Which Art School?

College Majors Visual Arts and Film Majors
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A few corrections are in order . . .

Unlike SVA, SCAD is NOT a for-profit school. That information is easily researched. Not that it matters since SVA is also an excellent institution.

It is true that SCAD is not NASAD accredited but their programs of study are pretty much on par with any such accredited school, as our research revealed before our kid enrolled. Unlike conventional schools of art and design, SCAD offers additional majors that NASAD accreditation would prohibit. SCAD finds that accreditation simply too restrictive so they don’t pursue it.SCAD IS accredited by the same association that accredits Emory, UGA and other institutions of higher learning in GA.

I believe @ArtAngst is an instructor of art? There are some instructors out there who are not fond of SCAD. SCAD does not give tenure to its instructors which is a big bug a boo with some of them because it means no job protection. Instructors are hired with yearly contracts and they are fired if their teaching is not up to par or they become deadweight. As someone who is very familiar with the academic community and deadweight among tenured faculty, I happened to prefer SCADs approach. If some instructor sucks or is unproductive, he or she SHOULD be fired. Why pay a ton of money for sub par training? I would much rather that my student receive instruction that is current with industry standards.

It is true that you must maintain a 3.0 grade point average in order to maintain your scholarships. Kids do wash out because the acceptance rate is high and a good number of kids, like my own daughter who is there, come in without much studio art experience. SCAD believes these are learnable skills achieved through hard work. Make no mistake, it is very very difficult at times. However there is hope for those who do need to transfer. Pratt, as just one example of a NASAD accredited institution, takes SCAD transfers. At least according to my oldest who is at Pratt and sees them come in.

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Just an aside on SCAD–You can look up on-line (and in CC) a lot of the politics that have surrounded SCAD in recent years. It is a not for profit school but many think that it has been operated as a for profit school because of its president. And the points JBStillFlying brings up about tenure are true but many at SCAD think that not having any tenure of sorts makes it too easy to get fired under current political climate. Some good professors quit or were let go in recent years not for ability but rather politics but it appears to vary greatly by department.
I personally have no idea of the current climate. Just so’s you know to research what major YOUR kid is applying to and how things are going presently.

I will echo the admonition about maintaining grades at an art school (not just SCAD) to keep a scholarship. Art is time-consuming, talent oriented and not an easy “A”.

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My oldest has seen higher turnover at Pratt than my D has at SCAD. Turnover and politics in academia are hardly new phenomena.

One genuine concern about SCAD: the large concentration of animation majors. That naturally makes it more competitive for jobs. But the quality of instruction in that department, according to my junior, is superb. Most students are pretty oblivious to the inner fighting at any school.unless a department implodes or something. These seem to be more the concern of adults with a bit too much time on their hands. And disgruntled faculty, as mentioned earlier.

I’ve posted several times about SCAD and any interested person is welcome to google those comments. And review the stats. Most importantly, visit the place and figure out whether it’s a good fit.

Paula Wallace is near retirement so look forward to a transition, for good or ill. The school is still in foundation, of course and that comes with unique bumps. But I suspect it will remain standing over the long haul. It’s simply too successful and has too many satisfied families to do otherwise.

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Just a few clarifications - @JBStillFlying flying is right, sorry didn’t do all my research on the profit/vs non profit. And to clarify again I am NOT saying SCAD is by any means a bad school or bad choice. BUT, I do personally know of some serious issues re how aid is given freshman year and the sometimes negative experiences if one chooses to transfer. Glad to hear Pratt takes their credit. For those who don’t it can be a very upsetting realization for the student and their families. But then again, transferring anywhere is wrought with emotion and stress.

The parent asking these questions is new to the forum so it’s something I felt should be considered. Was not meant to demean or diminish any of your own children’s experience and I personally want to hear your experiences too for a fuller picture.

And re NASAD, as I stated above I do think there’s pros and cons to the accreditation. The particular field I teach in we talk about this a lot because to maintain NASAD we have to cover things that we feel are outdated and then we struggle time-wise to add in things like new technologies we know our students need to succeed in their professions. So the fact that SCAD can quickly adapt to the marketplace is a huge bonus for them and their instructors - and is very applicable to the animation department as @JBStillFlying also noted.

The other drama re faculty etc I’m not privy to. Yes, I’m a college art instructor, but a part time one who for the rest of my week works in my field. So I obviously see both sides of that issue too and think there’s a lot to gain by having fresh faces who are working in their field.

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My knowledge of transfer credits is pretty poor as neither of my kids has attempted to transfer to another school (art or otherwise). We have one family member who did fashion for a couple of years at SCAD then transferred to Bryn Mawr with another major entirely and graduated from there. Have no idea how many credits transferred but some definitely did (probably GE’s and some electives). Obviously with the new major she had to spend dedicated time on that. I believe she was longer than 4 years in college but that’s understandable given the complete change in direction.

Pratt will take studio credits as long as the studio matches what they teach. That’s generally a consistent rule for any school, of course, but the point that NASAD schools might be easier to transfer in and out of can’t be discounted, simply because they have a more uniform approach. Additionally, SCAD is on the quarter system which makes for a fast-paced curriculum; if you transfer out say, after two quarters of a given sequence, you might find you have to repeat all of Semester Two elsewhere (assuming you are remaining in the same major).

But as for what you learn while at SCAD the lack of NASAD accreditation simply isn’t a concern for foundation or - at least for animation or some of the other decently-ranked fields - major studios. The website includes the full course of study for all majors with course descriptions so anyone can look that up and see - and then contact SCAD to ask questions. They periodically review whether to join NASAD and have always concluded that it would limit their ability to add or drop curriculum or methods, as @ArtAngst is saying. NASAD accreditation definitely has its benefits - for instance, they run National Portfolio Day - but it’s not strictly required in order to earn a BFA. Our local flagship runs a perfectly fine and rigorous BFA program but is not NASAD-accredited. On the other hand, if you are looking into a program for the first time, knowing that the school has this accreditation is comforting. It’s really a “Floats Your Boat” kind of issue. If you (like me) scrutinize curriculum and hours in studio before even looking into career prospects, accreditation is going to be a secondary issue at best. If you just want to rest easy knowing your kid is at a “tried and true” NASAD program, you may prefer going that route instead.

“I do personally know of some serious issues re how aid is given freshman year and the sometimes negative experiences if one chooses to transfer.”

Scholarships are a complicated business at SCAD so here are some details for those interested:

A. SCAD’s grading system doesn’t include +'s or -'s. High and low B’s are B’s, not B+ or B-. So for every C you must earn an A to offset it - otherwise you will lose your scholarship because you dipped below a cum. 3.0. That’s what’s happening to those who are given good money and lose it. Two things about that: 1) the school is very up front about their grading and these minimums; and 2) As soon as you are back at 3.0 you automatically earn back your scholarship. My D had a roomie first year who experienced this. She didn’t have a good first quarter but she was back on track by the end of 2nd so had her scholarship reinstated automatically. No need to petition - it’s automatic. This is still harsh and a lot of kids wash out as a result. There’s little room for first quarter transition/rookie mistakes. My oldest at Pratt has a lower threshold and it doesn’t kick in till after foundation year (then every sem. thereafter). SCAD is every quarter from the beginning. So that first quarter, if you are earning an 85% in one class and a 76% in another, you have to make sure that third class is 90% or better. This can be stressful if you don’t have a lot of art experience coming in; other students who have that experience haven’t had to worry about it.

B. Your scholarship is in effect for, I believe, up to 225* credit hours (five years) rather than the typical 180 (ie four years) since many SCAD students decide to pick up a minor or two and might take an extra time to finish as a result. AND all scholarships are in effect for all four quarters of study, even the summer. In contrast, most art schools offer Zero financial or merit aid for summer. For some reason, my kid loves taking at least one course (usually a Gen. Ed) in the summer, even if she’s working, so this has worked well for her (SCAD has a decent online option so you needn’t remain on campus).

*Going off memory here.

C. IMPORTANT! - and this is a MAJOR source of complaints even though SCAD again is pretty up front and straightforward: your scholarship WILL be reduced by something like 1/3 if you move off campus (or you’ll get a reduced scholarship if you opt to live off campus from the get-go). SCAD isn’t unique here (they are also not the only school to grade w/o +'s or -'s) but these always tend to come up as major parent complaints because suddenly someone is paying a higher tuition bill. But anyone reading through the terms of the scholarships (ALWAYS a good idea for any school) and attending SCAD parent orientation will leaving fully understanding their scholarship policies and practices.

D. Personal experience: SCAD worked with us to make sure my daughter could attend (YMMV). They closed the financial gap with additional merit aid when she was looking to accept UCF because it was cheaper. SCAD was her first choice and she promised she’d accept if they could just make it a bit more affordable. They did - so she did.

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For anyone that is looking for a strong animation program in a university setting… Loyola Marymount University (LMU) is a fantastic option. They provide students with strong studios arts classes and balance it with animation and core. The animation classes offered vary, and currently there are 2D, 3D, and even a stop-motion class taught by an animator on Robot Chicken. For students that want the pre-production concept side of animation, that is offered too with character design and world building.

Though the website is not too informational, when you visit the actual program, you realize how much LMU truly offers in their animation program, that is housed in the School of Film and Television.

The program is relatively newer compared to others and is currently ranked #12 on the West Coast (Animation Career Review) and is climbing the rankings every year!

Alumni work at Dreamworks, Disney Animation, nickelodeon, Warner bros, Sony, blizzard, stoopid buddy, bento box, bix pix, and many more.

I recommend checking this program out if you are looking for an intense, but worthwhile Arts/Animation program in a university setting.

https://sftv.lmu.edu/academics/undergraduateprograms/animation/

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^#12 is too low IMHO, and they are being “bested” by schools that don’t have the breadth of studio or academic offerings. LMU shows up as only #40 on the national rankings despite being within the top 30 only a few years ago. This is an issue with Animation Career Review more than with LMU. They keep tweaking their methodologies.

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I completely agree! The program used to be ranked much higher, but keeps lowering in the rankings. The funny thing is the program keeps getting stronger every year in terms of students, alumni success, and breadth of classes. Animation Career Review is obviously ranking University programs lower than art schools for some reason, even though LMU holds it own as a strong animation program.

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@ArtAngst @JBStillFlying @gouf78 Thanks to all of you for your valuable feedback. We have a couple of kids from my D’s school at SCAD and all of that you have said above is true. We did hear about the scholarship situation and how it works with GPA (and with the in dorm situation). A friend we know was working at SCAD (now at Lesley) mentioned the professor situation too. Recently we met someone from Atlanta and they outright told us that Savannah is an unsafe city, its better to attend school in Atlanta if opting for SCAD. Until now this is the only OOS reasonably known school she has heard from and that doesnt mean this is her first choice. Pratt, Mica etc are still in her first horizon.
We are just trying to find as much info about options and I did get what I want from this conversation. What I am understanding is that a lot in SCAD is how the kid adapts to it. I have read really bad reviews here in CC of SCAD, and there are some which are success stories.
Here she has even RIT over SCAD so I do not know how those even compare in regards to actual education, internship and then of course the finally the ability to find a job after. Here I am praying that she gets in her top choice school, one at least and with some money. But we can only hope :slight_smile:

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"Recently we met someone from Atlanta and they outright told us that Savannah is an unsafe city, its better to attend school in Atlanta if opting for SCAD. "

The SCAD Savannah campus is perfectly safe. They provide shuttles at all hours, good security for the buildings and dorms, students are up and working at all hours . . .Savannah itself is an urban area with both petty and violent crime (though the latter tends not to happen in the historic district) so you should be smart and aware of your surroundings, like you would in B’more, Chicago, Providence, etc. During the day you shouldn’t have a problem at all, and late night is easily handled with SCAD transportation or Uber. My daughter spends many a late night either at her job or at the animation labs and doesn’t feel unsafe at all. She currently lives off campus and out of the historic district but near the animation studios so a ton of SCAD kids in that area.

Not sure where SCAD has its buildings in Atlanta but the same “urban rules” will apply there as well, obviously.

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“What I am understanding is that a lot in SCAD is how the kid adapts to it.”

I think this is true for SCAD. It’s not a dedicated campus, for one thing. It’s huge, for another. That’s why these campus visits are so important. I don’t think anyone should show up to art college expecting to adapt. You need to find out whether it makes sense to begin with.

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@JBStillFlying yes I understand that. During the conversation I did mention the location of MICA and of places, NYC! I suppose if I am letting a kid go a few thousand miles away from home I have to get used to this.
We will visit. Only waiting for the decisions to come in now so we can minimize the travel

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All very interesting posts. My D19 is intending to go to Parsons, for the BBA in strategic design and management. She has some artistic talent of her own and enjoys making art, but her career goal is to work in a gallery, auction house or museum. She applied EA and should get in with no problem, given the strength of her application (the BBA program looks more at academics than the BFA programs, and she has a high SAT score and strong grades at a rigorous IB international school). She gave serious consideration to Pratt and RISD, and thought about SAIC and SCAD a bit, but Parsons seemed to have the right combination of the program she wanted, a great location and strong placement/networking opportunities. She’s not daunted by the idea of living in New York; she grew up in the New York suburbs until age 11 and since has lived in London and Geneva, and we’ve found Geneva too small and boring. We’re moving to Boston next summer, which works out well – far enough for independence, but not a trans-Atlantic flight to get home.

Thoughts on Parsons from you experts would be welcome! And @SomaRathore, best of luck to your D!

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@Vineyarder my oldest and I visited Parson’s a few years ago and enjoyed the tour. While I can’t speak to your daughter’s major, for GD they are highly respected and ranked near Pratt (slightly ahead or behind depending on which ranking you read). The New School has a rich and interesting history, and the founding principles of socially progressive and purposeful work still seem to guide the school and its divisions today.

At the time, they had limited housing available for incoming first years and not sure if that’s changed. Most of their students are familiar with the area and live off campus no problem. My daughter preferred something that resembled more of a dedicated campus (with housing close to the studios, some green space, etc.) which is one reason she ended up at Pratt. However, I thought Parson’s would also have been a fine choice and Greenwich Village is a really cool place to live and work.

I think with Parson’s you are required to take a course or two at the New School and having a university affiliation pretty much means that Parson’s students have continual access to academic courses of interest (I suppose with NYU being nearby that’s another option, although I don’t remember if Parson’s kids had access to classes there).

I seem to recall that their new buildings were fantastic. But I also loved the charm of the older ones. Your daughter will get a lot of both, which is pretty typical for an art school in a large urban setting.

Good luck to her!

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Thanks much, @JBStillFlying. I think Parsons will have enough decent housing available – it’s just the newest and most convenient dorm, Kerrey Hall on top of the University Center, that’s off-limits to freshmen. My D is looking forward to taking classes at Lang (the New School’s liberal-arts college). She enjoys chemistry and would like to continue with it. She’s also been studying Mandarin since fifth grade (now with a tutor on weekends, since her current school doesn’t offer it), and working closer to fluency will be a plus for her as she’d be able to deal with Chinese gallery clients in their own language. And she does appreciate the social-justice orientation of the New School. Her Parsons Challenge work for her application focused on mass incarceration, police brutality and the Flint water crisis in a suite of three small multimedia works inspired by religious iconography, based on themes she’d explored in a previous photography series. We’re excited to see where it all takes her!

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Thank you @Vineyarder ! D has applied but even if she gets in we are not sure if we can afford it. So even if Parsons is one of her top priority schools it all comes down to being practical for us! The parsons challenge your D did sounds awesome! Good luck to her too!!

@JBStillFlying D’s SCAD scholarship packet came a couple of days back. She has a $12k per year Academic and $5K a year for SCAD achievements. I think :slight_smile: that brings down the cost quite close to instate, if not completely. What is the usual range of scholarship given for SCAD? This is the first packet so we have nothing to compare it to . For now she is saying “If i dont get accepted anywhere, I have SCAD” and that pressure of going to a non art school which is instate is gone. So that is a relief.

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@SomaRathore, My D got a $15,000/yr. but I know others have been given significantly more. A lot depends on academic and creative talent. Did your D submit her portfolio already? I know that they can send out amounts in batches depending on when you submit app. vs. portfolio. My daughter received two separate notifications; one for academic and the other, a couple months later for creative once she had submitted her portfolio. My D had actually been admitted before she had put a portfolio together simply because SCAD has a rolling admission process (or did at the time). She received a third amount when we contacted them to see if they could match her #2 - it was that additional amount that pushed her into the green zone for affordability.

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@JBStillFlying Thank you! She did submit her portfolio right after her application. We received two letters for scholarship in the same envelope. One says its for academic excellence and now I am seeing on their website and the amount given is $1000 - $12000 and they gave her 12K. Dont know how becoz her SAT was just mediocre. The other says SCAD achievement? (Something like that) and that was $5K (this says 1000-7500). I see there is another for creative essay, that she could maybe apply for. She had written to her admission counselor if she needed to submit an essay/artist statement that the website says in the recommended part. And her counselor replied back saying not required but I have a feeling that could have been a part of the creative scholarship. SCAD still does rolling and portfolio is not required for admission, only for scholarship.
They match! That is great to know. Since she maxed the first category we were wondering if negotiating is an option. Thanks again!

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@JBStillFlying What were your D’s GPA and SAT scores? I replied to a different thread I believe, that my D had a 4.29 weighted GPA and 1290 SAT score and was offered $9000 from SCAD, plus $1500 achievement scholarship (plays 3 varsity sports, captain of 2 of them, editor of yearbook, NHS, volunteers, works part-time, submitted a portfolio - has won local art competitions and been accepted to national exhibitions for her work). Thought both numbers were a bit low? Did SCAD raise the amounts of their scholarship offers, or provide an additional source of aid somehow?

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@catlover13 that amount is about what my D was offered initially. She had an (old) SAT score of 1960 (1260 on the CR+M which concords to about your 1290) and an unweighted GPA of about 3.67 (can’t recall weighted). Once she was given another merit package by her #2 choice, we presented that option to SCAD and they ended up giving her a few thousand more. She promised them that if they made it affordable she’d commit immediately and once they did, she kept her word.