AP Economics versus econ major in high school? And some more ?'s........

College Majors
1

What are the similarities in taking classes as an Econ major and micro/macro if you took that class in high school?

I am currently a senior taking AP micro/macro, and am finding micro (that’s what we’re studying first) pretty difficult. I was planning on becoming an economics major if I decided to go to a school that doesn’t have business/statistics/data science available (like the majority of LACs), because I want to go into the business sector. But now I am not so sure anymore, since I am sort of struggling (In my own standards. In my class I am maybe a little above average and got a B+ last quarter).

Will I struggle as an economics major? (Hamilton is one of my top choices; has no business majors, and I don’t like any other major they offer, but its a really good LAC for people wanting to get an MBA)

A girl that just came out of college said she got a C- in AP Calc in HS, but an A in college calc , so would that be the case for economics as well?

It’s not that I don’t like what we are learning (at times I might find it rather dull) or anything, but always I feel like I put a ton of effort into this class and get almost nothing out of it,. is it because I am on the math-ier side of econ right now (micro)? Is macro going to be better? I have never really been a math person. sorry if this sort of turned into a rant haha

I’ve also heard that a degree in business can be risky sometimes because there are so many people going into business. If I narrow my major down to finance or international finance, OR take a more general business class and minor in chinese, would that look better than the average business student?

OR should I disregard the fact that there is a surplus of people with business degrees looking for jobs, b/c I actually really think I would enjoy business classes (much more than econ class) because I am social, practical, and want to be a leader?

2

I’m not sure how predictive the performance in AP econ is of future grades in econ. Once you get beyond principles, the subsequent courses might be more enjoyable. I wouldn’t expect that an AP course would be as good as an econ course taught by a professor with a PhD, and I know that some econ profs don’t think that the students with AP experience come in with the best understanding of principles.

3

There are quite a few issues that you’ve raised in your post. The first is whether or not your experience in AP econ is a good predictor of how you will do in an econ class at college. My son got fives on both his AP exams and found the high school class relatively easy and engaging. He was advised at college to take the intro level classes again (even though he could have placed out with his scores) as he is hoping to be an econ major and they said that he would be well served to have the matrial his school covered under his belt before taking on the next level… He seems to be doing well but felt that it was initially very different from what he had done in HS and significantly more difficult. That could be a result of how it is taught in college, how it was taught in high school, and whether the intro level classes are meant to weed out students. Truly, this is a YMMV situation.

The other issue here is whether or not doing well in econ means that you will be able to do well in business. While there are a lot of people who major in economics at schools that do not have business programs and use that as their entrée into business, there are also plenty of people who do very well in business and go on to pursue MBAs (even at top schools) who find the logic of economics to be very challenging. So even if you decide that economics is not your academic strength, it does not mean you could not pursue a career in business.

4

Business is a broad field, and you can go into the “business sector” with a major in anything. Of course, economics is a great major if that’s what you’re interested in, but there are people who work in business with all kinds of majors.

Also, being a little above average and getting a B+ is not struggling. So if you’re asking if you might get a B+ and perform above-average in college, I would say maybe, but that’s a good thing!

Also - I’m saying this because you say you don’t like anything else Hamilton offers - please note that economics is a social science. It’s concerned with how people distribute, produce, and consume goods and services. There’s definitely math and stats, but there’s also classes like “235S Policy, Poverty and Practice” or “348F Economics of Social Responsibility” or “Economics of Poverty and Income Distribution”

If you are interested in statistics, the math major at Hamilton can pretty easily be turned into a statistics major. The required courses are calculus II, multivariable calculus (calculus III), linear algebra, real analysis, and modern algebra, plus a senior seminar and three electives. All of those core classes are classes that a statistics major would have to or want to take anyway - perhaps with the exception of modern algebra, but modern algebra is good for a statistics major to have. And after that, there are plenty of statistical elective at Hamilton - Statistical Analysis of Data, Statistical Modeling and Applications, Probability Theory and Applications, Mathematical Statistics and Applications, plus three classes in differential equations. There’s also a Senior Seminar in Statistics, a Senior Seminar in Applied Statistics and a Senior Seminar in Mathematical Modeling.

So basically, you can make your math major at Hamilton look very much like a formal statistics major at any other school. And you can fill out your coursework by taking quantitative economics classes - econometrics, financial economics, etc.

I would similarly check out the course catalog at any LAC you are considering and see how flexible the math major is and whether you can turn it, basically, into a statistics major or something very close to that. The name on the degree isn’t as important as what you learn in it.

(But then you say that you are not a math person, which makes me question your desire for a major in economics or statistics. Both are heavily quantitative fields, especially when applying them in business. You have to like math.)

Minoring in or learning to speak Chinese would be a good thing regardless of what you major in. Language skills, especially critical language skills, are always appreciated.

Don’t worry about the other people going into business; worry about making yourself stand out in a good way as an applicant. Learning in-demand skills - like statistical analysis or Chinese - is one way. Doing internships and working part-time jobs in school is another way. You have to make yourself an attractive candidate for jobs.

Yes, you should choose a major on the basis of interest.

5

You have gotten one of the best departmental analyses of I have seen on CC, @camwow, courtesy of @juillet .

In terms of the little that could be added, I’d note that for a LAC education to prove truly worthwhile, you should have some potential interest in topics in fields such as classics (loosely interpreted), philosophy, religious studies, government, literature, history, anthropology, sociology and geosciences – or perhaps in a complementary array of academic topics that match your particular interests.

6

yes I agree! @julliet thanks so much for the feedback!

7

I also meant that I would enjoy some things like history/political science/government more than math, but i still kind of like math (its just that im not great at it lol) and I do like physics (probably wouldn’t major in it though)!

8

If you can master math through calc II (plus statistics), basically all courses across the sciences and social sciences would be open to you, including calculus-based physics. Beyond a few quantitative courses of this nature – perhaps required, depending on your major – you would be free to explore widely at an LAC, particularly at one with a flexible curriculum. Should even this amount of math seem daunting to you, then think for now in terms of preparing for calc I on the college level, in that this would be a sufficient basis for an economics major.

9

thanks.

honestly, its not the math part of econ that gets to me. I spend hours trying to take notes on the textbook, make flashcards and memorize the content, and even then with everything in the textbook that I memorized, the econ tests and quizzes usually have multiple choice questions that make no sense to me. honestly, the math parts of econ are easier to me, esp if they have been studied

10

Do you prepare to the point at which you feel you understand the material (beyond memorization)? Since this may be too broad, can read your text in a linear fashion, with an understanding of each sentence before moving on to the next?

11

fwiw, econ is one of those subjects where all the pieces can be hard to put together at first. If you keep at it / have a decent curriculum you should find that at some point there comes an ‘aha’ moment, and several pieces that seemed completely unrelated and meaningless suddenly click into place and it starts to make sense. It gets a lot easier then…

12

Have to admit, had the same experience with econ. There was a logic to it that didn’t seem logical! And the worst of it was that I thought I understood it. Until I got my exams back. I was able to grind through it (as both an undergraduate and graduate student - required classes) but it was really a struggle.

The best advice I can give is to approach the material every way possible - as a math problem, graphically, in words - and one of them might stick.

13

@merc81 honestly, it depends. the test/quiz difficulty is so unpredictable.

for one of the tests we had, i did an all-nighter and copied everything from the textbook onto my notebook, made flashcards, and took several practice tests on that unit online and thought I was so prepared that I WAS the textbook. however, on the day of the test, I ended up getting an 88 with the curve (higher than the average of the class, but still I was really hoping for a high A), while my best friend, who literally almost didn’t even study (she started to study like 5 minutes before the test started) ended up getting a 94 with the curve (probably the highest in the class), and I was just so irritated after that, and extremely angry at myself.

however, when I used my same studying habits to study for our DWL (dead weightloss quiz), I found the quiz to be easier (so did everybody) and got 96% (the easy quizzes we get are definitely not common)

14

This made me smile, @camwow. You can learn a lot by preparing fully for exams, as you clearly have been doing. In the longer term, this type of preparation can be highly rewarding. If I were to make a suggestion, it would be to make sure you prepare similarly fully for your regular assignments and maintain an ongoing curiosity for the underlying material. (Which you may be doing partly or fully already – but give the method time.)

15

We all have subjects we don’t fully get until later. Mine was philosophy, lol.

Econ asks you to think about and process the principles, perspectives and the applications. It’s why memorizing or knowing the text isn’t always enough. And college is where you get to explore more- in the US, it’s one reason why students aren’t expected to declare a major until the end of sophomore year. So far, you’ve only experienced what your hs has offered you and how that one teacher teaches it.

Frankly, you’re trying to choose a future career arena now, before gathering more experiences. You might get to what I call the college “buffet of academic choices,” test the waters, and shift your interests. And yes, you can still land in a business career.

16

You’ve picked many of the least effective study strategies. Regular study and practice is superior to cramming. Copying is great if you aspire to be a medieval monk, but a waste of time compared to the alternatives with respect to learning. Memorizing content is similarly misguided.

If you are taking tests with multiple-choice questions that make no sense, it is one of two things. You are being tested on material that was not taught, or you have failed to comprehend what was covered. Here’s what you do. Collect a few examples of these questions that you did not understand and make an appt with your teacher. Be up-front, saying you didn’t understand the questions, could the teacher show you where in the book they were covered? Maybe the teacher apologizes and says the questions should not have been on the test, but I’m betting she/he can show you where they were.

A lot of kids do quite well in HS based on verbal fluency and recall. By memorizing enough of the text they can spin beautiful paragraphs about “the 3 causes of the War of 1812”, and also do well on tests asking “which of the following was not a cause…” and other multiple-choice questions. What they have not learned is to absorb and apply the material. As you step up to college the expectation will be that you understand and can apply the material, and it sin’t difficult to come up with questions to check this as your Econ class shows.

Over the Xmas break I suggest reading the book “Make it Stick” about what is known about learning, with plenty of advice for HS and college students about effective techniques like distributed practice and self-testing. For the Econ class you should also buy the REA “Economics Problem Solver” which has thousands of questions with answers to quiz yourself.

17

haha…medieval monk