Advice anyone? Help my D narrow her app list?

<p>"..but it doesn't matter since it's part of the consortium"</p>

<p>Does it really not matter? How much time is involved in commuting between Smith and Mount Holyoke, using their bus system? Doesn't this have to take an extra hour, at least, out of her day in commuting time- between waiting for bus, walking from bus to/from class, and actual bus ride? Does this bus run direct between the two campuses, or does it stop at others, adding even more commute time? Will a student really want to do this very often, at the sacrifice of waiting for buses and expending this commuting time each way?</p>

<p>We didn't look at these schools, so I really don't know. But we looked at the Philly area ones. And I know that there Haverford & Bryn Mawr really did share a lot of courses. But Swarthmore was deemed by most to be too far out of the way, too much commuting time lost in the estimation of people we spoke with at the other two schools.</p>

<p>"Bryn Mawr offers 3 levels of ballet."</p>

<p>Sounds about right, a very typical number. The schools that made my daughter's cut appeared to offer more levels than this. She wanted classes geared more closely to dancers at her level, to the extent possible. </p>

<p>But that's my D2, not your D.</p>

<p>"..many advanced classes (by audition--which is a good sign)"</p>

<p>I agree.</p>

<p>My sister (now aged 65) is a professional dancer and went to Radcliffe a million years ago. One of the things she said about Radcliffe, which might be useful to your daughter, is that dance is something you either plan to do professionally, or you don't... if you don't, you explore many more options than if you want to be a professional. If your daughter wants to dance professionally, she will need access to professional programs and being in a city with professional companies will be important; if she doesn't want to dance professionally and just wants to have access to more dance experiences, her options are different.</p>

<p>As for Haverford and Bryn Mawr, when I was in high school across the street from Bryn Mawr College, I took courses at Haverford. It was an easy 12 minute walk that I enjoyed a great deal. There is a shuttle between the campuses as well, but it actually took longer than walking, because there are many walking paths.</p>

<p>monydad: Hear you on Bryn Mawr and mostly agree. Re: Smith/Mt Holyoke consortium, according to schools--the dance consortium cross reg is very popular, as there are many types of dancers at all of these schools and the sharing of resources is necessary and even encouraged. D is used to commuting to NYC from LI (has been taking weekly workshops for several years.) Time spent on the railroad and the trip uptown, etc. can exceed 2 hrs 30 mins. When you live in an area like ours (NYC suburb) "time" is relative.</p>

<p>dmd77: to reiterate D is no longer on the professional dance track for ballet. It is something, however, that is essential to her well-being.</p>

<p>Thank you for sharing your experiences with us!</p>

<p>If it works for your daughter, great. </p>

<p>You must be out there on the island.. or the commute from Westchester is much better. Unless you mean round-trip..</p>

<p>FWIW, I was curious, and this is the only on-point comment I found on CC, from a mom of an MHC freshman:</p>

<p>"What my D has shared with me about the consortium is that it's great in theory, but tricky in "real life". Granted she's a first year at MHC but she doesn't have a car and that makes scheduling more difficult, and makes a 90 minute class potentially stretch to 180 minutes once she adds in the bus rides. </p>

<p>A friend of hers (also a first year) is attempting a class off campus this coming term, without a car. This will give my D a more precise understanding of how "easy" or "difficult" the concept is, without a car.</p>

<p>The consortium was a big draw for her, so of course we hope there's ample opportunity to use it."</p>

<p>Just out of interest, when did your daughter get off the professional-ballet track? My experience, too, is that once dancers leave that track, they don't dance anywhere near as much as they used to, and often start to explore other things. That's why it can be so hard to find really good classes for high-level amateurs -- outside of major population areas, there aren't enough of them who are really interested enough to stay at that level. They do other things.</p>

<p>(Collateral counter-example: One of my nieces quit competitive gymnastics at 16. Looking around for something vaguely physical to do, she took a two-week course on circus performance. Fast-forward nine years -- despite her pre-med BS, she has been a full-time professional acrobat since leaving college, and has been touring the world with a circus troupe for the past two years. Her circus work paid for her last two years of college, too, and got her onscreen in several movies, including Chicago.)</p>

<p>monydad: round trip! Will check out the "timing" during visits. D says she has no problem riding a bus, etc.</p>

<p>JHS: D still spends 20 hrs+/wk at her studio (taking classes and teaching) and most wkends attending 2-3 open classes in NYC, though her attentions are distributed somewhat differently now--less pointe work specifically.</p>

<p>As stated previously in this thread (somewhere back there--LOL) D's growth spurt made it impossible for her to attend a conservatory (like Kirov--where her ballet mistress came from--and the one she had her heart set on at the time.) Dancers must meet physical reqs. (D is rail thin but towers over most males at her school. Her growth spurt also created some foot and ankle problems which is common. She has to be careful. She has been lucky--no serious injuries.) </p>

<p>(and in case anyone is curious--she is quite lovely to look at and is not interested in being a model--she hears that far too frequently for her liking.) </p>

<p>Of course, in spite of this, there are high level programs a ballet dancer can attend, but if the reqs are not met there will be no placement at the professional level. (SO really what would be the point?) A very tall female will add several inches on pointe which makes it just about impossible, and at the least awkward, to be matched with a pas de deux partner. (In professional companies, most male ballet dancers are 5'7"--5'9" and most females 5'4"--5'6".) </p>

<p>BTW: Loved the circus anecdote--heartwarming.</p>

<p>...But these are all details that really shouldn't matter to anyone but us. The original point was to hear personal experiences and opinions about the schools on her list that she could weigh against her own notions. D felt she was at a crossroads and needed to abridge the list before the start of school and her visits. We seriously don't want to visit 25 schools in the fall.</p>

<p>There are many intelligent, experienced and thoughtful posters on CC, and she believed CC could be a helpful resource. She enlisted my help. I enlisted yours. We wholeheartedly appreciate everyone's input. She has a clearer picture now of the direction she wants to go in. So, again, thank you.</p>

<p>One more issue to keep in mind with dance: check the actual class schedules at various college. One problem my d. has run into at Barnard is that there are no evening dance classes, and it can be difficult to schedule the classes she wants around her course work. I think that the serious dancers at Barnard simply take extra classes at Steps, where there are plenty of added options -- it's a very short subway ride, but my d. opted against it. I don't know whether the Barnard situation is typical, but it is something to check out. Also, my daughter doesn't really like to dance early in the morning (and for her, a 10 am class is "early") -- so while it is a seemingly trivial detail, time of day and number of class sections at advanced levels can be very important down the line. That being said, my daughter currently plans a dance minor. I think part of my daughter's problem is that she just that its hard to find time for everything that she wants to do -- and that would probably be an issue at any college. </p>

<p>Do keep in mind that college BA programs for dance are not nearly the level of conservatories or the level of training that top pre-professional studios offer. Even if an audition is required to enroll in certain classes, the top levels of ballet at a LAC are probably not going to be what your daughter is used to in terms of technique.</p>

<p>I don't think the scheduling issue is particular just to Barnard. My D1 attends another LAC and all of the PE-type classes she's taken there have been held during the day. She's had to schedule them in just like any other classes she wants to take. When D2 visited she attended a dance class there that also was conducted during the day. Evening classes obviously have less chance of conflict, that's true, where they exist. So I suppose that would be a plus.</p>

<p>Your other observation has been more the issue for my D1, and in her case it has nothing to do with dance at all:</p>

<p>" ...its hard to find time for everything that she wants to do -- and that would probably be an issue at any college. "</p>

<p>I would have thought though that at Barnard there should be more opportunities than the average to work around this by taking an academic course or two in the evening. Even my D1 has taken a number of evening seminars at her LAC, which does not offer access to courses at Columbia like Barnard does. Depends on whether the particular available offerings are what she wants to take, obviously. But at least the opportunity should exist there, no? I had thought that, due to the General Studies School, sections of a good number of Columbia courses were available to be taken in the evening.</p>

<p>It would be unfortunate if we had to wind up paying for Steps on top of the humongous amount we are already paying. But at least this option is available there; a real advantage of a city location. At more isolated locations a scheduling conflict would have fewer work-around alternatives.</p>

<p>Don't worry, open classes at Steps are cheap compared to Barnard tuition! I mean, assuming a student takes 30 points a year at Barnard, then the tuition for full payers for a 1 semester, 1 point dance technique class for the coming year is $1173. Most classes meet twice a week - there are 15 weeks in a semester -- so therefore you are paying $39 per class at Barnard. Over at Steps a class costs $15.50, less with a 10-class card. For a non-major focused on meeting different objectives for a major -- it might just be more cost-effective to have that tuition investment go to pay for the academic classes, especially given the high quality of dance classes available at Steps. </p>

<p>Of course it is is more money out of pocket to take those Steps classes.... but it seems to me that you get more bang for the buck over at Steps. </p>

<p>My d. has taken evening classes at Barnard, but I don't think that she should try to structure her course work around the dance classes. There are too many amazing courses offered all day long at Barnard and Columbia for my d. to give up on one to make time to stand at the barre doing rond de jamb. I love ballet and so does she... but classes are rather repetitive, and I think she has her priorities straight when she opts for serious academics first. </p>

<p>So if you end up paying for Steps... don't fret -- just think of it as maximizing the value of your dollar.</p>

<p>My first reaction to this post was if paying extra for Steps winds up to actually be the best solution then she could have changed her college application choice(s). Then I realized that in this event her choice would have been the same.</p>

<p>But her interest isn't just in taking regular classes, she actually wants to study stuff related to it, so in her case external classes would not have been sufficient.</p>

<p>For others in similar situations, the message to take from this maybe is also take into account the availability of high-quality alternatives that, though unaffiliated to the college, are easily accessible to it. Just in case. We didn't think of that (or at least I didn't), but I guess she lucked out.</p>