And Now for Something Completely Different

Parents Forum
1

<p>My 2 daughters were very focused in high school. They studied hard, were involved in a variety of activities and went through the college research process with some interest. They also kept me informed and let me enjoy the research I was doing. They both came to very different but sound decisions and as sophomores in college are thriving and confident that they made the right choice.</p>

<p>Now, it's my son's turn. He's a junior in high school who has no real focus and no solid academic interests. He participates in cross country and track, but will never be on the varsity teams. He enjoys the challenge of AP classes (Geography last year, US History now, and Econ next semester), so seems to lean toward social sciences. He's bright, but thinks he's a better student than he really is. Effort is inconsistent and usually minimal - especially if there is a sporting event on tv. The only huge interest in his life is camping. He has gone to camp for the past 6 years. This has included 6-week backpacking trips through the Pacific Northwest and New England. He'll be a counselor this coming summer and shows real passion and excitement. He loves working with kids and seeing their enthusiasm for camping grow.</p>

<p>Well, we just signed up for the Jan. SAT and he filled out the profile by checking "Undecided" for all the options - except for Interests, where he checked "None". He doesn't want to follow in either sister's footsteps and I don't blame him.</p>

<p>We took him to a large college fair (kicking and screaming) and he was surprised to see that he found some schools interesting. However, he was judging the colleges based on the presentation of the Admissions reps. Some were terrific and some were nearly worthless. He realizes that this shouldn't be the deciding factor, but these are the only schools in which he has said that "maybe" he'd look at again. They were Michigan State, Colorado College, and Hillsdale College. (How different can you get?)</p>

<p>I've made some gentle suggestions - Forestry, Education, Recreation, Business - and discussed possible job options (short and long term) and I get that look like I'm from outer space. (Parents, I'll bet you know the exact look.) I have even suggested that he attend a local, excellent junior college until he has a better idea what he'd like to pursue. Because he'll be gone all summer, I'd like to schedule a few visits during spring break. He won't do the research, says he doesn't know what he wants to look at, and I'm clueless.</p>

<p>This is a completely different experience for me. Any ideas?</p>

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<p>I have 2 boys. My older son is now in college. After watching all of his friends, from my experience, your son is well ahead already. The majority of my son's friends did not visit a campus until the middle of the summer before senior year. Their parents, or their "private" college counselors helped them to select some schools that might be a good fit. Some of my son's friends never visited the schools until they were accepted. I can see that you want to start visiting this spring, so your son should be in good shape when selection time approaches. As far as ideas, are you asking for possible schools, or whether he should attend a 2 year school, or how to plan the spring break? Since your son has no idea about major at this point, I would suggest looking at schools that offer the majors that you suggested, so he would not need to transfer later on if a school did not offer his area of interest. I would suggest looking at schools where his stats land in the middle. This way he will hopefully be challenged, but not overwhelmed.</p>

3

<p>It is early, so don't worry too much about this. We dragged my daughter to a few colleges in spring of her junior year, but she wasn't too interested. At this point, I would just recommend taking him to some general examples of types of colleges, not necessarily specific colleges that he might attend and that are near where you live. I'd recommend going to one large university, one medium university, and one small liberal arts college. This is just to get a "feel" for what he size suits his comfort level. He really shouldn't have a major or an interest right now...he's only 16, right? No need to threaten him with junior or community college at this point...give him some breathing room and some time.</p>

4

<p>I think what I'm asking for is how to get the juices flowing. </p>

<p>I can't really see him at a very large school like the U of Illinois. However, I hate to see him go to a small college with an undeclared major, then identify an interest in which there is no option to major. I'm already well passed expecting him to be like his sisters. So, how do we choose a few schools to visit in March? If he needs to apply in the fall, but will be in the backwoods for the entire summer, I'm feeling a sense of urgency to do the homework now. Unfortunately I'm the only one in the house with any sense of urgency. I think that if we do the visits, it will help him to focus on what he may want. So, now that I've actually written down this stream of consciousness, what I'm asking for is how to get him even slightly engaged in the process rather than for a list of schools.</p>

5

<p>First, I agree with the others...it's early (for your son...some kids are interested in discussing college as juniors...others just aren't). Second it does sound like he has some interests...sports and camping...and while neither of those things translate into "high school coursework" both could be incorporated into college studies (sports management, recreation work, etc). And lastly, some kids change a lot between junior and senior years.</p>

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<p>DD is a freshman in college and is still undecided regarding a major. She also checked "undecided" on her SAT forms. She did put her interests, none of which were academic (music and swimming). Your son is not the only one who checks these boxes. </p>

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<p>Guess what? MOST students decide colleges based on the presentations of the adcoms. AND also, remember this...if you go to a college with a klunker tour guide, you son may also ditch that school regardless of other things that may be positive. Both of my kids scratched schools because of lousy (and I mean they were bad) tour guides and/or info sessions. </p>

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<p>DD's final two choices last year were Santa Clara University and U of South Carolina. How different can you get?? She would have done well at either school, but they ARE very different.</p>

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<p>We did our initial college visits in conjunction with a family vacation. We were visiting relatives and went to a large university, a smaller private university and a small private LAC....just to get an idea of how they differed. DS and DD DID end up applying to one school each from that initial trip. But if they hadn't it wouldn't have mattered...we were on a family vacation anyway.</p>

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<p>I can't imagine any family where the college "hunt" is the same for sibling after sibling. It sure wasn't here...kids have totally different interests, ideas, and motivation. </p>

<p>In the end it's all going to be fine...and we'll be interested in hearing about it all when the time comes. Take heart, you're not the only one in this boat.</p>

6

<p>
[quote]
I think what I'm asking for is how to get the juices flowing.

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</p>

<p>I'd suggest that first you accept that this may never happen and second that you probably can't make it happen. I think you're in the same boat as the mothers of 95% of the boys.</p>

<p>That said, it doesn't mean you can't help him out. Do not expect that he will ever be happy touring schools or reading college guides - he probably won't be.</p>

<p>I would pick out some appropriate schools for him, announce that you're going to visit, and hope for the best. Be careful - because he'll probably be "all done" looking at schools after about 5. So choose wisely. I think if you wait for him to get engaged he'll still be home watching sporting events on TV a year and a half from now.</p>

<p>I know you'll get lots of people on here who will tell you, if he can't pick out schools he's too young/immature/unfocused to go to college. I used to believe that too, but after having gone through the process now with two boys I don't really agree with that.</p>

<p>Good luck!</p>

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<p>I know they are a distance from you, but you might consider schools like Bates and Bowdoin. Lots of kids into backwoods, camping, etc. Also UVM.</p>

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<p>Also, Syracuse ESF <a href="http://www.esf.edu/%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.esf.edu/&lt;/a> , Paul Smith's College <a href="http://www.paulsmiths.edu/%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.paulsmiths.edu/&lt;/a>, College of the Atlantic <a href="http://www.coa.edu/html/home.htm%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.coa.edu/html/home.htm&lt;/a&gt;.&lt;/p>

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<p>Hi MoT,</p>

<p>I relate to the issue of you having a sense of urgency, whereas your S hasn't. Having been in a somewhat similar situation as yours, I suggest that you take out some of your 'urgency vibes' on CC; leaving just the critical bits for your S. My Ss have also worked all summer at a camp, so they've had similar time constraints as your S. </p>

<p>Some other points
1. Buy one of the school guide books and leave it in his room. No pressure, no responses required, just some info he may or may not get take advantage of
2. When you read something interesting or pertinent on CC, share it with him.
3. Rather than focus on a major, focus on the general area he is interested in. For my kids' searches, it was observing that they were 'a math/science guy' and seeing where that led. It sounds like your son is 'a social science guy'. While investigating schools, one area to review is the strength of the social science programs
4. Visit a few schools in the spring that show a range - large, small, public, LAC, etc. This will help him to get a sense of what feels right. Don't overload the trip with too many visits, and be sure to schedule fun stuff too.
5. He may do fine at a large school. He may go to a LAC and need to transfer. Some of this is just impossible to predict. </p>

<p>Your son sounds like a great kid. Some kids get hyper-focused on the search, but many (most?) do not. good luck</p>

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<p>esf above is a really good price its actually a suny and has a seperate part for classes and they stay on the syracuse campus</p>

11

<p>Weenie is right on target!</p>

<p>Most boys fit into the same category. My S didn't even want to look at schools until he got accepted, in case he didn't get in. We still looked at 2 schools before he applied, and he only put in 4 applications, and just got accepted and is planning on attending Ohio State (love at first sight, when visited 10/06). He just knew that he wanted to go to a "Rah Rah" school with hardly any kids from our basic geographical area ( Long Island, NY). He isn't even sure of what direction he wants his education to take yet, but when asked about his friends, he usually replies, "I don't know, we don't talk about it. He is a great kid with a 3.6 GPA and 1330/1950 SAT, but he is a 17 year old boy. Read the comic strip "Zits", which is a perfect instruction manual for his species.</p>

<p>My 13 year old daughter is totally different, mature, socially aware, and will go about the whole procedure differently. I am actually looking forward to the road trips where we will actually converse using fully sentences. The main difference of course, is that she is not a teenage boy, (with exceptions) of course. </p>

<p>Momoftwins: Viva La Difference, and enjoy every minute of your new experience with your S, as you are not alone.......</p>

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<p>I take umbrage at what guiltguru said: "No need to threaten him with junior or community college at this point...give him some breathing room and some time." :)</p>

<p>I don't know about your local gc's, but in my town the junior college is definitely a viable choice for kids who haven't yet decided (or kicked into gear). Two years at gc is easy, inexpensive, and doesn't involve leaving friends and family behind. Those jc credits, if well chosen, automatically transfer to the local UC. The quality of teaching is mixed, but again, with careful choices a student can do very well. Junior college profs are not generally involved in research and can devote their energy to teaching. The downside is that many fellow students will also be "undecided" and not highly motivated. Risk/benefit?</p>

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<p>Thanks for the great ideas! I'm definitely aware of my own urgency and trying to keep the discussions to a minimum while looking for times he may be open and receptive. Also, I hope my urgency isn't trickling down. Any discussions of job options are actually due to my job. I do some career coaching and have just casually mentioned what could be good ideas for him. Actually putting these concerns down in writing is helping me as is acting on suggestions. </p>

<p>Since he's been to the U of I several times for family visits, I think we'll pick another Big 10 school. And the 3000-5000 school I just loved when I looked with the girls was Butler in Indianapolis. Then a couple others and we'll keep spring break visits to 2-3 days. I'll look for a book he may actually look at (covertly I'm sure) and I've sent away for info from a couple of the schools mentioned. </p>

<p>Doing something is so much better than fretting. Thanks, again. Maybe it's time to change my screen name to momoftwins+1.</p>

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<p>Actually, the junior college option wasn't a threat. We're fortunate to have an exceptional junior college in our area. The academics are strong and I think it can be a great option for a student who may still need to figure out what he may want.</p>

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<p>I know I sound like a broken record (dating myself). Read Loren Pope's book:
40 Colleges That Change Lives, <a href="http://www.ctcl.com%5B/url%5D"&gt;www.ctcl.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

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<p>That's actually one of the books I was thinking of buying for him. Maybe I can even get him to go to a bookstore with me so we can look at them and he could choose one he might like.</p>

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<p>While eating breakfast this morning with my S who is a high school senior. I shared with him about this thread. He said "What did you say? Nag the s**t out of him?" </p>

<p>We definitely see this process from two different perspectives ;-)</p>

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<p>LOL! And I'm sure that's what I'll hear next year.</p>

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<p>Look into Blackburn College in Carlinville, IL. It's a small LAC, with wonderful social science departments. It has a family feel, good sports programs, just far enough from home to be away and close enough that he won't feel totally far away. Lots of wonderful internship opportunities, and if $ is a concern, has a work-study program that will help with costs.</p>

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<p>Is your son on the young side for his grade? I call the years from 14-16 in a boy's life "The Grunting Stage" and it has a lot in common with the terrible twos.</p>

<p>I think some boys struggle with a narrow focus and are just not open, or ready, to deal with a large, amorphous problem like deciding on a college.</p>

<p>Since he's shown an interest in two Michigan schools, take the spring trip there, and do lots of fun stuff on the way. (Don't miss the Michigan dunes!) During the rest of the year, sneak in visits to some close schools if you can. (Knox, Beloit, Illinois Wesleyan....) No commitments are needed from him; these are just fact-finding trips. What you'll discover are things he doesn't like in addition to what appeals to him. There is a lot of negativity at this stage.</p>

<p>The next stage is the resurrection of the chatty, personable kid you remember from years ago. All of a sudden, he'll take a leap in maturity somewhat like his physical growth spurts. Some friend or teacher will say something about school that will help him focus on it. Grab these opportunities and help him sketch out a plan of attack, including deadlines, but make him the (somewhat) responsible party. You should really compare notes with his friends' parents and see if some of your plans can be combined. Often, the guys' behaviors is 10X better for another adult.</p>