Ariel Sharon significant stroke.........

College Confidential Community
61

<p>KillerAngler, the way i just read you post, #62, maybe I am reading with the wrong emphasis on words (I do not believe I am especially goiven trhe context of this thread) but it seemed kind of bigoted to me. A better way to have written it would have been: Could someone tell me what the hebrew word "eine" means?</p>

<p>But I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, in what context is the word being used? There is a word in hebrew ain, could be spelled eine, it ryhmes with "cane," it usually means, "without."</p>

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<p>Is this your idea of self defense?
<a href="http://www.themodernreligion.com/jihad/sniper.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.themodernreligion.com/jihad/sniper.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

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<p>Ah yes, how convincing, tripe that happened eons ago and people who were born long before the revolution of 1979.</p>

<p>I suggest you have a look at this:
<a href="http://seconddraft.org/streaming/pallywood.wmv%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://seconddraft.org/streaming/pallywood.wmv&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>Could cure an 18 year old wannabe or two.</p>

64

<p>Has killerangel been banned? He seems quiet all of a sudden?!?</p>

65

<p>Maybe because he knows he's wrong?? Anways, my support is towards Israel 100%, the land originally belonged to the Jews, its rightfully theirs, they must defend it against Muslim and Arab terrorists/fanatics/extremists. The Jews have no where else to go, but the Palestinains can seek refuge in neighboring Arab countries but these countires won't accept them to use them as pawns against Israel.</p>

66

<p>
[quote]
Has killerangel been banned? He seems quiet all of a sudden?!?

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</p>

<p>Why would that be the case? Because he seemed to be one of the few people that's reasonable? I didn't think you could get banned for that.</p>

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[quote]
Maybe because he knows he's wrong??

[/quote]
</p>

<p>But that wouldn't be right because YOU ARE WRONG.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Anways, my support is towards Israel 100%, the land originally belonged to the Jews,

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</p>

<p>Freaking hell... did you read ANYTHING on the last page? What kind of dumbass argument is that "the land originally belonged to the jews" I thought we were over this.</p>

<p>
[quote]
its rightfully theirs,

[/quote]
</p>

<p>It's rightfully their because they lived there 2 thousand years ago? Jesus! READ THE LAST PAGE...</p>

<p>
[quote]
they must defend it against Muslim and Arab terrorists/fanatics/extremists.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>HAHAHA. So you support the ethnic discrimination against the arab/muslim population in the Palestine region? Now I SEE what your problem is... your a racist --- who would've supported the apartheid system in South Africa and supported the native black populations getting kicked out of the homes and cooncentrated in small shanty-towns because the WHITE people somehow had superamacy over those savages. They own everything right? Was 1994 an upsetting year for you? Huh huh?</p>

<p>
[quote]
The Jews have no where else to go, but the Palestinains can seek refuge in neighboring Arab countries but these countires won't accept them to use them as pawns against Israel.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>OK. Let's make this better "The Palestanians have no where else to go, but the Palestinains can seek refuge in New York/Russia/Europe" ALL the places they CAME FROM?</p>

<p>*** is that? So if someone comes and tries to push you out of house you just give them your house and leave for the neighbours' house? *** is wrong with you? Is your mind this clouded with racism and blind prejudice that you can't see when human rights are being violated?</p>

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<p>For those who didn't see this page (that Sydney posted):</p>

<p><a href="http://www.themodernreligion.com/jihad/sniper.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.themodernreligion.com/jihad/sniper.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>
[quote]
12 yr old boy SHOT DEAD in front of your eyes
Updated 9.48 p.m., 3rd Oct 2000</p>

<p>Recorded live, the incident below: In one of the most horrifying scenes shown on world television, 12-year old Muhammad Al-Dura was shot dead in cold blood by an Israeli sniper, while his father, Jamal, was trying to protect him from the hail of Israeli bullets. Shortly thereafter, when Palestinian Red Crescent Society ambulance driver Bassam Al-Balbisi, 45, approached the father and son in order to move them into an ambulance, he was shot and killed by the Israeli soldiers as well. Jamal, the father of five remaining children, is in critical condition, having sustained five bullets, to the upper thigh, pelvis, stomach, and lower leg.

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<p>Yes I've seen the bombs that have exploded in middle of Israeli streets. But the problem is that the above happens MUCH MUCH more frequently that the bombings (see statistics for yourself) and I mean it was just ONE KID not a group of people, and a SNIPER who could clearly see what they were shooting at. IT was one sniper, and one target, a Palestanian kid, and this supported by the world's most powerful states.</p>

<p>How much do people have to suffer until they triumph? How much? How much? How many people have to die? How many tears have to be shed until this ignorance, indifference, and opression stops?</p>

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<p>Bristow87, You really ought to read the links from articles you post. The website you posted, The Modern Religion, also had a link to a BBC story. This BBC story had a quote from Israeli Cabinet Secratary Yitzchak Herzog, "He added that Palestinian police should have called their Israeli counterparts who he said had been trying to speak to Palestinian commanders for hours." Why did the Palestinian Police make no attempt to rescue the boy and his father? BECAUSE A DEAD KID IS WORTH MORE TO THEIR CAUSE THAN A LIVE ONE, THE DEATH IS MORE EASILY EXPLOITED. If the bullets that killed him were from an Israeli gun, which I have still seen no evidence of, I highly doubt it was intentful. There were so many bullets flying that anyone of them could have bounced off a wall and hit the boy and his father. Civilian casualties occur, it's a fact. But the IDF tries their best to avoid them, whereas the Palestinian militants go DIRECTLY for the civilians. For them it is no accident when a child dies, instead it is a job well done. The reason civilians are sometimes injured or killed in IDF operations, as I have said before, is because the terrorists cowardly hide behind the innocent men, women, and children. You have no one to blame for the deaths of civilians than the terrorists.</p>

<p>Paraiso, SAY SOMETHING CONSTRUCTIVE OR SHUT UP! You will get absolutley NO WHERE with comments to rahulnirmal2000 like, "Was 1994 an upsetting year for you? Huh huh?" "*** is wrong with you?" and "Now I SEE what your problem is... your a racist --- " I can play that game with you just as easily if you want it to go that way. I can call you a terrorist-sympathizer for supporting the people who purposely target and kill civilians. I can call you a racist and bigot for always turning a blind eye to the atrocities commited by the Israelis. So what's your response, Huh Huh? Shall I continue playing your game?</p>

<p>You also said a sniper could clearly see Muhammad Al-Dura and his father. They could see them, if they had the same angle as the camerman taking the pictures. First off, you don't know if it was even an IDF soldier who fired the shots. </p>

<p>You also said, "How many tears have to be shed until this ignorance, indifference, and opression stops?" Oh, so now that they're oppressed, they can act however they want. I see. Please tell me you don't believe such drivel. If people act like that when they are oppressed why don't you see us Jews acting in such a manner. Every country in Europe and the Mid East has killed us and evicted us at one time or another, showing us no mercy at all, but we did not murder innocent civilians. Did we attack, yes, but only soldiers and the government, people who were able to defend themselves.
-1492 Spain killed and evicted hundreds of thousands of Jews during the Inquisition.
-Tens of thousands of Jews were killed during the Crusades.
-We were killed during the black plaugue for "poisoning the wells,"
-The Romans killed and evicted hundreds of thousands of us,
-1107, The Moroccans expelled all Jews who wouldn't convert,
-In 1239, the Pope order Christian kings to destroy Jewish books,
-In 1290 we were expelled from England,
-In the 1300's we were frquently expelled from France, and the forced to pay in order to return,
-1493 over 100,000 Jews were expelled from Sicily
-The hundreds of pogroms across Europe which killed thousands of us.
-1891 14,000 Jews expelled from Moscow
-1938-1945 The Holocaust. 6,000,000 of us were butchered. Murdered in the gas chambers, the fields, the camps. Men, Women, Children were all starved, beaten, torture, murder. Camps set up for no purpose other than murder.</p>

<p>WE WERE OPPRESSED. You did not see us strapping bombs to our chest and murdering civilians, you do not see us killing innocents. DON"T YOU DARE GIVE ME THAT BULL**** ABOUT BEING OPPRESSED AND ACTING LIKE ANIMALS! No one was more oppressed than the Jews, and you do not see us committing such horrible unspeakable acts.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
Paraiso, SAY SOMETHING CONSTRUCTIVE OR SHUT UP!

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Better idea, why don’t you look at the last page, where I’ve already said all the constructive things I could and shut up. I hate pointless arguments when people keep saying the same thing over and over when their arguments have already been refuted.</p>

<p>
[quote]
You will get absolutley NO WHERE with comments to rahulnirmal2000 like, "Was 1994 an upsetting year for you? Huh huh?" "*** is wrong with you?" and "Now I SEE what your problem is... your a racist --- " I can play that game with you just as easily if you want it to go that way. I can call you a terrorist-sympathizer for supporting the people who purposely target and kill civilians.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Do so if you feel that way. </p>

<p>
[quote]
I can call you a racist and bigot for always turning a blind eye to the atrocities commited by the Israelis. So what's your response, Huh Huh? Shall I continue playing your game?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Didn’t turn a blind eye to that… If you meant to say Palestinian atrocities, as I’ve ALREADY established (look back 1 page) they exist but are truly unimposing in terms what Israel has done and continues to do to the Palestinian populations.</p>

<p>
[quote]
You also said a sniper could clearly see Muhammad Al-Dura and his father. They could see them, if they had the same angle as the camerman taking the pictures. First off, you don't know if it was even an IDF soldier who fired the shots.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Oh thanks for the new line-- You don’t know if it was even a PLO agent that set off those bombs.</p>

<p>
[quote]
You also said, "How many tears have to be shed until this ignorance, indifference, and opression stops?" Oh, so now that they're oppressed, they can act however they want. I see. Please tell me you don't believe such drivel. If people act like that when they are oppressed why don't you see us Jews acting in such a manner.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Wait, you just refuted yourself. Have you not seen the manner in which Israel has been slaughtering Palestinians for the past 50 years (please refer to the last page because I don’t like to repeat myself)</p>

<p>
[quote]
Every country in Europe and the Mid East has killed us and evicted us at one time or another, showing us no mercy at all, but we did not murder innocent civilians. Did we attack, yes, but only soldiers and the government, people who were able to defend themselves.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>So does being oppressed give you the right to oppress other people?</p>

<p>
[quote]
-1492 Spain killed and evicted hundreds of thousands of Jews during the Inquisition.
-Tens of thousands of Jews were killed during the Crusades.
-We were killed during the black plaugue for "poisoning the wells,"
-The Romans killed and evicted hundreds of thousands of us,
-1107, The Moroccans expelled all Jews who wouldn't convert,
-In 1239, the Pope order Christian kings to destroy Jewish books,
-In 1290 we were expelled from England,
-In the 1300's we were frquently expelled from France, and the forced to pay in order to return,
-1493 over 100,000 Jews were expelled from Sicily
-The hundreds of pogroms across Europe which killed thousands of us.
-1891 14,000 Jews expelled from Moscow
-1938-1945 The Holocaust. 6,000,000 of us were butchered. Murdered in the gas chambers, the fields, the camps. Men, Women, Children were all starved, beaten, torture, murder. Camps set up for no purpose other than murder.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>You know as well I do I assume that Muslim were also severely persecuted during the Spanish inquisition, the Crusades, …., to Chechnya right now, the US and so on…</p>

<p>
[quote]
WE WERE OPPRESSED. You did not see us strapping bombs to our chest and murdering civilians, you do not see us killing innocents. DON"T YOU DARE GIVE ME THAT BULL**** ABOUT BEING OPPRESSED AND ACTING LIKE ANIMALS! No one was more oppressed than the Jews, and you do not see us committing such horrible unspeakable acts.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Yet. You do. Except with guns, and military planes, and bombs, and bulldozers.</p>

<p>Thousands of Palestinian children didn’t just kill themselves, thousands of homes weren’t just destroyed by themselves, thousand of people weren’t forced to go and live in horrible conditions in small strips of land severely controlled by the Israeli estate, thousands of Palestinians weren’t forced to go to exile and live the home-land in which THEY, their parents and ancestors had been born. </p>

<p>While the world is becoming more integrated and religions are beginning to have tolerance for one another, CERTAIN Jews are locking themselves out in a ‘puritan jew nation’, with lands which they took with FORCE and continue to do so from people who had lived there for the past 1500 years. If this isn’t injustice please tell me what is?</p>

<p>Does what Europe did to the Jews make is justified for the Jews to do the same thing to another peoples? Huh? Huh?</p>

<p>I am trying to reach out because, honestly, I DO NOT SEE the point the supporters of the Israeli government are trying to make except that whatever it is it is filled with resentment and hatred for ‘other people’.</p>

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<p>Seriously Paraiiso, you need to chill the %($ out, rellaaaaaaaaaaax. Don't start crapping in your pants and calling me a racist and spouting all of this nonsense. Think before you start calling people things they aren't. Oh no, I'm a racist bigot and a monster for supporting the Israelis and ignoring the poor Palestinian martyrs. Oh no, supporting the Israelis makes me a supporter of apartheid as well. What the hell have you been smoking in the past couple of hours hmmm? 1994 was a great year for me actually you freaking crackhead. </p>

<p>ESD was 100% right, making personal attacks against others just for disagreeing with you only shows how ignorant, idiotic, retarded, immature, childish, stuckup and a bigot you are.</p>

<p>Lay off the crack, PCP and shrooms, seriously, its really bad for you.</p>

<p>Jeez, this whole thread was supposed to be about Sharon's stroke and its turning into a real massive flame war. Whatever, I'm gonna say that I'm right, and thats that, I support Israel and the Jews all the way. I just can't believe how much the poor Jews have suffered throughout history by all sorts of groups, why is that? Why have the Jews been treated so awfully all this time? They deserve the land of Israel, they deserve their own homeland and I feel that nothing and nobody should take it away from them.</p>

<p>I think maybe we should have this thread closed huh?</p>

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<p>^^^Agreed. </p>

<p>It is obvious no one here will change their minds. I respect the views and opinions of all those who spoke, and I only hope they respect mine.</p>

<p>I think we all can agree there has been blood unjustly spilled by both sides. I pray we will someday soon see the emergence of permanent peace.</p>

72

<p>Politics and religion always lead to very intense arguments and flame wars especially on internet forums, ALWAYS.....</p>

<p>ESD, you said you were Jewish right? Just wondering.</p>

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<p>Yes, I'm Jewish.</p>

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<p>Seriously Paradiso, you need to calm the heck down, rellaaaaaaaaaaax. Jeez, this whole thread was supposed to be about Sharon's stroke and its turning into a real massive flame war. Whatever, I'm gonna say that I'm right, and thats that, I support Israel and the Jews all the way.</p>

<p>eh?</p>

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<p>Rahulnirmal2000 and ESD, I fully respect and agree with your arguments. I commend you for being able to argue your point effectively with real facts and unbiased websites. I also am really impressed that you were able to keep your anger under control when responding to arguments you did not agree with and did not resort to ad hominem arguments like other posters (paraiso, killerangel, etc.). </p>

<p>Anyways, this thread probably should be closed because of the posters that have gotten out of control (mainly paraiso).</p>

<p>The main point of this thread was to wish Sharon well wishes for his recovery and it now looks like he will recover, which is a good thing in my book :)</p>

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<p>He will survive for sure from this stoke, but his mental capacity will be quite damaged. I don't think he'll be fit anymore to be prime minister, his political days look like their up. I feel that he'll now be a vegetable and bed ridden for the rest of his days unfortunately.</p>

<p>Though I do commend him for being so strong as to survive two serious stokes in less than a month, he is a very tough person both inside and out.</p>

<p>He is to be woken up tomorrow, time will tell how the stoke affected him. I must say that he really should have and still should, if he can, work on reducing his weight, its quite unhealthy for him. You would think he's stay lean and fit his whole life considering he was a soldier for many years.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
Rahulnirmal2000 and ESD, I fully respect and agree with your arguments. I commend you for being able to argue your point effectively with real facts and unbiased websites. I also am really impressed that you were able to keep your anger under control when responding to arguments you did not agree with and did not resort to ad hominem arguments like other posters (paraiso, killerangel, etc.).</p>

<p>Anyways, this thread probably should be closed because of the posters that have gotten out of control (mainly paraiso).

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</p>

<p>Out of control? Did I offend the autocracy? Or are you just upset that my arguments were effective?</p>

<p>It is certainly a disappointment to see that anyone who has a dissenting voice on this board has to be silenced somehow, although not at all surprising. </p>

<p>I did not make generalizations as you seem to suggest and my arguments were not ad hominem, I simply stated that the way so-and-so was putting their arguments forth was similar to the way the various groups which are identified as racist have presented their arguments. Had I simply said that, perhaps it would’ve been a personal attack, but NO, I had previously given long arguments with strong FACTS to support my argument. I had GIVEN MY REASONS as to why SUPPORTING the state of Israel could be/is considered as supporting a racist regime to non-partisan observers. The posters above REFUSED to address those arguments, but instead continued to repeat the same thing over and over that had been addressed a few pages back (therefore I made the references – “look at the last page”).</p>

<p>I have my own biases, and I do not deny that (as some people seem to here), but I did not allow that to get in the way of effective arguments. I asked for a clear response to some of the problems that people brought up like the “proposal for a non-violent response”, yet I cannot help but be disturbed when others come and try to refute my arguments by resorting to things like “Could cure an 18 year old wannabe or two.” and try to accuse me of poor arguments— which is-- rather insulting. </p>

<p>Finally, as for why an Israeli-Palestinian discussion is going on in this post: Sharon has been one of the key-figures in the issue for the past decade and you can’t possibly expect that people don’t bring his JOB and what he is best known for up when there is a discussion about him. Also, others started it by trying to refute the argument of someone who simply said they were happy.</p>

<p>Close it if you want and continue to ignore and reduce whoever tries to shed light on the side of the coin. <em>shakes head</em></p>

<p>
[quote]
The main point of this thread was to wish Sharon well wishes for his recovery and it now looks like he will recover, which is a good thing in my book

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Based on the OP I thought the main point of this thread was to discuss "Ariel Sharon significant stroke........." and its implication.</p>

<p>Otherwise it should've been the "Whoever wants to wish sharon well post here, and the rest of you shut-up" thread. :)</p>

78

<p>Maybe you should go to another forum hmmm?? Go voice your opinions there, you're a really vocal guy with lots of enthusiaum and energy, are you in a debate club by any chance? If not, you really should be.</p>

<p>Even if you are correct and we're just a bunch of nazis that swiftly silence any dissenting opinions and arguments, there was no reason to brutally personally attack other posters here like me. How could you call me a supporter of apartheid in S. Africa and a cold hearted racist just because of my support of Israel?? Where the $(#@ did that come from??? It was completely uncalled for.</p>

79

<p>Paraiso, you made no personal attacks? Care to clarify what this post to rahulnirmal2000 meant, "Now I SEE what your problem is... your a racist" and "*** is wrong with you?" and "Was 1994 an upsetting year for you? Huh huh?" Seem like personal attacks to me...</p>

<p>As far as you saying that I had never addressed you accusation tha supporting Israel is like supporting a racist regime, all I have to say is WOW! Did you even read the thread or were you just posting whatever popped into your head?</p>

<p>Silly me, I thought when me an rahulnirmal2000 agreed to stop arguing, and I posted "It is obvious no one here will change their minds. I respect the views and opinions of all those who spoke, and I only hope they respect mine", we were peacefully ending this because it had gone far past the point of a constructive discussion. Sadly, it seems that you're not even capable of recognizing such things.</p>

80

<p>
[quote]
Maybe you should go to another forum hmmm?? Go voice your opinions there, you're a really vocal guy with lots of enthusiaum and energy, are you in a debate club by any chance? If not, you really should be.</p>

<p>Even if you are correct and we're just a bunch of nazis that swiftly silence any dissenting opinions and arguments, there was no reason to brutally personally attack other posters here like me. How could you call me a supporter of apartheid in S. Africa and a cold hearted racist just because of my support of Israel?? Where the $(#@ did that come from??? It was completely uncalled for.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Both assertions about myself wrong, but thank you nonetheless. :)</p>

<p>As I stated in my previous post I did not "brutally personally attack" other posters such as yourself. I don't know if you notice but I don't even make a point to give the name of -who gave a certain quote-, so that no one mistakingly thinks I am pointing THEM out. I am just refuting arguments made on the posts here.</p>

<p>
[quote]
How could you call me a supporter of apartheid in S. Africa and a cold hearted racist just because of my support of Israel.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>First I didn't say Nazi/cold-hearted or use any emotional undertones to make I appeal. The only emotional plea I ever made is italicized. As I said on my previous post I drew comparisons between both regimes supported by factual analysis.</p>

<p>I said based on your support of the segragative nature system, you probably support a similar aspect of the other system.</p>