<p>The information on the boards about schools is rich but tends toward the exclusively positive. No school is perfect - each has its own strengths and weaknesses, its own warts and areas for improvement. We've gather all the positives on the following schools, and these are the ones we are most interested in. Can anyone provide the knock on any of these schools keeping in mind that these are our favorites? Not looking for a savaging of these schools that are all great in our view, but we are looking for realism & balance:
Groton
St. Andrew's
St. Mark's
Lawrenceville
Middlesex
St. Paul's</p>
<p>Thanks</p>
<p>P.S. Feel free to PM if you aren't comfortable saying publicly.</p>
<p>What is a “plus” in one person’s opinion can be a “minus” for someone else. On paper, St. Marks was a great fit for our DS. When he visited, he did not like the “all under one roof” layout of the school. He found the feel of the building to be claustrophobic, and took it off his list. Other students absolutely love the fact that you move from class to class without ever going outside, especially during cold winter months.</p>
<p>I was having a tour yesterday with just me and the student guide, when she started pointing out smoking spots and asked me if I smoked! That shocked me a bit, and probably put me off the school a bit too, and I’m sure there are a lot of schools that still have quite a heavy smoking/drinking atmosphere.</p>
<p>St.Paul’s & Lawrenceville are great schools, but have very different atmospheres. Groton has had highly publicized issues in the not to distant past & has barrack type accommodations for the younger students. St.Mark’s had, not sure about now, a very active drug scence, and, accordingly, was a very mellow school. I don’t really know enough about Middlesex other than it’s well respected. Research St. Andrew’s over the past few years. Something negative was in the press, but I cannot recall the details.
All are great schools offering outstanding instruction. Probably would not send an 8th or 9th grader to Groton, however.</p>
<ul>
<li><p>SAS lacks a “star” Science Center and associated tech doodads. So no DNA sequencer. No solar telescope. And, as far as I know, they do not have a robot team. Some people care about these things.</p></li>
<li><p>For that matter, to most people’s eyes, SAS lacks a “star” building in the vein of Exeter’s library, Choate’s art center, etc. I happen to find Founders Hall at SAS extremely impressive, but then again, I’m the dad that’s still pushing his kids to write handwritten notes. ;-P</p></li>
<li><p>Because of the size of the school, there are fewer performing arts options. I’m thinking here primarily of the acapella groups…the larger schools have multiple groups whereas SAS only has Noxontones (if we don’t count the semi-official “Tad Off-Tones”).</p></li>
<li><p>Because of the size of the school, there are fewer course options. So the course catalog isn’t going to be as thick as someplace like Andover because they simply don’t have the number of kids to support either ultra-ultra-high level math/science classes (like the kind that only 2% of the population would even understand) ora similar breadth of niche electives.</p></li>
<li><p>Looking at sheer numbers/percentages, the SAS college matric might seem weak to some. It doesn’t send 20% to the HYP, MIT+ Stanford group. I think this matters to more people than will admit. That said, I know they’ve sent kids to HYP+S in the recent past. Their placement is certainly good enough for me, and I went to a non-HYP Ivy back in the day.</p></li>
<li><p>It’s in Delaware. I personally don’t think this is a “knock” but I know many do. To which I ask "Have you been to the thriving metropolis that is Lakeville, CT lately? </p></li>
<li><p>Small school could result in more limited social opportunities. I say COULD, because I doubt someone graduates from a school of 1000+ having more close friends than someone from a school of under 300.</p></li>
</ul>
<p>I don’t think there’s an “active drug scene” at St. Mark’s. Perhaps twenty years ago? Today, they do expel kids for substance use. It’s a sanctuary school, which means students can claim sanctuary for themselves or a friend. This shields them from being expelled, and is thought to make it easier for students to report dangerous behavior. It gives kids a second chance (monitored, restrictions and therapy second chance.) A second incident has more severe consequences. I should note that they’re firm on substance penalties, but they’re even stricter on honor code violations (lying, cheating, etc.)</p>
<p>The school does have a warmer, less pressured feeling than some other schools. It’s small enough that interested students can try out thongs. The students do not all dress as if from the same catalog. Some students find serious interests in the arts while at St. Mark’s. I suppose it is more mellow than some other schools, in part because they aren’t all trying to Go Ivy.</p>
<p>St. Mark’s places emphasis on preparing students for lives of service and character. I’m afraid I agree with the importance of living one’s ideals. Thus, I refuse to gossip about other schools. </p>
<p>Visit. Fit will be obvious to you and your child. Listen to your child. If you are so fortunate as to have choices to make in March, go to all Revisit Days. Ask probing questions at that time of the other parents, students and faculty. I was a true pest at a school my kid didn’t choose in the end. You will be stunned by the honesty of the answers you may receive in person. Above all, listen to your child and your gut.</p>
<p>St. Mark’s had a major drug bust within the last 5 years, not 20 years ago. Probably pot, but I don’t recall the details. Regardless, St. Mark’s is more laid-back than most elite New England prep-boarding schools. Visit before deciding for all boarding schools.</p>
<p>We will be sizing up fit touring the six schools and, if fortunate enough to be accepted, revisiting when the time comes. Part of what I’m looking for is things you don’t know until you are already committed and attending, things you wish you had known.</p>
<p>Thanks to all for the feedback thus far. 7Dad - I appreciate the huge hunk of feedback. It is especially gratifying to get a full picture including knocks from someone who is a big backer of the school.</p>
<p>Oh wait, here are a few more possible downsides of SAS…</p>
<ul>
<li><p>No internet in dorm rooms. Yes, you read that correctly. Not even ethernet cables. For that you have to go to one of the common rooms.</p></li>
<li><p>No phones in dorm rooms. Not such a big deal in this age of cellular phones, but worth mentioning.</p></li>
<li><p>SAS dorms are dated and adequate, nothing like the new dorms at Choate. But as I’ve noted before, it’s not like SevenDaughter was sleeping in the Taj at our house. This may be the biggest “knock” I’ve heard from parents who’ve visited.</p></li>
<li><p>Fairly strict “no cell phones” in public policy. I think they are trying to fight the good fight against the “always be texting/tweeting/status updating” mindset of the younger generation.</p></li>
<li><p>Jacket & Tie Dress Code for boys, with similar guidelines (cardigans or blazers) for girls.</p></li>
</ul>
<p>Periwinkle: I was thinking of St. Mark’s, but I could be wrong. Regardless drugs are around at most high schools. if I could edit my earlier post, I would.</p>
<p>Let me just say that almost ALL boarding schools are going to have an “active drug scene”. I’m a freshman in boarding school, and I know that drinking, smoking, etc. are common among students, especially because many students are rich and can afford to buy anything they want. I know many parents want to believe that they are sending their child to a safe bubble, but drugs, alcohol (and especially sex-it’s a bunch of teens living together, let’s be honest) are rampant. That being said, I love my boarding school experience so far, but I just thought this needed to be said, as many parents seem woefully ignorant.</p>
<p>I’d like to back Willem up on this, as a parent. It seems that all of the above are available for those intent on seeking them out any <em>any</em> high school…public school in a wealthy/middle class/poor area, private day school, boarding school. Each student decides what is for them and what is not. There in no such thing as a perfectly safe bubble. The good news is that, at least as far as I can tell, each kid’s choices are respected among their peers in the boarding environment. Those that abuse the rules are well aware of what they are doing, and do get caught on a regular basis.</p>
<p>A quick note on the younger (i.e. 8th and 9th grade) student dorms at Groton. They are not “barracks-style” but they ARE quite a bit different from other dorms in that the walls between rooms (mostly doubles) do not go all the way to the ceiling. They stop at about 6 1/2 feet, iirc from our tour. The rooms themselves are new and well appointed. That said, we definitely felt it was a downside. Friends we know who visited LOVED the feeling – they said it seemed “private yet not isolated”. </p>
<p>Another downside to Groton was that younger students were not permitted in the library for study hall. Instead, they were corralled into this massive “classroom” - complete with desks in what passed for rows, and chaos. It seemed counterintuitive to the concept of supervised quiet study.</p>
<p>Groton seemed very stiff - an example is the “do not walk on the green” rule. I also thought the old study room with the built in wooden desks was not a good system - very old fashioned and the room seemed noisy which for some students would be problem if they need quiet to concentrate. The dorms have the non-floor to ceiling walls which is odd - not sure the point of it. Wouldn’t say it’s a barracks however.</p>
<p>According to the admissions folks at Groton and our tour tour guide, the idea of the 3/4 walls is so that younger students don’t feel isolated, while maintaining some measure of privacy. I recall they mentioned some research or “proven theory,” but since it was such a turn-off for us, I frankly did not pay it much attention. </p>
<p>We also felt the general atmosphere was rigid, and the attitude of the administration was more punitive, for want of a better word, than at any other school we visited except perhaps Kent. For example, the penalty for getting a certain number of demerits for various infractions was, we were informed, to be given manual labor in view of the student body (such as raking leaves or carting trash). “That,” according to the AO with whom we met, “will teach a kid to appreciate the value of a prep school education…”</p>
<p>That said, for families or kids who like a highly structured environment, Groton may be nirvana. It simply wasn’t for us.</p>
<p>Don’t have to get demerits to take out the trash, rake leaves, wash dishes or any thing else I need help with around the house. I think if you ask, you’ll find similar consequences at almost all the schools for multiple minor infractions otherwise what would you have them do? Its not so much structured environment as consequences for your actions or lack thereof.</p>