with the assignments before resorting to the easy route of copying them off the internet, he is not really learning how to do the problems. Just how to copy them down. You might want to inquire about that. Expect total denial on his part.
STEM programs are hard and have a high attrition rate for a reason.
I’ve seen this a lot and I don’t think it’s a problem with multiple choice tests.
There are plenty of kids who got all A grades in math/science in HS, 800 on their math SATs and can’t be successful in a college-level STEM program. I think he needs to seriously consider changing his major – it’s only going to get harder.
@sylvan8798 - I hope he’s not doing that, and I don’t think what he’s shown me bears that out at all. The projects couldn’t be copied … they were original design projects. He did okay on free response quizzes in class in calc and physics. So I don’t think he, “doesn’t understand a word of it.”
@soze - If he gets to the point he wants to change his major, then I’ll support that. He had a horrible first semester for a variety of not-uncommon self-inflicted reasons. He did better this semester … with more room for improvement … and for him, part of that is learning to do better on the multiple choice tests. If he wants to keep trying, I’m not going to tell him he’s washed up and has no chance after a semester in which he essentially earned a B average. He’s not a finished product yet … he’s still growing and maturing and changing as a person. Yes, the material will get harder, but he’s not a fixed entity with no potential to rise to the occasion.
“tends towards the unfair in grading” is my comment, and I only mean that as opposed to HS, where there are many, many assignments, where a bad grade or a single poor test does not – generally – drag a grade down past redemption, college grading is based on many fewer pieces of work, with higher stakes, and much less room for error of any kind. Perhaps “unfair” is a bad word choice, but certainly many high schoolers are very shocked learn the lesson personally, and feel it is an “unfair” assessment of their understanding and abilities. But that is neither here nor there…
Having to change your major out of STEM does not constitute being washed up. There are lots of other fields outside of the technical ones that are worthwhile pursuits. I say this with some authority as the parent of a Music major and a Journalism major.
The problem with the multiple-choice test questions, is it math problems, like triple integrals with trig substitutions, where he makes small mistakes? I have that issue, and I solve it by doing complicated problems more than once.
First semester is also hard for many students because college courses are run differently (requiring much more self motivation and time management than high school courses, even AP courses), and students are often distracted by the new social environment.
What, specifically, was the programming class? If it was an intro class, then I’d be worried. That kind of class should be a cakewalk for a STEM student.
For many types of engineering majors at many schools, it may be a computing for engineers course using MATLAB.
I would expect Computing for Engineers Using MATLAB to be a cakewalk for a STEM student. Then again, I’m a programmer. But if he has programmed before, picking up MATLAB shouldn’t have been too hard.
Multiple choice tests can indeed be tricky for theory-based questions. But in freshman math, physics, and chemistry classes I’d expect there to be few theory questions and a lot of calculation questions which have black or white answers. Some people just freak out when presented which different options for answers, so maybe reading a couple test-taking strategy books might be helpful.
But the true way to succeed in challenging STEM classes to actually understand the material at a deep level rather than just being able to pick the right formula and plug in the right numbers. This was a mental “aha” moment for me in my own freshman year when I was struggling in Calculus and Chemistry. I was getting C’s on tests but A’s on assignments because the tests would flip everything we had learned into a different perspective. They tested understanding rather than knowledge, if that makes sense. My leap was one day after I cranked out my homework, asked myself “wth did I just do and why did I do it?” I then went back over every step, questioned “why use that formula there, what does the formula actually do, why is it applicable here, is there another way to do the same thing, and why is this problem relevant to the material as a whole?”
After that leap I started doing just fine on my tests. I was one of those kids that sailed through high school, top (well 2nd) of my class, never had to study much. Got to a top engineering college, realized that of my 3 roommates I was the lowest IQ by a decent margin, and struggled in my classes. Making that intuitive leap that I needed to actually understand and not regurgitate was my “aha” moment that saved me. And it actually saved me a ton of time cramming for finals, since I would take the time to understand and review the material constantly throughout the term. The challenge was good for me and low grades were the kick in the butt that I needed. Absent any mental/emotional issues, hopefully your son will have his own “Come to Jesus” moment.
Regarding the automated assessment of computer programs, I agree with others that it’s completely fair and unbiased. It’s a bit lame but that’s how introductory programming works - you only care about specific input/output. Later on in higher level programming classes things will be more subjective and offer more room for creativity.
You may hope he’s not doing that, but it seems to be the norm right now. Take a look at the actual homework assignments and you may very well be able to tell. Denial is a powerful force, but not a helpful one.
ETA: I’m sure a lot of my student’s parents would be very surprised at what their kids are or are not doing in that regard.
anomander has a lot of the same points I was thinking. Just being able to do homework sets and having “studied” aka read all the material = B-, not a solid B and not an A. In college, and especially in an engineering prereq, you are trying to think beyond what you are taught and be able to answer associated problems. The test questions, multiple choice or not,
My guess, having been through engineering myself, and yes, well, schools do have multiple choice tests for large classes …
Not working hard enough. Doing homework sets only as assigned, even if material hasn’t quite sunk in. Taking AP credit in Calc rather than taking the harder university class and getting ready for Calc II spring semester and Calc III, the hardest in sophomore year. Not studying each topic in Physics, a survey course of mechanics (fall) and electrical (spring), as it is taught and then not having time to absorb the material.
Engineering is a hard major, especially in 4 years, and trying to accelerate by using AP credit might just be crazy. No, your son, surrounded by well prepared HS students (SAT scores in engineering are likely 100 points or more higher, so he is not special), is not ahead, actually he is now behind since 60-70% of his peer have gotten higher grades aka understanding out of freshman year. Deal - the world is full of smart people who work hard -> engineers …
Cut out a lot of the ECs, until he gets an A on 50% or more of his midterms. Treadmill for 30-45 minutes every day, fine, not training for a marathon. Parties only on Fri and Sat night. The people in midweek parties, in the student lounges BSing, and at the gym … won’t be engineers, I’m guessing … or yes, they are smarter, more prepared than your son.
He has all summer to study both semesters of physics … he did really poorly and all but chem e are well physics based. Chemistry … not sure … but he is missing something here too. Blessedly triple integrals are a thing of the past, but he needs to understand some of the theory a lot better than he does. Get ready for differential equations, another hard class. If taking statics, really brush up on freshman physics I.
Engineering requires a lot of work during college, not much partying or marathon running (other than the marathon of keeping up with 4,5,6 hard classes). That’s why they pay real salaries when you graduate, you have crammed a lot of info (science, math) into your head, learned to work on problems, and worked dang hard so they think you will work dang hard for them.
Really a multiple choice test does involve quick thinking and quick checking of your work. Not much different than if your boss asks, real-time, so what happens if we double power in this device or what happens if we need to reduce weight by 30%. You need to know those basic questions and be able to think fast.
Summer - study 4 or more hours every week … go back to school shooting for 3.5 next semester (mix of A and B, no C). And … engineering only gets harder, wait until you see what they have in store for you junior year.
Who is @runningmom2 and who is @ailinsh1? I am confused.
It almost seems as if the specific college is not a good match, and that (both of?) your son(s?) need to adjust to the assessment methods. The good news is the free responses and the projects. He is definitely “checked in”, he just needs to dial in the logistics. I do not think there is anything to be done, except to stand by him and encourage him.
I am sure he is being hard enough on himself, and having to deal with the reduced choice in majors consequence is “punishment” enough. He needs people to believe in him. You be the person (people?) who believe(s) in him!