Where Would You Go (UMiami, USC, UCLA, or UCSB)

<p>Here it is:
From an article dated September 26, 1997:</p>

<p>*Quote:</p>

<p>“The average household income of a UCLA student, for example, is now higher than for a USC student. In a city long accustomed to thinking of USC as a "rich kid's school" and UCLA as where the children of the middle class end up, it's hard for many Angelenos to accept how things have changed.
"The [socioeconomic status] profiles of UCLA and USC students actually crossed eight years ago," said Professor Morton Schapiro of USC, who this month published a study of trends in higher education finance coauthored with Michael McPherson, president of Macalester College in St. Paul, Minn. "It's just very difficult for people to understand. It contradicts the common sense notion that the richer kid should be going to the more expensive school." * Strange</a> days for colleges facing rising costs - special section: Catholic Colleges and Universities | National Catholic Reporter | Find Articles at BNET</p>

<p>hawaiiboy15 -- are there a lot of asians at UCLA... that is to say in greater proportion than in the US population?</p>

<p>I was saying how people bring it up and it sounds like it is very negative.</p>

<p><a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/university-california-los-angeles/188766-asian-invasion.html?highlight=santa+barbara+asian%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/university-california-los-angeles/188766-asian-invasion.html?highlight=santa+barbara+asian&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>JW,
The SC stats are out of date. Check out the freshman profile on the SC website. Scores are higher. The admit rate was 22% for the class that just enrolled in fall of 2008. However, certain schools at SC have much lower rates of undergraduate admission, notably School of Cinematic Arts 4%/5%, School of Music, School of Theatre and Annenberg School of Communication. Certain programs such as Computer Science-Games are also highly selective. Last year, according to the class profile, there were 35,901 applicants for the freshman class.<br>
The campus newspaper had an article this week which quoted the Vice Provost as saying that applications have risen from last year.</p>

<p>
[quote]
The SAT 25-75% is the most telling indicator of college selectivity and thus desirability. Take it at face value unless there is compelling reason otherwise.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>More out of date stats:</p>

<p>UCLA: 91% had h.s. GPA of 3.75 and higher
USC: 53% had h.s. GPA of 3.75 and higher</p>

<p>UMiami is at the top for me</p>

<p>Well, mostly because I live in the East and it'll just be more convenient. Also, the idea of being near the Gulf Coast just makes me giddy.</p>

<p>ucla is very competitive (first hand experience). pre med asians wont go down without a fight. but most of the competition is around the B grade range...if you can rise above the rest youll find that ucla isnt too hard of a school.</p>

<p>honestly, if the costs of attending ucla and usc are the same, i would go to usc. having more attention would certainly be nice.</p>

<p>ucla has tons of asians. they can get annoying after a while. i would imagine usc is more diverse.</p>

<p>
[quote]
More out of date stats:</p>

<p>UCLA: 91% had h.s. GPA of 3.75 and higher
USC: 53% had h.s. GPA of 3.75 and higher

[/quote]
</p>

<p>RAND</a> | News Release | RAND Report Shows California Schools Lag Behind Other States On Almost Every Objective Measurement</p>

<p>UCLA draws more than 97% from CA students while USC draws about 50% from CA students. So GPA is meaningless in absolute number because CA k-12 ranks near the bottom interms of every objective measurement.</p>

<p>
[quote]
California's public school system lags behind most of the nation on almost every objective measurement of student achievement, funding, teacher qualifications and school facilities, according to a new RAND Corporation analysis that is the first comprehensive examination of measurable dimensions of the state's education system.</p>

<p>The study issued today chronicles how the state's K-12 school system has fallen from a national leader 30 years ago to its current ranking near the bottom in nearly every objective category. It was funded by the William and Flora Hewlett Foundation, which is working to build support for improving California schools.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>The</a> Daily Bruin - Editorial: Out-of-state students could save UCLA budget</p>

<p>
[quote]
UCLA is currently enrolls about 97 percent in-state students. Each of these students pays roughly $8,300 a year for tuition. But non-resident students pay more than $20,000 more for the privilege of attending UCLA, which makes accepting more out-of-state and international students a good solution to UCLA’s budget crisis.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>"UCLA: 91% had h.s. GPA of 3.75 and higher
USC: 53% had h.s. GPA of 3.75 and higher "</p>

<p>Give me the kids with the higher test scores and lower GPA any day. The test scores are actually STANDARDIZED and the spread is real, significant and in the aggregate, reproducible. Scores can't be altered by "feel good" teaching techniques or rampant grade inflation. Everyone is on an even keel, from those students in the inner city to those at fancy prep schools, it's a baseline from which everyone can be fairly judged. As far as the "rich" kids being able to afford a prep class- can the argument. The prep classes don't teach anything one can't learn from a 20 dollar prep book available for loan from the library.</p>

<p>"A more legitimate excuse is that UCLA pays relatively more attention to grades and class rank than SAT, and this as a substitute for AA from which they are barred."</p>

<p>I have this issue with the University of Florida- the Asian to African American SAT Spread is OVER 135 points out of 1600, or about 1 Standard deviation. Ugh..</p>

<p>USC
Miami
UCLA
UCSB</p>

<p>
[quote]
The SC stats are out of date.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>
[quote]
More out of date stats:</p>

<p>UCLA: 91% had h.s. GPA of 3.75 and higher
USC: 53% had h.s. GPA of 3.75 and higher

[/quote]
</p>

<p>The stats are that posted currently at College</a> Navigator, which is run by the U.S. Department of Education (which inexplicably is a very good website). It has a handy comparison function, and it appears the same methodology is used to compare between schools, so a 25-75% SAT at one school is compiled in the same way as at another.</p>

<p>Note that I posted a link. If anyone has a comparison site with more up-to-date numbers, you too can post a link, rather than grouse about the numbers at my link. </p>

<p>Comparing GPA between schools is fairly meaningless. Is UCLA using the UC Weighted GPA formula in your example? We don't know. USN&WR doesn't use GPA, but rather what percent in Top 10% of class, which is also problematic. UC admits moreso on the basis of GPA and class rank, as a back door AA. This is the likely reason UCLA and UCB 25-75% SAT's have a relatively wide spread. Students graduating near the top of lousy high schools are admitted despite subpar SAT's. By such means UCLA can tout an ostensibly higher GPA than USC. But which is the more selective class? When in doubt, go with the SAT, especially when one school has opened up a 100 point composite score advantage over the other.</p>

<p>
[quote]
There probably is scant difference in family income between USC and UCLA

[/quote]
</p>

<p>While USC has more Pell Grantees (as a %) than any other top private school, it is a whole lot less than the ~33% at UCLA (and Cal, for that matter).</p>

<p>From The Princeton Review</p>

<p>University Of Southern California:</p>

<p>Academics:</p>

<p>"The University of Southern California boasts “a dynamic and culturally diverse campus located in a world-class city which is equally dynamic and culturally diverse.” Everything related to cinema is “top notch.” Among the other 150 or so majors here, programs in journalism, business, engineering, and architecture are particularly notable. The honors programs are “very good,” too. One of the best perks about USC is its “large and enthusiastic alumni network.” Becoming “part of the Trojan Family” is a great way to jumpstart your career because USC graduates love to hire other USC graduates. “Almost everyone talks about getting job offers based solely on going to USC.” “The school seems to run very smoothly, with few administrative issues ever being problematic enough to reach the awareness of the USC student community,” says an international relations major. The top brass “is a bit mysterious and heavy handed,” though. Also, “they milk every dime they can get from you.” Academically, some students call the general education courses “a complete waste of time.” There are a few “real narcissists” on the faculty as well as some professors “who seem to just be there because they want to do research.” Overall, though, students report that professors “make the subject matter come alive” and make themselves “very available” outside the classroom. “My academic experience at USC is fabulous,” gushes an aerospace engineering major. “I would not choose any other school.”</p>

<p>Student Body:</p>

<p>"The one thing that unites everyone here is “tons of Trojan pride.” USC students are also “intensely ambitious” and, while there are some “complete slackers,” many students hit the books “harder then they let on.” Otherwise, students insist that, “contrary to popular belief, USC has immense diversity.” “The stereotypical USC student is a surfer fraternity bro or a tan, trendy sorority girl from the O.C.” You’ll find plenty of those. Many students are also “extremely good looking.” Ethnic minorities and a high number of international students make up sizeable contingents of the undergraduate population as well. If you’re gay, you shouldn’t have any problems. “No one cares what your gender orientation is,” says a first-year student. “The only important question is whether or not you can be hooked up with.” There are “prissy L.A. types” and “spoiled” kids. In some circles, “family income and the brands of clothes you wear definitely matter.” However, “though there are quite a few who come from mega wealth, there are also many who are here on a great deal of financial aid.” There are “lots of nerds,” too, and a smattering of “band geeks and film freaks.” Most students don’t stray too far from the mainstream, though. “You have to go out of your way to find funky people,” advises a sophomore."</p>

<p>Campus Life:</p>

<p>"Students at USC complain quite a bit about their “smelly, ugly” housing. Recreation facilities aren’t much, either. “For such an athletic school, the student gym is embarrassing.” Also, students stress the fact that the area around USC is “impoverished” and “notoriously unsafe.” “People get mugged all the time.” On campus, though, life is “vibrant.” There are more than 600 student organizations. Theatrical and musical productions are “excellent.” School spirit is “extreme” and “infectious.” “Football games are huge.” “There is absolutely nothing that can top watching our unbelievable football team throttle the competition,” says a merciless sophomore. “Drinking is a big part of the social scene” as well. “We definitely have some of the sickest parties ever,” claims an impressed freshman. “Greek life is very big” and, on the weekends, a strong contingent of students “religiously” visits “The Row, the street lined with all the fraternity and sorority houses.” Students also have “the sprawling city of Los Angeles as their playground.” It’s an “eclectic place with both high and low culture and some of the best shopping in the world.” “Hollywood clubs and downtown bars” are popular destinations. Art exhibits, concerts, and “hip restaurants” are everywhere. However, “you need a car.” L.A. traffic may be “a buzz kill” but students report that it’s considerably preferable to the “absolutely terrible” public transportation system."</p>

<p>University Of Miami</p>

<p>Academics:
"University of Miami students are convinced that their school offers “the perfect blend of academics, athletics, lifestyle, culture, and weather.” You probably already know about the “beautiful campus, fabulous climate, and unyielding sense of school spirit” at Miami, but are you aware of “the world-class faculty and innumerable research and internship opportunities across disciplines”? “Academics are the sleeper at UM,” undergrads here agree. This “perfect-sized school” offers “a great communication program” as well as solid programs in biology, marine science, film, and business. In all areas, students benefit from “amazing academic resources and a variety of learning tools. Also, internships, internships, internships! Most programs require them now,” ensuring that “students of all different fields get hands-on opportunities to gain experience before going out into the ‘real world.’” Undergrads also note that “thanks to a low student/teacher ratio in most classes, you can build a relationship with your professors, valuable for future graduate school applications and resume references.” While “some students come here merely to party and enjoy the city,” others “are extremely dedicated,” and are well served by a school “that is working hard to increase the value of the degree for its students.”</p>

<p>Student Body:
"University of Miami has a reputation for being “a rich kid’s school,” and it’s true that “you will see parking lots filled with Beemers and Escalades and shoulders slung with Balenciaga, Louis Vuitton, and Coach and eyes shaded by Versace, D&G, and Chanel glasses to name a few.” But it’s also true that “University of Miami is one of the most diverse colleges in the nation. One will find all types of ethnicities, religious and political faiths, as well as cultural backgrounds” here. The Hispanic and Latino communities are substantial, and there are “many international students.” As one student puts it, “Miami is like living in a public-service announcement: beautiful setting, racially diverse people, [courses] available in other languages. The average student is upper-middle-class, is at least bilingual, studies during the week and goes out Thursday through Saturday, complains about the freezing weather on 65-degree days, and knows how to snag a private study room in the library and what clubs to go to in South Beach.”</p>

<p>Campus Life:
"“Studying doesn’t seem like such a chore when you’re sitting outside under the sun on a 70 degree day in January,” UM undergrads agree, noting with glee that “while students elsewhere are wrapped in blankets trying to stay warm, students at the University of Miami are enjoying beautiful weather year-round.” It also helps that “the campus is absolutely breathtaking. I swear, each day I walk to class I have to remind myself it’s college, not a resort. It makes it a joy to get out of bed and get to class when you get to stroll past the fountains and under the sun into the air-conditioned environment of knowledge. With patio sets at each school and library, there’s no excuse not to open a book. Here we study and enjoy the weather.” When it’s time to unwind, students hang out by “the lake in the middle of campus surrounded by palm trees” or work out in “the state-of-the-art gym.” Hurricanes football is a big draw, and “football season is crazy, especially our week-long homecoming celebration.” There are also “lots of free activities” offered by the school. For most students, though, “Social life is primarily focused off campus, at Coconut Grove and South Beach, each filled with clubs, bars, restaurants, shops, and movies.”"</p>

<p>University Of California - Santa Barbara</p>

<p>Academics:
"“Don’t believe all the hype,” students at the University of California—Santa Barbara say, meaning the hype about UCSB being nothing but a hard-core party school. Undergrads want you to know that “UCSB is a serious academic institution” with “outstanding academics” and “opportunities to participate in high-level scientific research,” though it “also happens to be the most beautiful place in the world in which to be stressed out.” Five Nobel laureates (including three in physics) pepper the faculty, and, “Because this school is [mainly] undergraduates, real professors teach you. . . . My ECON 1 professor was President Reagan’s national economic adviser and created Reaganonomics. That is pretty cool.” UCSB is most highly regarded in the sciences. The university’s Marine Science Institute facilities provide “invaluable fieldwork and lab experience with top-notch biologists,” and the school’s multiple nanotechnology centers are “revolutionary.” Programs in physics and material sciences are also highly regarded. Intro-level lectures can be “gargantuan,” but students point out that though “It is easy to complain that the lectures are huge and that it is hard to get into classes,” the experience here “all depends on the amount of effort you put in. There is always help if you choose to seek it.” One undergrad agrees, “There are hundreds of academically challenging classes and amazingly talented teachers at UCSB, but it is up to the students to go out and make the most of their academic experience. Nothing is handed to us.” UCSB has done a good job of moving administrative tasks online: “Grades, registration, communication, transcripts . . . it’s all done on the computer. Financial aid is automatically deposited into my account. There really isn’t a need to stand in line for services because you don’t need to, but if you do they’re generally helpful.”</p>

<p>Student Body:
"The “stereotype of ‘beautiful beach kids’ does exist,” writes one student, who notes that “I have heard the joke that UCSB is the only UC that requires a head shot in the application. However, there are all types of students that attend the school, and anyone can and does find their niche.” Undergrads here are generally “more laid-back and less stressed out about school” than most college kids and “take school seriously, but also know how to enjoy their youth.” They are typically “very athletic and in shape. They love the outdoors.” Oddly, students perceive their campus as “pretty White” even though Chicano, Latino, and Asian populations are relatively high; their perception suggests a campus on which students of different backgrounds don’t often intermix." </p>

<p>Campus Life:
"“Life here is very chill. I mean that in the best way,” a UCSB student reports, adding, “People aren’t freaking out about classes or stressing out. People just do their work and then go hang out at the beach” or “in IV (Isla Vista, the local, mostly student community).” A sophomore brags that “everything I need is on campus or nearby in Isla Vista. I hardly ever need to go off campus or drive anywhere.” The beach is a constant temptation; as one student points out, “UCSB is on the beach . . . literally. As I’m writing this survey, I’m looking out my dorm window and seeing the ocean, just feet from my building.” Surfing, swimming, and sunbathing are all big, as are “hiking up to the waterfalls, rock climbing, spearfishing, kayaking, scuba diving, [and] beach volleyball.” Most parties take place in Isla Vista, where “17,000 19-to-21-year-olds are all jam-packed into this six-tenths-of-a-square-mile community, so you can imagine how the parties are. . . . Every night is wild, but, obviously, Friday and Saturday nights are the craziest.” For some, Isla Vista “can get boring, because it’s the same party every weekend,” but for others, it never grows old. Downtown Santa Barbara “is beautiful and perfect for nights out, movies, or an outing.”"</p>

<p>University Of California - Los Angeles</p>

<p>Academics:
"It’s all about diversity in activities, academics, athletics, race, religion, and sexuality at UCLA; or, as one student puts it, “academically competitive, athletically dominated, and overcrowded.” One of the most vaunted schools in the UC system, Bruins take advantage of the school’s location and opportunities in order to “learn as much as you want in whatever field you desire, while being engaged in non-academic endeavors that are equally as stimulating and interesting.” Students here “have a lot of things going on that are not always academic or on-campus,” and “their outside experiences and passions are reflected in their contributions in class and on campus.”Being a large university can be a double-edged sword, and while those enrolled here are thrilled to be able to “take classes in practically any subject you can imagine,” many do wish class sizes were smaller, and “it’s very difficult to get classes, especially in competitive majors.” “In Chinese, most classes get filled very quickly because econ, business, and everyone else wants to learn Chinese right now,” says a junior. Though there are a few complaints of disinterested professors at lower levels, once students reach upper-division courses, “the professors are extremely knowledgeable and often have written the book, literally, on the topic they are teaching.” With such a wide selection of courses and departments, reviews range from “not always the greatest teachers” to “very smart and make themselves very available.” The curve can be tough, and students begin to think of their learning as “studying longer and getting better scores than the person next to you in order to place higher on the curve.” As far as step-by-step guidance goes, you “do have to be self-driven at UCLA,” but “if you’re determined enough you will be able to accomplish whatever you need (within reason, of course).” “It’s all on you to get your stuff done,” says a sophomore biology major."</p>

<p>Student Body:
"UCLA’s a tough school to get into, and everyone here “was accepted for a reason,” so most students are “well-rounded” and “extremely driven,” whether it be academically, athletically, or dramatically. That being said, they also chose to go to school in one of the liveliest cities in the US, so the typical student “regards academic success highly but does not make studying the central focus of their lives,” and there’s a “balance of work and play.” There’s a “very strong Asian presence,” and most people are involved in extracurricular activities, but beyond that, it’s difficult to find any other common characteristics of a UCLA student, other than that they “study hard and hate USC.” “Everyone, and I mean everyone, belongs here,” says a sophomore, referring to the extraordinarily broad student spectrum. “It doesn’t matter; there will be a group of people who are EXACTLY like you, and they will probably have formed a club for it already.”</p>

<p>Campus Life:
"While at times, the school can seem large, “there are always programs going on in the buildings to help you meet new people,” and most people use some form of club, organization, or sorority/fraternity to narrow down their circles. Since most of the apartments are within walking distance of the dorms, which are all grouped together, “there’s a sense of community. You don’t lose track of your friends in the crowd.” Students here are “really concerned about academics and getting into graduate/professional schools,” but on weekends, many still go to parties at the frats or off-campus apartments. “There seem to be times when no one does work, at other times everyone is busy and stays up studying for days at a time,” says a student. Westwood offers everything a college student could want, from shopping, movie premieres, going to the beach, or attending the “great concerts in the area, most of which are very well priced.” Naturally, sporting events are “a huge part” of the school, and all “take great pride in being part of such great tradition.”"</p>

<p>UCLA
UCSB
USC
Miami</p>

<p>just 'cause i prefer the UC over USC. cheaper, worth the money. </p>

<p>and all the peeps concerned with diversity at UCs, I would just like to point out that california in itself has a LOT of diversity. </p>

<p>1) NorCal and SoCal are COMPLETELY different. NorCal is more hippie-ish, has more asian influence, etc. SoCal is more laid back, lots more sun, more conservative (but still pretty liberal). So right there, with a mix of NorCal and SoCal kids (it's like 2 different states), you've got plenty of diversity. </p>

<p>2) California and the west coast in general is very diverse, especially compared to the east coast. I'm not saying that the east coast isn't diverse, i'm just saying that the west coast has more outside influences--from asia, latin america, etc.--and reflects that diversity, from food to culture. Right there, more diversity.</p>

<p>3.) California is very, very big. we could be our own country if we wanted to. With big population comes lots of diversity-->what else could you want?</p>

<p>UC</a> Berkeley A Close Second | Asian American University | GoldSea</p>

<p>
[quote]
The reader has a point. Taking the undergraduate student body as a whole, UC Berkely's stated Asian percentage of 40.9% is higher than UCLA's 38%. What's more, UCB's White percentage is lower than UCLA's 37%, adding other dimensions to the title of "Top Asian American University". But, as with all statistical arguments, the resolution demands clearing up some semantic points.
First, UCLA has a larger undergraduate population, with a total of 23,615 for the 98-99 academic year versus only 21,738 at Cal. UCLA's status as the biggest of the 9-campus UC system has some bearing on the title.
Another semantic point is the terms "Asian" and "Asian American". Berkeley's Asian stats are actually labeled "Asian/Asian American", suggesting that they include foreign Asian students. The figures for UCLA don't include the 700 or so foreign students of whom about 500 are believed to be Asian. Including them would have increased the UCLA Asian undergraduate percentage to 40.5%. Together with UCLA's 8.5% edge in total undergraduate population, UCLA would boast several hundred more Asian students. But we admit that the contest is close and, given the fluctuations over time in student enrollment trends, Cal could easily regain the top spot any quarter.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>USC
UCLA
UCSB
Miami</p>

<p>USC is on par with if not better than most majors at UCLA given the huge class sizes at UCLA. Also, being an OOS, I think I would have trouble being around people who pay a quarter of the tuition I pay yet receive the same education. UCLA does have great graduate programs but as an undergrad you wouldn't have much access to these anyways. It's generally accepted that USC is better for undergrad while UCLA is better for graduate/medical school. </p>

<p>UCSB is highly underrated, especially on the East Coast. However, it is definitely a few years away from reaching USC/UCLA's level in terms of academics. Beach is awesome though. </p>

<p>UMiami is also on the rise and probably on par academically with Santa Barbara. But I don't think even Miami can beat UCSB's weather/social scene.</p>

<p>UCLA, definitely</p>

<p>UCSB</p>

<p>USC / Miami</p>

<p>For me, it came down to UMiami and USC-Marshall. I’m proudly attending UMiami in the fall. USC has alot of great programs, but its in the ghetto of LA which is definitely not where I want to live. Also, the grading system at Marshall is kind of screwed up. Like they give out a certain number of As, Bs, etc. each semester. So basically, your grade is based on how well or poorly you did compared to your other classmates. </p>

<p>UM’s campus is beautiful, and it’s located in coral gables which is pretty safe. Also, there’s so much personal attention there (much more so than you would get at UCLA or UCSB as those are state schools) from counselors, etc. </p>

<p>Anyways, my list would be</p>

<p>1) UMiami
2) USC (still an awesome school, there were just somethings I liked about UM better, but it was close)
3) UCLA (great school, but I hear it’s pretty cut throat)
4) UCSB (Unless you live on the west coast, it really doesn’t have that much recognition)</p>

<p>Overall, remember there’s more to choosing a college than rankings and academic programs. You have to choose where you think you’ll be happy and where you think you’ll fit in the best. If you pick based off only the academic side of things, you might end up hating your school and doing poorly anyways simply because you don’t like it there.</p>