AA Senior in NYC

Parents Forum
1

<p>Stats:
Senior Black Female in NYC Public School
SAT:600M 600 500
SAT II: Math II 550
GPA: 92
Rank 7/383=2%</p>

<p>Curriculum:
9th-Honors Geometry, Honors Biology, Global, Spanish 3,4, English, Art
10th-Honors Algebra, Honors Chemistry, Global, Spanish 5,6, English
11th-AP US History, Honors English, Physics, Math B, College Business Course, Medical Lab
12th- WILL BE AP Calc AB, AP Biology, English....</p>

<p>ECs:
Altar Server (9,10,11)
School Step Team (10,11)
Church Youth Group (9,10,
Church Sunday School Assistant (9,10,11)
Church Choir (11)
History trip to Paris (10)
S-prep courses (chemistry) at Columbia University (10)
Volunteer in Dean's office at school (10,11)
Gateway Institute for Pre-College Education (9,10,11)
Worked in Pediatric Ward at hospital (9)
American Chemical Society Project seed (10& 11) (research lab)
Fashion Model
NAACP Act-SO Competition</p>

<p>Leadership:
Leader of Step Team in Fall</p>

<p>Awards:
Student of the month_Social Studies
Perfect attendance
Second Award and NAACP awars at NYC Science and Engineering Fair </p>

<p>Major: Biology/Pre-med</p>

<p>Concordia College
Penn State University Park
SUNy Stonybrook, Albany Binghampton,
Fodham,
University of Rochester
CALS Cornell University
CUNy Hunter, City</p>

2

<p>Paul; we've had this discussion before. I have no clue what your daughter's chances are, but she will be a miserable pre-med unless she can get some tutoring for her math. She's in a tough curriculum but her standardized test scores suggest she's missing a couple of basic concepts in algebra (or even just computation) which will hold her back significantly. She either works slowly (i.e. doesn't finish all the questions) or has some basic deficiencies which account for the low math scores. AP calc will also be a miserable experience unless she can work on those basic math skills.</p>

<p>She's obviously a talented, terrific kid.... I'd hate to see her sidetracked because she needs a little extra help. Does her school have a math center, or are there community resources (i.e. a grad student who volunteers or some other person) to get her extra help????</p>

3

<p>What are you talking about? She is taking AP Calc and had received a 98 and 94 on her first tests. Just because she is not a good test taker, doesn't mean she is not good in Math. She has a 94 culmulative average in Math.</p>

4

<p>Paul, that's my point. There's an inconsistency in her grades (clearly knows the material that's been taught) and her performance on standardized tests. So-- why let that hold her back??? If she wants to be pre-med there are lots of standardized tests in her future... not to mention Organic Chemistry mid-terms, etc.</p>

5

<p>According to the College Board, the mean score for Math II last year was a 670; half the kids who took it scored higher, half scored lower. Given that your daughter is on a tough math curriculum, this suggests to me that she ought to be in the top half, not the bottom half. A 550 probably doesn't represent the best she can do.</p>

<p>No offense intended.</p>

6

<p>My daughter's second high school spent the months of August to March covering the same exact material in the junior year honors pre-calc that her previous high school's sophomore year honors algII/trig class covered. At her previous high school, the honors algII/trig kids went straight into Calculus, skipping pre-calc altogether. Her new high school wouldn't let her do that--and now I see why: their honors algII/trig class isn't all that rigorous. My conclusion is that the difference in the curriculum between one high school's "Honors AlgII/Trig" and another high school's "Honors AlgII/Trig" class can be enormous, making grades and SAT scores less reliable in predicting future success. In other words, it's difficult to tell how much grades and SAT scores are a reflection of a student's abilities and how much they are a reflection of the high school curriculum. If the problem lies more with the curriculum than the student, a summer course at a local cc before college could be very helpful in getting a student up to speed. I know that's not helpful with admission chances but it could be very helpful with getting prepared for a bio/pre-med program.</p>

7

<p>Sorry Paulchem but I've got to say that your post is another example of the totally unnecessary anxiety inherent in the College Admissions process today. You ought to be talking to reps from your daughter's prospective college selections. Moreover, what does the student's high school counselor say? No one has all the answers but those are good places to get some perspective.</p>

8

<p>Has D considered retaking the SAT II in math?</p>

9

<p>"What are you talking about? She is taking AP Calc and had received a 98 and 94 on her first tests. Just because she is not a good test taker, doesn't mean she is not good in Math. She has a 94 culmulative average in Math."</p>

<p>It very well may be that she's an excellent test taker, just is not in a school that is very good. If the teachers are not covering the material that is on the tests, your D's grades could be sky high, but she still isn't going to do well on the SAT because she won't be familiar with the material on the tests.</p>

<p>I have seen students who were getting As in AP English, for example, but got "2" grades on the AP exams. The AP exams reflected their knowledge compared to that of students who had better teachers. The students whom I knew with that kind of disparity between APs, SATs and their grades were students whose writing, vocabulary and grammar reflected the fact that their teachers had not taught what the students should have learned in AP classes.</p>

<p>Your D's coursework -- few APs, and few honors, is very light compared to the courses taken by students who excel on the SAT. Many are taking at least one AP soph year, several APs junior year and virtually all APs senior year.</p>

10

<p>I've seen the same phenomenon - in high schools with relatively low expectations, students getting As in AP classes get 1s and 2s on the test. Similarly, students earning nearly straight As in a "difficult" schedule get sub-1400 SAT Is.</p>

<p>A few thoughts, paulchem. Clearly, forum posters have good advice but don't know your daughter. You might seek some outside guidance - perhaps a college math prof? I'm thinking of someone who could provide an unbiased assessment of her readiness for serious college math. Another thought - try some sample SATs at home where there's no pressure and no time limit; if the scores turn out great, then she knows the material and does indeed have a test taking problem. If the scores aren't vastly better, it's probably time for some tutoring.</p>

<p>I'm guessing Calc AB could be a kind of a challenge if the math scores are representative of reality. I'd try to sort things out as soon as possible to be sure she's ready for it. A science/pre-med major will require solid math skills, too.</p>

<p>Good luck to her - she sounds like a fine young woman with a great future in store!</p>

11

<p>Another small piece of information worth having is the school's AP profile. If your school keeps stats the way ours does, they should be able to tell you (a) how many students take the AP Calc course, how many of those students actually take the AP Calc test, and how many get each score. Assuming a large enough sample size, if the bulk of students are getting 3's and below, that tells you something. If the majority are getting 4's and 5's, that tells you something else. Our school provides this information to anyone who asks. Cumulative stats are also included in the school profile that goes out to colleges with the counselor rec, but those do not separate the various courses, it's all one huge number.</p>

12

<p>I don't see why everyone is needlessly obsessed with math for a pre med...pre med students don't need any math usually beyond Cal I. There is no math second on the MCATs I believe....so if she can pass AP Cal AB the OP daughter may not need to take math in college.</p>

13

<p>All I wanted to know is what do you think of the college list</p>

14

<p>Daughter applied to Penn State- University Park, CUNY Honors, SUNY Stonybrook, Binghampton, Geneseo</p>

15

<p>Paulchem, another thread (one about Catholic colleges in the Northeast) made me think about your daughter. Check out Assumption College in Worcester, MA. They have a pre-med program and a brand new beautiful Science Center. One poster mentioned that they give good merit aid.</p>

16

<p>Paulchem,
All I know about is Penn State - they are a numbers driven college. Not a lot of weight is given to anything except stats. Most kids that I know that got into University Park had a 1250 or higher SAT. They are also a rolling admissions school and one can get in with a lower stat set if they apply in the very early fall. My daughter had the same stats as yours number wise and was admitted to PSU but would have had to start in the summer. She applied in Sept of her senior year. This was three years ago. She did not choose PSU. I don't know anything about the SUNY schools. BTW, Juniata in Huntingdon PA would be a match school for your daughter, has very good merit and need based aid and is known for it's high admittance rate for med schools.</p>

17

<p>My daughter got into Cornell ,College of Human Ecology.I'm so excited. We are waiting on the financial aid award She also got into SUNY Stonybrook, Binghampton, Plattsburg, Penn State</p>

18

<p>Congrats. Well done to her. Why did you post her stats again? Kinda funny.</p>

19

<p>Congrats to you and D !! I am glad that everything has worked out for her.</p>