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There seems to be an idea that these problems are only prevalent among college students as opposed to young people of that age in general. Trust me, even the ones who are not in college have these same issues.</p>
<p>Most do not know that alcohol also causes cancer:</p>
<p>[Alcohol</a> ‘a major cause of cancer’](<a href=“http://www.canada.com/health/Alcohol+major+cause+cancer/4582391/story.html]Alcohol”>http://www.canada.com/health/Alcohol+major+cause+cancer/4582391/story.html)</p>
<p>I had mandatory “risk education” for drinking and other issues for Greek orientation at my university, and I swear that the guy who came out was a dead ringer for Matt Foley from Saturday Night Live (the Van-down-by-the-river guy). I don’t think it dissuaded anybody from binge drinking. Also, there was an undercurrent that no one, including the administrators, took it seriously.</p>
<p>collegealum314, I appreciate your candid review and know that character (van-down-by-the-river-guy) on SNL. For those who retire early on Saturday nights, the van-down…guy is a “scared-straight”, yelling, in-your-face skit. He screams drastic outcomes at two teens in their family living room. </p>
<p>collegealum314, if you have a moment and feel like it, could you propose a different type of on-campus presentation here that you think WOULD have impressed you and your Greek friends that night?</p>
<p>Also, I’m curious: what gave you the “undercurrent” that administrators didn’t take it seriously? Body language, smirks…? </p>
<p>I’m honestly interested since you were on the scene. If you wish to reply, that is. Thanks.</p>
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</p>
<p>There is a huge research base showing the nett positive health benefits of moderate alcohol consumption.</p>
<p>A coworker told me about this a while ago (he has a son at Cornell) and he said that it was hushed up at the time.</p>
<p>It was not hushed up, it was extensively reported in the Cornell Daily Sun. There was a memorial service on campus, and many fraternity brothers attended the funeral in this young man’s community (Brooklyn?). </p>
<p>Also, Oldfort, I did not mean that colleges should take responsibility. Of course parents are the first line of defense here. However, there is no consensus on the best practices in this arena. H and I are very adamant about not allowing underage drinking for our sons, or their friends when we are hosting. We think the brain research alone supports this, and we have (along with many others) addiction issues in the family tree. Some of our peers think we are idiots and think it’s better to “teach” kids to drink at home before they go to college. Others host large parties awash in alcohol because “we did it and we turned out fine.” If there were research-based guidelines for everyone–parents, colleges, etc. it would be helpful in navigating this, and it seems that universities might be able to come up with some between their medical faculties and psych experts.</p>
<p>Drinking is like smoking.</p>
<p>As long as these young adults see the adults in their lives drinking with no ill effect and no consequences, they are not going to believe it is dangerous for them to engage in the behavior. Or, if they believe there are “some” risks, they are going to, like all people this age, believe it won’t “happen to them.”</p>
<p>Don’t get me wrong, I’m not advocating for prohibition, just saying there is no way to “teach” young adults not to drink as long as alcohol is legal for adults, and the adults in their life drink. The problem isn’t research, or eduction. Kids see what the adults around them do, and like everything else, they listen to that, not some blah, blah, blah, lecture about how “it’s okay for me but not for you.”</p>
<p>No amount of research is going to change this. No administrators are going to change this, which is why they are in an untenable situation, frankly.</p>
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<p>In this–as in many other respects, including the healthcare system–the UK is different from continental Europe. (I, too, spent a number of years living and going to school in England.) </p>
<p>anothermom, your statement that people were eager to “praise” fake ids and underage drinking on the other thread is a gross distortion. No one was “praising” either thing. Thinking that the current drinking age is foolish does not equate to “praising” underage binge drinking! Thinking that having a fake id is not felony-worthy --and I am NOT one of those who ever had one, ever thought of getting one, or ever knew anyone who did-- does not equate to “praising” fake ids.</p>
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<p>Finally, someone said it.</p>
<p>I know the thread you’re talking about and while you are correct that no one “praised” having a fake id and underage drinking, there was a large cohort of parents minimizing the danger/wrongness of these things. When dealing with young people, I believe this is a distinction without any real difference.</p>
<p>poetgrl, I understand what you are saying and agree that when kids see the adults drinking (even when it’s entirely responsible behavior, ie wine with dinner) they are loathe to believe that any harm can come to them from doing the same thing. They simply don’t want to accept the fact that their brains aren’t fully “done” until the age of 24 or so. However, they really need the adults in their lives to be clear about the consequenses of underage drinking, whether one agrees with the current drinking age or not.</p>
<p>I don’t happen to agree with the speed limit on the main road near my neighborhood but if I exceed it I WILL get a ticket and fully deserve to pay the penalties. It’s never too early to impress upon your kids that no one cares if they agree with the law; they are expected to obey it, or else.</p>
<p>I don’t get the logic of the people who are saying “If parents drink at all – even responsibly – their offspring will drink irresponsibly.”</p>
<p>Substitute “drive” for “drink” in that sentence, and it makes no sense at all.</p>
<p>“It is us, as parents, who should be responsible for our kids.”</p>
<p>Up to a point. Unfortunately my kids, at least, come with (possibly defective, not fully-formed) minds of their own, they are not little wind-up robots. Wish that they were, on occasion. And parents are not the only influence on them. Or even, at a certain developmental stage which they are now in, the predominant influence.</p>
<p>"Your children are not your children.
They are the sons and daughters of Life’s longing for itself.
They come through you but not from you,
And though they are with you yet they belong not to you.</p>
<p>You may give them your love but not your thoughts,
For they have their own thoughts.
You may house their bodies but not their souls,
For their souls dwell in the house of tomorrow,
which you cannot visit, not even in your dreams.
You may strive to be like them,
but seek not to make them like you.
For life goes not backward nor tarries with yesterday.</p>
<p>You are the bows from which your children
as living arrows are sent forth.
The archer sees the mark upon the path of the infinite,
and He bends you with His might
that His arrows may go swift and far.
Let your bending in the archer’s hand be for gladness;
For even as He loves the arrow that flies,
so He loves also the bow that is stable."</p>
<p>I don’t think those kids were brought up to think it was a good idea to “force-overdrink” some frat brother, or whatever the scenario was.</p>
<p>StopAlcoholAbuse.Gov is your gateway to comprehensive research and resources on the prevention of underage drinking. Materials available through this portal are provided by the 15 Federal agencies of the Interagency Coordinating Committee on Underage Drinking Prevention (ICCPUD). </p>
<p>[Stop</a> Underage Drinking: Portal of Federal Resources](<a href=“Portal for Federal Underage Drinking Prevention Resources”>http://www.stopalcoholabuse.gov/)</p>
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If that´s the case, and your kids are so unteachable, then they are no more school´s responsibility.</p>
<p>I see a lot of our own behavior in our kids, good or bad.</p>
<p>“Drinking is like smoking.”</p>
<p>I don’t agree. There isn’t any such thing as healthy smoking. This country doesn’t have 100 million non-addicted, frequent users of cigarettes. Those things are true of alcohol. How does it follow that seeing parents drink beer at a barbecue will make me think it’s OK/safe/smart to do tequila shots until I pass out?</p>
<p>Alcohol is more like dessert than it is like smoking. Having one after dinner or as a treat on the weekend is fine and can be part of a healthy lifestyle. Some people do get addicted, binge, and it ruins their health and life. I don’t think parents need to abstain from ice cream in order to minimize the risk that their children end up as morbidly obese food addicts.</p>
<p>Colleges can take responsibility and many do. The difference in binging rates between what would otherwise be very similar students bodies on similar campuses can be very different, sometimes even extraordinary. We have evidence-based approaches that work - they cost money, they require admitting there is a problem, and they require ongoing commitment. Some schools have it, and some, knowing full well that binge and heavy drinking DO in fact impact academic quality, don’t.</p>
<p>“…when kids see the adults drinking (even when it’s entirely responsible behavior, ie wine with dinner) they are loathe to believe that any harm can come to them from doing the same thing.”</p>
<p>Again, it is not only “their” adults they are seeing, perhaps unfortunately they are quite capable of processing signals from sources outside their immediate home. Which are ubiquitous.
And the belief that nothing can harm them is a psychological phenomenon of adolescence, it is not confined to drinking. It’s an aspect of Piaget’s “The Personal Fable”.</p>
<p>(- signed Monydad, expert courtesy two recent psychology courses, too bad I didn’t take them 25 years ago).</p>
<p>“…then they are no more school´s responsibility.”
Everyone can look at their own contribution, but at some point you have to look at the kids who did it. They did not get this bright idea from the school, or from their parents either.</p>
<p>Schools could do more to provide recreational opportunities for the kids there which do not involve alcohol, I think.</p>
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<p>Okay. I’ll play. I actually agree. I think this is an excellent comparison.</p>
<p>Now, let’s make colleges get our children to give up dessert because it may “harm” them somewhere down the road. In fact, kids who grow up with obese parents are much more likely to become obese. Kids who grow up with alcoholic parents are 50% more likely to become alcoholics. And, kids who grow up in homes where people eat the occaisonal dessert will eat the occaisonal dessert. But, here’s the kicker, even kids who grow up in homes where the parents completely abstain from sugar will eat sugar. </p>
<p>I think the whole idea that a culture which says alcohol is a legal drug for adults, which allows beer commercials on TV, which glamorizes drinking on TV and in the movies, is now going to point to a college administrator and say, “HEY! HOW COME MY KID IS DRINKING???” is ridiculous. And this from the same exact parents who drink alcohol. I’m sorry. It won’t work. And that is how it is like smoking. Parents who smoke produce children who smoke. It’s not a college thing. If you want to know why kids drink? It’s not whether you serve underage people in your house, it’s whether or not YOU drink in your house.</p>
<p>To be clear: I think the drinking age for beer and wine should be 19. 21 for hard liquor. I don’t drink, but I don’t see any benefit to the hypocricy of acting as if parents who drink alcohol are going to be able to produce 19 year olds who do not. It’s delusional.</p>
<p>I don’t think the parents determine whether or not a kid drinks in college. My parents to my knowledge never did many things that we commonly did in college.</p>