<p>There are many more rules at Swarthmore about one's curriculum (distribution requirements, 20 credits outside of major...) - not necessarily a bad thing, as it ensures broad liberal arts education, but something to consider if one is set on open curriculum.</p>
<p>The Honors program is a very special experience. It can also really help one decide if going into academia is the right choice for him/her.</p>
<p>He really can't go wrong either way, though no matter what his decision will be, there will be days when he might question it... That is the problem with having two great options...</p>
<p>nngmm is right about distribution requirements and 20 credits outside major. My son graduated this year and he reported being very happy with his coursework over the 4 years he had there as well as ability and freedom to take any course he wanted (other than some first year seminars that filled up quickly). It helped a lot with his minor.</p>
<p>BTW, my son is not at all set on the open curriculum. He's the sort who will impose distribution requirements on himself.</p>
<p>Also btw, my biggest concern as a parent is the academic intensity/balanced life issue. But it sounds like lots of students are very happen with that at Swarthmore.</p>
<p>The academic intensity is to a very large degree self-imposed at Swarthmore. If someone really wants to have it easy, it is not impossible (though it does require careful class selection) - but if that's the objective, why going to Swarthmore in the first place?..</p>
<p>wolrab, I am sure your son will be fine at either place!</p>
<p>wolrab,
My son graduated from Swarthmore last year as an Honors Political Science major with a history minor. He managed to take courses in astrophysics, chemistry, physics, religion, philosophy, math and economics, in addition to a good number of history and political science courses. (I may even be forgetting a few departments ;))</p>
<p>This whole academic intensity thing is something all potential Swarthmore students "worry about" beforehand and joke about afterwards. </p>
<p>Here's the deal. Nobody goes to Swarthmore unless they expect to work hard academically. And, yes, they work hard academically. The culture of the school and the bond between the students and faculty results in a student body that more or less tries to make a good faith effort to keep up with the academic work, do the assignments, show up for class, etc. The result is that professors don't have to worry so much about basic "coverage" and can often take the classes in more interesting directions. Some of my daughter's courses had me drooling they were so cool.</p>
<p>In four years, my daughter pulled her first all-nighter two weeks before the end of classes senior year, the night before her thesis was due. She never seemed horribly stressed. She had a routine for getting through finals weeks, she allocated her time, and, if she had two nights to write a paper, she wrote a two-night paper, and that was that. </p>
<p>I doubt that she would be counted among the most brilliant students who ever walked the pathways of Swarthmore College. Just a regular good kid from a regular public high school, who spend four years working hard at college, enjoyed the heck out of it, and walked away with a major, two minors, a thesis that her professor wants to publish and the ability to think really, really well.</p>
<p>BTW, the corrolary to nngmm's point is that if you really, really want to make it rough on yourself at Swarthmore, you can choose a schedule to accomplish that, as well. And, some Swatties do that, too!</p>
<p>Hmm.. let's say I am going to major in Physics at Swarthmore.. regarding the 20 credits outside my major.. can I fulfill those credits by taking as many credits from the Math and Engineering departments just in case the social sciences and humanities are not really my thing.. or can the 20 credits be taken into account from my second major in let's say math?</p>
<p>You have to have three credits from Humanities and three from Social Sciences. That would leave up to fourteen math and engineering courses go along with 12 physics courses. And, with that schedule, you be one of those people at graduation that nobody has ever seen!</p>
<p>I think you'll probably find that you like courses in the Humanities and Social Science departments. Just a quick glance shows that students getting a BS in Engineering in the Class of 2008 at Swarthmore double majored in Econ (3), History (2), and Sociology/Anthropology (1).</p>
<p>I think Shellfell could answer that question. Her son just graduated from Swarthmore with a major in Physics and a minor in History. He's off to MIT for a PhD in physics.</p>
<p>Thanks for answering for me, ID. Yes, S was a physics major and history minor (honors in both) and was accepted at the majority of grad schools he applied to. He thought he might minor in math before he got to Swat, but didn't really like the courses he took. He also had enough credits to minor in poli sci, but Swat doesn't have an honors minor in poli sci (I think that's what S said). He fulfilled his humanities requirements with philosophy and religion courses. At the dinner the physics dept had graduation weekend, the chair of the dept lauded S for epitomizing what a LAC is all about by majoring in a hard science and minoring in history. He'll see how well prepared he is for grad school since MIT makes them take placement exams when they get there & make students repeat undergrad courses if they don't do well on the exams.</p>
<p>Only 2 other physics grads are going to grad school straight from Swat. One is going to Berkeley; I'm not sure where the other one is going, but I can check with S. I do know that a Swat'07 grad is also starting grad school at MIT this fall.</p>
<p>It seems that Swarthmore's physics department and Swattie physics students are so outstanding that I'm a bit apprehensive that I may not be able to make the cut there..
May I know where did your son and his friends did research during the summers? I am wary that internationals seldom get opportunities to do off campus research during the summer..</p>
<p>Last summer, the HHMI grant alone supported 38 Swarthmore students doing summer science research. 33 at Swarthmore and 5 at research universities.</p>
<p>There is other funding from both grants and Swarthmore endowment for additional summer research positions. </p>
<p>Keep in mind that there are only an average of 100 or so science, math, and engineering majors in a graduating class at Swarthmore. (It fluctuated from 75 to 125 per year over the last decade).</p>
<p>Thanks for the info. I don't know if I am planning too far ahead.. For the first and/or second summer, I really hope to do research off campus to explore about research at huge universities (and maybe get extra recoms)- tho I am fully aware that such opportunities are hard to come by- harder yet for an international.. I'm glad to hear that I have a high chance of landing a research job on campus during the summer.. which is a great thing too..
while the third summer should be spent at Swarthmore to begin the thesis research..</p>
<p>You may end up going to Swarthmore, being overwhelmed with a visit to the Barnes Foundation, and deciding on the spot to become an Art History major!</p>
<p>Things will unfold as they unfold for you. The College is designed, brilliantly IMO, to allow that process to happen. For example, take advantage of the first semester pass/fail to sample departments like a "tasting menu". You might be surprised by some things you don't like and some things you do. Declare a major at the end of your second year, after you've had a chance to take some courses and think about your preferences and your talents. The second majors or minors will take care of themselves. My daughter ended up with two minors, not because that was her game plan, but because she just happened to enjoy those departments enough to take five courses in each.</p>