Worried about daughter's indecisiveness

Parents Forum
41

I can understand not attending a school you haven’t visited, but not limiting apps to only schools that have been visited. Kids can change and mature A LOT between junior and senior years. You are asking your D to limit her list to schools she liked at age 16 whether or not they still fit the person and student she will be at 18 and beyond. To me, this is not reasonable. The list may stay the same but please give her room to grow and expand her list, if necessary. There will be time to visit before matriculation.

I also strongly agree with others, get the financial parameters in order. Even the brightest kids need direction and help with this part. You may want her to be responsible for her own educational expenses, but her financial aid will be based on you and your H’s financials. She needs to have you run the NPCs for each school and explain the results. She needs to understand the amount you will/will not contribute, the Stafford loan limits and whether or not you will cosign for additional loans (not recommended!).

Work with her. Much of this can seem overwhelming for kids. Her interest will increase as junior year winds down and she see’s herself as a senior.

42

@wisco6 I think I get what you are saying. She just gives very little feedback…likes them all…no specific reasons? My 17 y/o is the same. I think it is just a teenage communication thing. Also, I think they want to avoid the issue as long as they can to get through finals, APs, the last SAT tries, etc. My kid told me I’m stressing him out and that I’m going to get fired if I don’t stop looking up stuff at work for him! lol!

I’m backing off. We are going a few places on a trip to see family next month, but no other plans. I know for me, I obsess until I decide. But my kid is way more laid back, so I have to respect that.

I do think you should estimate financial aid to weed out any schools that are out of the question to avoid a broken heart next spring…

43

@HRSMom - one of the '15 moms (I think) limited college talks to one day a week, say, Sunday. I don’t know if the child or the mom came up with the idea but it decreased the “stressing me out” complaint to once a week. I tried to limit the talk to once a week as well, but I wasn’t as successful - I always found myself breaking that rule.

44

Concerning finances, we are in a position where we are able to give our kids two options, which I suppose I should have articulated. The first option is that my husband and I will pay for their first year and a study abroad experience, should they choose to attend one. The second option is that we finance a year and a half. Our daughter is aware of this, and that’s been something we’ve been straightforward about for a while. If she feels a school won’t be worth the cost she could be potentially paying, she doesn’t look into anymore. That’s her choice.

I should mention that we are a larger family-my husband and I have six children. We’re obviously not going to pay for one child’s tuition and not the others, so the year/study abroad or year and a half agreement is something that we both felt was feasible.

As far as not allowing her to apply to a school she hasn’t toured, both my husband and I feel that a tour is an important factor is choosing a college, and I honestly don’t feel that it’s a very restrictive criteria compared to some others I’ve seen.

45

So…how is your daughter supposed to,pay for,the remaining three or 2 1/2 years? She can’t take loans in that amount. Will you cosign, or are you expecting her to get merit aid to support her studies?

46

Why are you paying for trips to schools that do not meet the financial constraints for your policy?

I assume you are a Wisco resident? If your daughter is NMF UW-Oshkosh offers a full ride.

47

I think I’d be saving the money I spend on tours for tuition, and let her visit schools once she’s been accepted and has a couple of realistic (financially and otherwise) choices. Of course visiting is a good idea, but there’s no reason it can’t be done after acceptance.

48

Sorry if this seems like piling on here, but this is getting more confusing by the minute. Paying for the first year and a half? Are there any cost parameters, or are you committing to pay for that 1-1/2 years whatever its cost? If there’s a set dollar amount you can/will put toward her education, it would be helpful for her to know that amount.

49

It would be best to meet with the school counselor and explain your situation. They would best be able to suggest how to approach the college search based on your financial parameters. The counselor will know your daughters academic record and her strengths and weakness and which colleges are within academic reach and where she has the chance of obtaining the most financial aid. She is not going to get loans to cover 2 1/2 years of college. Given the information you have provided I would only consider schools where she lives at home and commutes to save on housing expenses. As a student I wouldn’t even begin to imagine how the remaining tuition costs would be paid. It would be hard to decide on any college since financial costs is a big constraint. Unless she getting a lot of merit aid I think the choices would be limited. There is going to be a gap between the final costs and what you are paying. My concern would be if she had to drop out after the first year and a half due to inability to pay cost of attendance. As a student she should then go to the most affordable school where she will graduate with the least debt. Come spring of senior year you don’t want to have acceptances but not be able to attend any of the schools. She may have to take a gap year to accumulate some savings for college.

50

Paying for 1.5 years is not helpful. Your daughter can’t fund 2.5 years of school on her own.

I know families who tell their children that they will pay for 4 years of an in-state school and that additional years or an OOS option is child’s responsibility.

I suggest you tour in-state public schools that you can afford. Your daughter can choose one of them after you run the NPC to know how much you will have to pay.

Depending on her grades and scores, she can apply for merit scholarships to fund a different choice.

If her grades and scores are very strong, look into one of the school that meet full need. But these schools tend to be highly selective.

51

Even with the additional information, you’re being unrealistic. Do you have enough to pay for 1.5 years at a $50K/yr school or only a $5k/year school? Do you have 50k for all 6 kids? Or is it actually much less than that? Other than either local public schools and living at home or a HUGE amount of merit aid, your (and the rest of the kids) will not be able to complete 4 years of college. All this traveling to all these colleges that she may not be able to complete is just backwards.

I urge you to speak to her guidance counselor for some help in crafting a realistic college list that won’t result in your D dropping out of school or getting into nothing but colleges she can’t afford because of your parameters.

52

I’m confused about the year and a half option. A year and a half of a $65k/yr school is a lot different than a $10k school. Wouldn’t it be better and more fair to all your kids to set a dollar amount?

That way the can seek out lower priced schools or schools with merit money etc.

And I certainly agree that visiting a college is important but it might not be essential to do so before applying. Sounds like your student needs to spend a lot more time looking for financial resources first.

53

I was thinking the same thing…

And it’s so different from the

mentioned before.

Maybe this is why the daughter seems indecisive—maybe she’s confused too.

54

<<
Concerning finances, we are in a position where we are able to give our kids two options, which I suppose I should have articulated. The first option is that my husband and I will pay for their first year and a study abroad experience, should they choose to attend one. The second option is that we finance a year and a half. Our daughter is aware of this, and that’s been something we’ve been straightforward about for a while. If she feels a school won’t be worth the cost she could be potentially paying, she doesn’t look into anymore. That’s her choice.

I should mention that we are a larger family-my husband and I have six children. We’re obviously not going to pay for one child’s tuition and not the others, so the year/study abroad or year and a half agreement is something that we both felt was feasible.

As far as not allowing her to apply to a school she hasn’t toured, both my husband and I feel that a tour is an important factor is choosing a college, and I honestly don’t feel that it’s a very restrictive criteria compared to some others I’ve seen.


[QUOTE=""]

[/QUOTE]

Holy crap!

There are so many things that just seem horribly naive about the above and the earlier posts.

First, in another post, you’ve indicated that no matter where DD wants to visit, you’ll fly to it. Unless you or your H work for the airlines or have a gazillion FF miles, that seems crazy expensive for a family with SIX kids who can only fund 2-3 semesters of college.

Secondly, if your 6 children were to borrow for the other 6-7 semesters of college, you would end up being expected to cosign hundreds of thousands of loans. Likely, you would be “rejected” some point before the 6th child finished college!

Thirdly, I haven’t seen really ANY effort being spent on identifying schools that would give your child HUGE merit so that your contribution could pay the rest.

Lastly, your DD is only 16/17 years old. She isn’t likely able to grasp the impact of such debt and/or financial responsibility. No wonder your DD has been indecisive. I’m surprised she’s not curled up in a fetal position.

BTW…are those 2-3 semesters of private school costs? or instate public school costs?

And what are your DD’s stats? Hopefully, we can come up with acceptable schools that will save her from drowning debt.

55

I don’t understand this at all. After 1.5 years she is somehow supposed to have an income that will pay for the remaining years of college? How? She needs to know how much you will pay every year for the first 4 years.

Visiting far away schools is a poor use of limited finances. Cheaper to apply and visit later if it’s still in the running. My daughter never did visit a few of the school she applied to because it seemed silly to pay to fly to them. And she also received some offers of free/subsidized visits once she had been accepted or during senior year. I would have felt stupid if I’d already paid to fly her out. As it turned out, she got into schools she knew she preferred and saved a lot of time and expense.

56

You are going to co-sign loans for the last 2 or 2 1/2 years of school? This will be anywhere between about $65,000 and possibly $150,000+ in loans, and you would have to do this for 6 children! Besides being responsible for all of that money, my concern is that once you get to the 3rd or 4th oldest child you will no longer qualify ( however it’s possible that with a Parent Plus loan you will- I do not know much about that loan- but again, why would you want to?). If you told me you were co-signing $65,000 for one child I would think that’s a lot, but still doable depending on your financial circumstances. Doing that for 6 kids is a different situation.

I would strongly encourage your D to apply to schools which give merit aid, and I would check out the NPC to see if any schools would give you FA. If you give us information regarding her stats, we can help you.

57

http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/1678964-links-to-popular-threads-on-scholarships-and-lower-cost-colleges.html#latest

Once more, I’m going to suggest that the OP read the links in the thread above.

A couple of things…

  1. Having parents fully pay for 1 1/2 years or 1 year of college isn't going to do a speck of good unless there is some realistic and possible way to fund the remaining time to get the degree.
  2. Study abroad is optional. If you are looking to save money, your student would be better served by using this money to get a college degree. This kid can always travel abroad after college graduation, maybe even get a job abroad.
  3. Is there a community college within commuting distance of your home? If so, consider having your student start there...at least for one full year. This could probably be funded with money from the Direct Loan, and a job the student had...if you continue to allow your student to live at home at no cost.

Then use your 2 or so years of paying for that student to complete the degree at a four year college.

You are sending a very very mixed message to your kid. You are taking her to see unaffordable colleges. SHE has no way to fully fund these for a couple of years unless she gets significant merit or need based aid…and if that is the case, she would be eligible from year ONE.

Let me say that more clearly, if your daughter qualifies for need based or merit aid, she will get it as an incoming freshman too.

In fact, the best merit aid packages are given it incoming freshmen…not second or third year, or fourth year students.

In my opinion, you are going about this backwards. Here is what I would do.

  1. Set a dollar amount you will pay for all four years...and divide by four. That will give your daughter her ANNUAL budgeted amount from YOU.
  2. Start looking at colleges where the costs are affordable with your contribution plus the Direct Loan.
  3. Read that thread linked above and see if your daughter will qualify for guaranteed merit aid based in her stats. Apply to at least one of those schools.
  4. You can take virtual tours of 3000 plus colleges on your computer. Save your money to pay for visits post acceptance. I hope you aren't buying plane tickets, and staying in hotels for the visits you are making now.
  5. And lastly, don't expect your child to be decisive when you are sending a very mixed message to her. You are taking her to unaffordable places...and you are wondering why she can't articulate her likes and dislikes? Maybe SHE realizes she can't afford to go there.

There ARE ways for her to get a great four year college education. You are not the only family that needs to consider the high costs of college. But you DO need to consider them in a realistic way.

58

OP, it sounds like you might live in WI. We live there too so I am aware of the state schools, and I think it is wonderful that your student has these schools as a choice as right now they are much less expensive than other state’s options. Even Madison, a great school with a national reputation, can be less than $23,000 per year if you are conscious of costs. Some of the other regional schools can cost as low as $15,000 per year, which includes everything (books, dorm, food, fees etc).

The question is how much can you pay or afford for this child’s education, keeping in mind you have 5 others following. First, please figure out a definite figure on how much you can give your oldest. Is it $10,000 in total. Is it $40,000? You really need to know that figure. Second, do a mock FAFSA to see what the government might feel you should pay for your student’s education and then go to a least 4 or 5 different university financial calculators to see what they estimate you might have to pay and see from these if your student might get financial aid and merit aid. I think doing this might give you a better idea of your options. Keep in mind from the posts above, your student can only take out so much money each year in loans. Even if she/he is responsible to pay for the rest, you will still have to co-sign and no matter what your agreement is with the child, these loans are now your responsibility.

Knowing what you can afford is #1 in the college search. Then look at possible merit scholarships etc. to try to find a school that your child and you can afford. You might find with financial aid and merit scholarships a private school is the best option, or an out of state State school. Who knows, if your child has the grades, the ECs, etc., and can get into an Ivy like Harvard, this actually could be a less expensive option than Madison which gives no merit scholarships. However, realistically, you might be looking at your student going to two years of community college, then switching to Madison, or you can swing 4 years at Whitewater, Green Bay, LaCrosse, Plateville or one of the other regional schools (which will also give your student a good education.)

If you can afford the cost of applications, your student can cast a wide net and you can see what options you have when the acceptances and financial packages come in. Then for OOS schools I would have your student check them out after knowing this information. Definitely have your student apply to at least one safety (a school he/she can get into and can afford) as a back up. (Don’t forget if your student goes to an OOS school to add at least $1,000 more to the cost of the school for travel and expenses.) Also with reciprocity, keep Minnesota schools in your radar as you would pay instate costs to go there too.

Our three children had a definite budget and with merit were able to find schools that they could afford. Good luck to you and your children’s college searches.

59

Don’t forget that if your child goes OOS (unless it’s to one of the state’s that gives instate rates to WI residents), her costs will likely be DOUBLE what they are to attend an instate public university.

Can SHE afford that, since that is your expectation for a few years of costs? If not, save your travel money.

60

Adults who work FULL-TIME have a hard time saving for just one year’s college cost. So how do you expect a student w only a HS diploma working only part-time and summers to be able to save enough money to fund 2-1/2 years of college? There is a very stark limit to how much a student can borrow w/o a co-signer.

With 6 kids, it behooves you to run the Net Price Calculators on different schools’ website to get a realistic idea of what those schools are going to cost your family, BEFORE you make open-ended promises to pay.

You should see on CC how many kids needing FA apply willy-nilly to OOS schools, then cry when they find out they don’t qualify for FA as non state residents.