<p>So I have come to the conclusion that the Collegeboard is wrong and should not be "in charge" of admissions to college. This is NOT solely based on the recent score errors.. the recent score errors just underscore the need to reduce the control of the Collegeboard.
I think that the collegeboard initially meant good by developing the SAT back in the 30's or whatever to test students. It was developed by psychologists and was never really meant for college admissions. Over time, college admissions got very selective so colleges decided to use a test to figure out who was the smartest, basically. Rather than create their own, they took a tried and proven "modified IQ test" and asked students to take it. Again, this seems like a fair/reasonable idea.
The problem is, today's society is obsessed with college admissions. I myself am included in that group. Is it really fair to have the rest of our lives determined, in part, by a test developed by a private company?? There is NO fair way to determine if the test is valid. While I have no particular opinion on this, there IS a big issue regarding racism.. in the sense that poorer families (more often black than white) may not "conclude" that a CUP goes on a SAUCER, since saucers are usually asssociated with classier places. Many tests, especially the Verbal part (and the AP LIT/LANG exam) are based in large part on questions which are SUBJECTIVE!! The question designers create questions which reflect an opinion. When you ask "what did the author mean here" It is an opinion question.. yes you can explain WHY you took a phrase a certain way.. but to say a student is WRONG for taking a phrase a certain way just isn't right. These question designers are able to put whatever question they want on the exam. If it is Black History month, and Coretta scott King has just died, maybe they will put a passage on the civil rights movement (ACT, Feb. edition, Reading section) (yes i know ACT is not by collegeboard, but ACT is unjust also). They are able to say what they think we should know, rather than actually being tested on what we should know. In addition, the collegeboard is "NOT RESPONSIBLE" for actions. With these scoring errors, WE CANNOT SUE, because they are a LLC (limited liability corp.). If they are going to have complete authority over these tests, then they must be liable when they mess up! And to say "non profit" is ridiculous.. $82 for an AP exam and $41.50 for an SAT? The SAT takes longer, has more questions, and also has an essay.. how can an AP exam cost TWICE as much for LESS work involved with grading?? I would really like to know what kind of cars the people at the college board drive.
Most people are going to say there is no good solution. However I feel there is. Rather than have each school develop a test for each major/college, the government needs to take over this role. If Bush, and all of our other leaders are claiming that the US is falling behind other nations in math and science, isn't it up to the gov't to increase this? By taking over the standardized test business, the government will be able to better protect citizens (us highschoolers!) from unfair practices and/or prices. The government also will then have a direct role in guiding what we need to learn. Of course we are immediately going to get people asking how we can afford this, when we can't fund the city schools. The solution is very easy. People will still have to pay for these tests. A much less amount, but enough to let the gov't break even (after all, the gov't isn't in the business of making money).
Another problem we have is that AP classes, and a lot of regular classes in general, are taught around the test. By doing this, we aren't necessarily learning what we need to know (for life), but rather we are learning HOW to answer well on the test. We spend several days discussing how to decide if you should leave the question blank, answer, guess, etc. We spend several days on the types of written response questions you'll see, and how to best answer them in as short of time.. this is a waste. The teachers have to be "certified" by the college board to instruct AP courses.. and the highest courses available at the school are AP courses! there aren't Advanced honors or anything, its all AP classes, therefore the college board dictates what we learn.
I have one final question. Isn't it technically unconstitutional for a Federally funded STATE university or college to decide who is admitted and who is not, based on a private company's test?
In conclusion, we really need to get rid of the collegeboard and ACT. Their practices are arguably unfair in regard to questions, payment, and liability. I read a post earlier that said within a few weeks there will be lawsuits against collegeboard because of headlines like "Student commits suicide over rejection from Harvard based on incorrect SAT score" and other things. This might sound ridiculous.. but it is a possibility. I would be highly surprised if no lawsuits came. The problem is, they won't hold up in court because you cannot sue a non profit company. This wasn't written by a disgruntled student who received a low score on one of the tests, or got rejected from a college either. I'm a junior, so I haven't even applied yet, and I did well on the tests, but after looking at some of the things that go on, I've decided it's wrong for admissions to be based on a private company, and if the government came out with a test that I didn't score so well on.. so be it. At least it would be fair.</p>
<p>I don't see how having the government take over the collegeboard's job will improve anything. Nor do I think they have the right to, the collegeboard developed the SAT, which I believe still is and should be an important part of college admisisons, and while far from perfect have done a fair job of running it and improving it (I think the addition of the essay last year was an important improvement).</p>
<p>I see no reason to believe why the government would do a better job of managing the SAT than a private company does. I think sticking the SAT in the large web that is the federal bureaucracy could only make things much more complicated and much worse. Also, right now students applying to many colleges have the choice between the SAT and ACT. If the collegeboard continues to have problems with scores, more and more students will switch over to the ACT. This competition would be ruined by a government takeover. There will be no one to blame for problems and nowhere to turn, if you think suing the collegeboard is difficult, try fighting the government.</p>
<p>A teacher cannot teach for the SAT as it is impossible to know what will be on it. You mention the a passage on Civil Rights in the ACT. That passage did not test knowledge of the Civil Rights Movement but reading comprehension and everything test-takers needed to know about the movement could have been found in the passage. As for teaching for Advanced Placement exams, that is the entire point of AP classes. The reason colleges accept AP credit or place people out of classes through AP's is because they know that the students have learned the equivalent of the into college course in that subject. AP tests are designed to make sure students around the country are learning the same thing so colleges do not have to worry whether they are awarding credit to the right candidates. If a student wants to take a class that is not taught by the AP curriculum, he/she is free to take the non-AP version of the course.</p>
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<p>Depending on how "society" is defined, this may be the only accurate item in your essay. Most of your other points cry out for some research. The inaccuracies include the motiviation for of the creation of the SAT, the ability to sue a non-profit, the amount of work required to grade an SAT vs. an AP exam, the "certification" of AP teachers, the constitutionality of using the SAT, the funding of state Universities, the lack of "advanced" honors classes, and the assumption that the test is racially biased. Take the time to get your facts straight, unless your only goal was to vent.</p>
<p>There is a list of about 300 colleges that don't require the SAT for admissions.</p>
<p>There are always options, and life is not over at age 18 based on a college admission decision.</p>
<p>I posted it here and in the SAT/ACT area because I figured it would fit both areas, but some people might not be reading/posting in both areas. Sorry to make you read it twice?
To respond to critiques: The government may be currently doing a poor job at many things, but I think that it is certainly an option they should consider. Note: this wouldn't be immediate, and Bush is out of office in 2 years so it isn't a given he would be in office when this happened anyway.
I think it is ridiculous that the government is making cuts in education for the war(s). Maybe I will write about that later.
I didn't say the Government has the "right" to take over the CB, and NO, they did not CREATE the SAT. The SAT is a modified version of the Weschler Intelligence Scale, which was modified over the years to fit various purposes (immigration, soldiers in WWI/2, etc). They did not 'create' it, they based it off of the principles that have always been a part of intelligence/reasoning tests. Second, the government doesn't have a right to take over the company.. which is why they aren't taking it over. FOR SURE, and Immediately, the government has absolute jurisdiction with state schools. If something receives government funding, the gov't gets to decide a lot of things for it (such as evolution v creationism in public schools). Therefore, the gov't can easily say that they can't use a private company's test for admissions, especially when that company is proven unreliable at times and possible/arguably unintentionally prejudiced. And we wouldn't be putting all the collegeboard people out of jobs.. because they're a non profit organization, which means they "don't" make excessive salaries, so they wouldn't have an issue with working for the gov't, if they chose to continue. the gov't isn't getting rid of CB, it would just be saying that colleges and universities can't use their test in admissions process.
The ACT may be competition for the SAT.. but it still is not right. I think we should get rid of both company's tests in college admissions (for SURE in state schools.)
Yes I am aware it is much harder to sue the government. BUT, if the government messes up, they are responsible and they will try to rectify the situation because if they mess up, they won't get re-elected! Whereas, the CB doesn't care that much because even if people become dissatisfied with them, and/or the ACT, they have no real choice, because colleges still require the SATII (some colleges) and a lot of Highschools require AP exams if you take advanced courses.. and unfortunately the only "advanced courses" ARE AP courses.
I'm not saying the Gov't should start right NOW, and i'm not saying they will be perfect, either. I think we at least need to explore options, and consider the idea. Maybe I don't have the perfect idea, but I think it is better than what is happening now.</p>
<p>well, the best way is to get rid of the test OR to have the colleges not consider the test as that important, like wut rightwing earlier said, a test cannot be used to determine a person's life. some ppl are just not good at testing. but since there is no other solution, SAT still has its value.
however, recently, more and more college begins to consider the test as only a part of admission. i know one person in my school got 1700 on SAT and get into UCLA, btw he is ASIAN, and lives in WELL-TO-DO family.</p>
<p>and also guys if u feel its exremely unfair to you, then go look at the education system in china, japan and korea, they allow a person to take the college entrance test only ONCE in his/her life. and colleges ONLY look the entrance test, no grade nor activities, one of my friend in china has a very good grade in school(top 10 in the school, the school is the #1 in the province). but he got sick on the day of the test, so he did pretty bad on that test and end up with no college admission.......</p>
<p>China and Japan have some of the best education systems in the world, and are much better than the united states' at public education. if i were asian, i would go to HS in my country, and move to the US for college. I actually envy the Chinese and japanese education systems. and i know they are year round schools. i wish we had that. (o boy.. i'm gonna get flamed lol)</p>
<p>ow. u put chinese / japaenese education systems over korean?</p>
<p>let me inform u public schools in korea teach calculus around wut we define as middle school i.e. 6-7th grade....dat not enuf 4 u?</p>
<p>o my. i wonder if i'll get flamed :O</p>
<p>KrN-sight: I'm sorry that I offended you. I didn't mean to "put chinese/japanese systems over korean", I only referred to the most common asian countries that I thought of. I am aware that korea teaches calc when we learn 6th or 7th grade math. I just didn't say korea because I didn't think of it, and I was just typing what came to my head.. sorry. what do you think of the idea though, about CB? and the only reason i put "i wonder if i'll get flamed".. was because i figured a bunch of people would get mad at me for proposing to take away their summers by having year round school.</p>
<p>Not sure about the solution but you are not the only one who thinks too much importance is placed on the SAT.</p>
<p>^^ no offense taken :O</p>
<p>but i do feel sry for those ppl who only have 1 chance (its do or die >.<)
good thing i immigrated 2 the US. :)</p>
<p>o my goodness...i just realized how flame-like my post is..sry >.<
didnt mean it dat way i just meant dat korea has a rigorous course in terms of school (not 2 mention they have school on saturdays)</p>
<p>''China and Japan have some of the best education systems in the world, and are much better than the united states' at public education. if i were asian, i would go to HS in my country, and move to the US for college. I actually envy the Chinese and japanese education systems. and i know they are year round schools. i wish we had that. (o boy.. i'm gonna get flamed lol)''</p>
<p>I SO agree with you. Btw, I'm also Asian.</p>
<p>i wonder if any (white) american kids have actually immigrated TO china/japan/korea solely for the better education system?</p>
<p>
[quote]
It was developed by psychologists and was never really meant for college admissions.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>The SAT's were originally written to pick out the diamonds. The sharp kids that maybe were going to poorer schools and that could do well in college.</p>
<p>You could not be more mistaken. Please go do some research, or go look at the thread under "college admissions" called "collegeboard is ridiculous".</p>
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</p>
<p>Here is some research:</p>
<p>"Chauncey, a Harvard grad himself, was distressed to watch as class after left the august institution, and failed, in his view, to meet the titanic civic challenges of the times. Together with then-Harvard president James Bryant Conant, Chauncey initiated an experiment to bring Harvard a new type of student, based not on the connections they or their parents had, but solely on what the students knew and their potential for further learning. </p>
<p>The eventual result of Chauncey's desire to make Harvard a meritocracy was the advent of standardized school testing, the founding of the Educational Testing Service (ETS), and the popularization of the Scholastic Aptitude Test (SAT). While still decried by some critics as unfair, the SAT today remains a primary barometer used by thousands of colleges and universities for admission purposes -- and one that hundreds of thousands of high school students fret about every spring. "</p>
<ul>
<li> Business Week web site <a href="http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnflash/jul2004/nf2004077_2538_db078.htm%5B/url%5D">http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnflash/jul2004/nf2004077_2538_db078.htm</a></li>
</ul>
<p>And here is a Q and A with Henry Chauncey from a PBS (government) interview: <a href="http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/sats/interviews/chauncey.html%5B/url%5D">http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/sats/interviews/chauncey.html</a> </p>
<p>Q: But for better or worse, ETS is almost synonymous with the SAT. There's almost a national obsession with educational opportunity. And these tests have become very, very important in everyone's mind. Did you foresee that possibility? </p>
<p>A: I didn't foresee this. And in fact, I and others in the field of testing have tried very hard not to have people put as much emphasis as they do. They have a place, but they aren't everything. And I'm sure that there are some colleges that use tests to a greater extent than they should. They have cut-offs and they don't necessarily look at all the aspects of a student's records. I mean it's not only his school record, but his extracurricular record. What he's done for jobs, what he's contributed to society. All those things should come into a selection process, as I see it. But unfortunately, there are institutions where it's very difficult to spend the time to do the right thing.</p>
<p>Also from PBS <a href="http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/sats/where/three.html%5B/url%5D">http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/sats/where/three.html</a></p>
<p>It was Chauncey who brought the SAT to Conant as a solution for his dilemma of finding qualified scholarship students. He also convinced Conant that the test was an accurate measure of intelligence, not just of the quality of a test taker's education. Harvard began using the test for scholarship students in 1934 and, starting in 1941, required it for all applicants.</p>
<p>Enough research for you?</p>
<p>To the OP: despite what you argue, you do know that the SAT's offered around the world, so if the gov't runs it and suppose we're at war w/ some country or another, those students from that certain country might not get the same fairness in grading or availability in testing at all as the rest of the world. </p>
<p>Plus, even if the gov't does run it, it would be far more complicated under so many laws to even make tests function, such as coming up with non-partisan questions so no one gets offended. And who's gonna grade them or run the machine that would grade them? New fed employees paid with tax payers' $$? What about those who won't ever be affected by college, do they still have to pay?
Collegboard prevents all those probs that gov't would have... think things through before posting stuff like this.</p>
<p>
[quote]
You could not be more mistaken. Please go do some research, or go look at the thread under "college admissions" called "collegeboard is ridiculous".
[/quote]
As BigIs aptly pointed out, you're making yourself look hopelessly ignorant.</p>
<p>Please, don't even disect the miniscule things rightwing wrote about. That's not the point. The point is is that the CollegeBoard is a privately funded system that releases these test that consume kid's life. It isn't fair that this system has so much control over college admissions as well. You can nitpick all the statistical information and reasearch all you like, but that's the bottom line.</p>
<p>Righwing, you are a total racist.</p>