<p>“you will see that, at least as measured twice or more in the 8th-10th grade, this student was in the top 30-60 nationally (and possibly an even smaller number) of math competition aficionados of his age. If that level of prowess continues, and even if it drops somewhat, it is highly coveted by tech schools below the rank of MIT and Caltech.”</p>
<p>Hence the term IF, the first word of my post. No one can know for sure who’ll get into MIT.</p>
<p>Also note that mine was post #2, when all we knew about the OP’s son’s English/history grades was that they were “less than stellar.” That could have meant D’s, not B’s (as we have learned since).</p>
<p>Purdue and Clemson are nobody’s “doormats,” especially out-of-state D students.</p>
<p>I do appreciate your showing us what being patronizing is all about – you are an expert.</p>
<p>IMO, putting a lot of emphasis on “getting into MIT, getting into MIT” will be counter-productive. Your son will become one of the masses of kids with stars in his eyes over his “dream school.” I will tell you a little secret: there is no “dream school.” MIT is a great place, but there are many, many colleges where your son will fit in, be challenged, have a great time.</p>
<p>Instead of trying to change him to fit MIT, find a school that already fits him, B’s and all. I’m sorry, but I really think finding B’s unacceptable or “low” is too much, especially in a subject he isn’t a natural at. </p>
<p>Your son is only a sophomore. Right now he might love MIT but he could change his mind next week, next month, or next year. He should certainly be adding more colleges to his list, no matter what. If you start looking for these colleges and talking them up–colleges he’s more likely to get into than extremely competitive MIT–then he will be less likely to be one of the kids posting “I DIDN’T GET INTO MY DREAM SCHOOL, I’M A FAILURE AND MY LIFE IS OVER” in a few years.</p>
<p>Are you sure he wants MIT? He may be saying that just to please you. Sometimes parent don’t listen or pay attention to signs because they are blinded by their own ambitions for their child.</p>
<p>If you push too hard it will backfire and he won’t get in anywhere.</p>
<p>Your son probably has only visited MIT. He’s also only a sophomore. It’s very easy for students to get stars in their eyes after having a nice experience at one school. There are hundreds of excellent colleges in this country that would suit your S’s needs. </p>
<p>He also may change a great deal between now and spring of his senior year, so what’s a great fit for him now may not be a great fit for him later.</p>
<p>Speaking as a parent of a son at MIT I could tell you that it is a dangerous path to tell your child that MIT is the perfect school for him. There are many wonderful schools and MIT has in my opinion a very specific type of kid even though they have such a variety of majors. I just don’t think it is ever a good idea to portray any one place as the only place. Even if he turns things around and had the whole GPA, SAT and everything else that he needs, it is an admission crapshoot just like any top school. Right now you need to be realistic with the student sitting in front of you, and those are the types of schools that should be discussed. He is young enough that you may be able to turn things around by taking some tours of schools such as MIT and the like.</p>
<p>One example of how the perfect school for a kid can change: When younger S was a h.s. soph, his idea of a perfect school was one without general education distribution requirements to fulfill in college and one without a phys ed requirement</p>
<p>He ended up happily going off to his first choice college, a LAC that happened to have distribution requirements (the one thing he didn’t like about the college).</p>
<p>What probably has been the aspect of the college that most helped him flourish? The distribution requirements, which exposed him in a wonderful way to courses and academic areas that he ended up loving.</p>
<p>The phys ed requirement also got him involved in a new hobby: ballroom dancing, particularly swing dancing, something that he hadn’t done before, but now loves.</p>
<p>I am not ignorant enough to think that MIT is the only school for him. I have every confidence that he could do well at other schools and even befriend other “math nerds”. Based on his exposure to MIT (including several tours, researching programs, meeting currrent students), that is where he wants to go. I believe that it is an informed choice on his part. Will he apply to other schools? Absolutely. Will he be upset if he doesn’t get into MIT? Most definitely. And we will be here for him if that happens and make alternate plans. But isn’t that what dream schools are for? To make some high reaches and hope that you have the credentials and a little bit of luck to get accepted?</p>
<p>Luckily, MIT is an EA school - he can apply EA there, + EA at another top school (U Chicago?) + some good rolling admissions school, and know early on if he needs a lot of back-ups or not.</p>
<p>By the way, I don’t think that the “group projects” at top schools like MIT compare in any way to “group projects” at HS… (what a nightmare that was!..)</p>
<p>In a lot of ways, I love your “go-for-broke” attitude! </p>
<p>What I think you want to avoid is having your son have regrets about the way he’s conducted his life in HS if he doesn’t get in. He shouldn’t have regrets; his accomplishments are outstanding. He’s been competing in math on the merits, and in all reality, the admissions committee at MIT is made of up real people with faults, biases and shortcomings. They will tell you this themselves. There is a danger that admission to MIT becomes a measure of his self-worth. That’s wrong, too arbitrary, and I think you definitely want to avoid that. </p>
<p>I think that it’s really important that he choose a goal that involves less luck of the draw. That’s why I recommend finding an even loftier goal than just getting into MIT - I mean thousands of people achieve that, big deal. For this goal, MIT could be just one of several means to an end, but one that is not in the critical path. Have him choose a goal that is based solely on merit and let him compete!</p>
<p>It is great that he had found his match with his math group friends.</p>
<p>I am also struggling with my son.
He likes every subject but math, he is still in 8th grade though.
He does all his home work except math. so I am nagging all the time. … the more I nag the more he postpone his math home work. This is completely opposite of what I experienced with My DD who is already in college.
kids are different, so you may have to try a different tack than what you are already trying. Take him to more science oriented places (e.g., museum) or have him watch documentaries together. </p>
<p>Also, you could just get all the information from MIT and other universities that you think he fits in and have them laying around the house. That is what I did with my daughter.
Eventually, they will read the material when you are not watching.
It is just that they don’t like it when the idea comes from you. All you could do is to provide as much information you could possibly get and make those available to them.</p>
<p>I agree with CRD that the goal should not be to get into MIT but to get into a college where he can receive a terrific math education. If he is like my S and his friends, this will be at universities with graduate programs or LACs where he can do independent study.
My S and his friends attended: Harvard, Princeton, Cornell, Chicago, Caltech, MIT, Duke, Harvey Mudd, Yale, Stanford. I also know of terrific graduates of LACs such as Williams, Swarthmore, Carleton. Brown has an excellent program in applied math. Among state universities, Berkeley, UCLA, Michigan, UIUC, Stony Brook have very strong programs in math.
Do ask him to take a look at the websites, check their admissions requirements and graduation requirements. If he has a range of options rather than a single dream school, I think you and he will be less anxious about his high school performance.</p>
<p>Nagging works. I was completely unmotivated for the first two years of high school and managed to turn my act around (I was admitted to my first choice school which is similar to MIT, but perhaps NOT as prestigious). However, I will say that my relationship with my parents has been irrevocably damaged because of the pressure they put on me to succeed. This, however, is partly due to the culture in which my parents grew up in, and they were not wise enough to realize that the approach they were taking would hurt me. I love my parents and know they love me back, but I will never look at them the same way again. When I was younger, I went months without uttering a single word to my parents in rebellion. Be wary of the path you choose when it comes to your relationship with your children. I’m not saying that if you nag him he will turn out all bitter (like me), but my parents believed all they were doing was “nagging” when in fact it was much, much worse. (I’m going to stay away from specifics just to protect my identity and such)</p>
<p>Thank you for sharing abc. I hope that with the passage of time, your relationship can be repaired. I’m sure your parents had all the right intentions, but their execution was a little off. I will learn from your story and try not to pressure my son too much. We have a great relationship and I would hate do anything that would jeopardize that.</p>
<p>I am curious what the age limit for dual enrollment is in your school district.</p>
<p>My son petitioned the County to dual-enroll at young age. His middle school math teacher supported him, and the head of math dept in HS was asked to create a “test” to show S had already knowledge of math classes. He had already taken AP math advanced test B and scored a 5. S and teachers did all the work, not me. Point is, the school district HAD to offer appropriate math/science/language classes, regardless of age.</p>
<p>It has been a battle with school officials since he was a kindergartner. Their stand was that their gifted and talented program was fulfilling his needs. Apparently, when the GT program was first established, it was designed to help kids just like him… Kids whose scores were off the charts. Unfortunately, the program has become so diluted because of parents elbowing their way in. As a result, he has suffered through school, completely bored out of his mind. </p>
<p>I have a lot of regrets about how I handled his education. I wish that I had been more demanding about his needs; it just wasn’t my personality. Even now, I worry that I am failing him because he is so unhappy in school. </p>
<p>Bogi- put the regrets behind you and move forward. I look at my kids today (long graduated college, out working, one in grad school) and they are chewing up the world. I was not a terribly pushy parent; for sure we did not advocate for them enough; I see parents of kids who are dim bulbs compared to mine and those parents are so busy helicoptering and pushing and making waves and counting up the honors and accolades at school that they don’t have time to appreciate the actual child.</p>
<p>Your kid will be fine-- great, in fact. One thing you might do is to find a genre of literature that he enjoys and encourage him to make time to read. I look back on my kids K-12 education and although there were many places where we could have or should have pushed much harder to have their needs met, all my kids loved to read. I see them operate in the adult world and that seems to be a consistent pattern among their friends, bosses at work, mentors, etc. Your S will find his way in the world- relax.</p>
<p>Good idea about the reading…Yes I am the nagging mom, but even I know that there are alternative ways to stimulate homework/school work interest. I will invite my daughter to sit by the fire and read fiction (she still doesn’t read for pleasure because she also has very focused interests and sticks just to that subject). I even read her assigned novel out loud to her and then it seems to get her motivated to continue on with her English reading. She doesn’t like social studies much so I often just read the text book, interspersed with comments and discussion…it really helps and is a nice break from the nagging. Also, rent or use Netflix to get movies on the topics they are studying in English and social studies. We have Friday night movie night (kids obligated to attend unless unusual circumstance ie prom) and while we tend to stick to Spanish language films to maintain home language sometimes we will see a BBC Bronte movie or movies on WWII, etc. if it is relevant to what they are doing at school. Now their friends know about our movie night and imagine having a bunch of teens watching dubbed movies on the Spanish civil war?! and enjoying it?! Nagging them to do the unpleasant stuff, seems more likely to payoff (or at least do less damage to the relationship) if you show a real interest in those subjects yourself.</p>
<p>Is your son involved in any clubs at HS, eg academic quiz, or a math club? My son found intellectual peers in these activities. Also, his math teachers just gave him books to read and work at his own pace, & encouraged him to tutor other kids. Son was respected for his math/CS skills, but he had friends equally gifted in music and history. Is your son bored because he dislikes the other courses, or doesn’t have a peer group?</p>
<p>I totally agree with Blossom’s comment, about encouraging your son to read whatever interests him, be that Feynman’s books or scifi.</p>
<p>Compared to fineartsmajormom, I did nothing but drive son to library. I love her suggestion about the movies</p>