<p>Hi everyone :) I'm thrilled to be an admitted Yalie and am very close to paying my deposit, if not for a few reservations. I consider myself a very tightly wound, type-A, ambitious and politically minded person. Everything about Yale excites me, except for one thing that many consider a plus: that Yalies are more "laid back" than their rivals in Cambridge. This might manifest itself in the less competitive, more intellectual and less career-driven atmosphere, which for many is a plus. If Yalies are more "laid back" though, does this not mean that they are less ambitious, and therefore marginally less accomplished and interesting?</p>
<p>This is no judgement on ability, because Yalies are no doubt a brilliant bunch. Rather, could it be a lifestyle choice that many people enjoy the moment, simply "be", rather than obsess over future plans and successes? Do you not have so many people constantly planning out a roadmap of their future career and wearing their that on their sleeve (not at the expense of college's intellectual opportunities -- just maybe at the expense of time being relaxed). Does this not then create an environment that is not as dynamic (though nonetheless happy), with all sorts of interesting students and initiatives springing up (as compared to -- as much as I realize this is not the best example -- The Social Network's portrayal of Harvard, Mark Zuckerberg, and the atmosphere in which Facebook was born?) Is Yale such a diverse school that there will be a large number who do fit that type-A personality -- those who wear future ambitions in, say, politics on their sleeve? Would someone who does fit that personality not fit in at Yale, and have trouble mixing in the laid back atmosphere? </p>
<p>Again, not necessarily a bad thing -- but could this not be the flipside to the idea of Yalies being happier, prioritizing enjoying the present over stressing over the future? "Fun" just isn't as high on my list of priorities as academics, ECs, and broader ambition, and I worry that I may have difficulty blending in as such. I don't mean to come off as rude, and I sincerely hope that I don't. Just an honest question from a grateful admit. Would really, really appreciate any thoughts. (Looking forward to meet everyone at Bulldog Days!)</p>
<p>Very broadly, I think that Yale’s laidbackness has to do with people not obsessing over competing with each other. People are ambitious, but it’s about taking your personal skills to the limit vs. being better than everyone else. People are dreaming up all sorts of wild and wonderful ideas all the time; it’s a very dynamic place. The vast majority of people who I knew at Yale were type-A. It was more about where you fell on the type-A spectrum vs. whether you were type-A in the first place.</p>
<p>Curious to hear current undergrad input.</p>
<p>As an aside, the people I knew who wanted to (and ultimately did) rock the world of politics nurtured those ambitions somewhat quietly–it was viewed as better strategy.</p>
<p>Are you sure you’re not asking about Brown? (kidding)</p>
<p>I would say that people at Yale are marginally less intense than people at Harvard. I think any Yale student would thrive at Harvard, and the reverse is true as well.</p>
<p>If you’ve been admitted to both Yale and Harvard, then I suggest going to the days for admitted students and judging the atmospheres for yourself. I agree with Hunt’s second paragraph. “Laid back” is not an adjective that I’d apply to Yale students–not to any of them I know, at any rate.</p>
<p>I think this is a fair concern. I don’t know Harvard too well but I think the honest answer to your question is that yes, there would be more of the “ambitious go-getter” types at Harvard.</p>
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<p>I think you are misunderstanding “fun”. I can’t say I know how all Yalies think but I do think I understand my daughter who is a current freshman. My daughter is prioritizing academics and ECs and pursuing them to a very intense level. But she considers those to be “fun” activities. She is not pursuing academics with the attitude of “I need to do well in the academics so that I can accomplish X goal in the future”. She pursues academics with the attitude of “This is so cool, I really want to master this stuff, because it is so cool”. The same is true of her ECs. I get the sense that most of her peers have a similar attitude, though some (e.g. pre-meds) do have a slightly more goal-oriented approach. </p>
<p>In terms of broader ambition, you may be right- my daughter is certainly not pre-occupied with becoming a “success”. She is too focused on enjoying the ride right now. And I happen to approve. I think “success” is overrated in today’s society.</p>
<p>Edited: I just noticed that you describe yourself as politically minded. It seems like Yale has no shortage, and perhaps a surplus, of politically minded ambitious students. My daughter reports that the YPU is full of these people. You will have peers there for sure.</p>
<p>I have always believed that, in general, Harvard students are concerned with carving out some niche for themselves and dominating it, while Yale students are more concerned with community and group learning. But that’s a broad characterization. Yale is full of Harvard types (by my classification), and Harvard full of Yalies. It really doesn’t make that much of a difference which you pick; you, not the college, will be the main determinant of your experience.</p>
<p>That said, I think the OPs first characterization is dead on</p>
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<p>If you think that’s not a plus, if you think it equates to being less ambitious and less interesting, then by all means go to Harvard. Please.</p>
<p>Thank you for the responses everyone. Some very, very insightful posts. With all that’s been said about the laid back atmosphere and the surplus of ambitious, politically minded students, does Yale somehow combine these two cultures? Or are there, in effect, “two Yales”? I look forward to being on a campus full of students planning to enter politics, and am curious as to how prevalent this is at Yale and whether taking yourself too seriously in this sense is frowned upon.</p>
<p>If you’re looking for political hacks, you’ll find plenty at Yale. I recommend you to the Yale Political Union.</p>
<p>I’m very puzzled, however, by the implication that being “tightly wound, type-A, ambitious and politically minded person” implies being interesting. I knew a great many fascinating, brilliant people at Yale, whose minds worked in ways unlike anyone I’ve met anywhere else. Most of them were not the sort of people you seem to be expecting, however.</p>
<p>As for this “two Yales” business, you do realize that motivated, ambitious people (of which of course Yale has plenty) can also be laid back and not hypercompetitive, right?</p>
<p>Go to Bulldog Days, check out some political events (the YPU will certainly have a debate, and you should check out some of its constituent parties, too). You might get a good sense for how the more politically-inclined Yalies combine politics and their social life. And if on the first day you see a bunch of tweed-clad conservatives on Old Campus protesting for the legalization of marijuana… tell them I said hi ;)</p>
<p>Once you are at Yale, you can pretty much do anything you want to do, and you will find people doing the same.</p>
<p>Some people do basically no ECs and spend all their time on academics, some people do the opposite, some people do both, and some people do neither. You will probably naturally gravitate towards the people who are most like you in this respect.</p>
<p>^While I suspect she’ll ultimately wind up in Cambridge, so far Chua’s daughter says she’s undecided. News reports say she’s going to attend both BDD and H’s admitted student event.</p>
<p>I want to add that the ambition is there at both schools, but the nature of that ambition is different. So this means while both are interested in being “the best,” Harvard people generally take the “I’m going to get rich faster than everyone else” approach or the I’m going to “out-achieve everyone else in conventional fields” approach. </p>
<p>On the other hand Yale people take the “I’m going to be more creative than everyone else even if it means I make no money” approach or the “I want to be more intellectual than everyone else” approach. Because of this mindset, in NYC, you find soooooo many random Yale people working at bars or living in quasi-artistic colonies in Brooklyn while you’re more likely to see a Harvard grad wearing a suit and walking into Morgan Stan - sorry - Goldman Sachs.</p>
<p>Inevitably Harvard seems the more ambitious place at first glance, but it’s really just a more tangible (and ultimately lucrative) ambition.</p>
<p>Tbh, my ambition told me to go Harvard - but my field of choice was significantly stronger at Yale.</p>
<p>LOL, I seriously can’t understand all the stereotypes being thrown out about Yale and Harvard over in the Yale forum. Is this forum where the proliferating notion of “Harvard doesn’t focus on its undergrad” originated on CC :)?</p>
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<p>Do you think Harvard is not “laid back” because people obsess over competing with each other? Or that Harvard students want to “get rich faster than everyone else” or “out-achieve everyone else” and Yalies want to be “creative” and “intellectual” ? </p>
<p>As a current Harvard student, I recommend you pick Yale if you really are deciding between the two. A lot of people at Harvard are cutthroat (personal experience -_-) and have a superiority complex about them. I’ve heard few if any stories about Yale being like that, rather Yalies really do seem to get along better. I’m actually planning on transferring out of Harvard to Stanford, but I’m also going to apply to Yale; we’ll see how it goes. And by the way congrats on getting an acceptance on both!</p>
<p>I think the biggest fallacy the OP is making is that laid back = unmotivated, and that type A = passionate. That’s simply not the case. Type-A (at least according to me) is when you drive yourself absolutely insane with accomplishing everything and have no patience for failure. But type-A does not mean more interesting. For example, one of the girls in my grade who got into UPenn is type-A, but she doesn’t strike me as interesting at all she just strikes me as constantly stressed out. Personally, I would go crazy if I were surrounded by people totally stressed out about success. Most people would call me laid back, yet that doesn’t mean I’m not passionate – for example, I am a huge lover of computer science and when my school didn’t have a curriculum for a class in programming I sat down and wrote one for them. But my passion doesn’t make me type-A / stressed out about it, I just love the subject for its intellectual challenge and I love challenging myself with it. So in short, you won’t find a dearth of passionate and motivated people, you just might find a dearth of stressed out people. Which in my book is an absolute plus. But if you like to see people around you pulling out their hair on an hourly basis, this might not be the best place for you.</p>
<p>People are trying to pick out negligible differences that are hardly there. There will always be type A, stressed out students at Yale just as there will be for any academically rigorous institution----if you come from a “laid back” public high school like I did, somewhere like Yale would seem to be full of ambitious people who are stressed over the future just like any top college would.</p>
<p>Yalies are every bit as accomplished as their peers at other top-tier schools. In fact, I think the laid back atmosphere helps Yalies become even more successful than they would be otherwise. I got a great job at a well-known organization for after graduation, and the people who hired me kept emphasizing my “social skills” as a very influential factor in my selection. In the end, it’s often people who can balance intellect and ambition with sociability who end up being the most successful. Someone who’s ultracompetitive and blindly ambitious probably won’t play well with others, and in most fields this will work to the person’s detriment. I think Yale has really helped me and a lot of my friends develop into the golden “Type A minus” personality – still driven and intense, but also able to relax and have fun when appropriate.</p>
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