<p>Hello! As May 1st rapidly approaches, I find myself searching for advice anywhere and everywhere (hence, my first college confidential post!) Anyways, here’s my situation:</p>
<p>I was accepted regular decision to the College of William and Mary and St. Andrews Joint Degree Programme for International Relations. While it’s a mouthful, it basically means I study two years at both institutions. Normally, there are only 5 students per four subjects. So, it’s just an honor being accepted. In terms of pro’s for the program, I appreciate the opportunity to partake in both the liberal arts aspects of W&M and the more in-depth study of St.Andrews. The prospect of studying abroad for two years is scary only in the best way. On another note, I didn’t qualify for much financial aid from W&M (in the sense I would still need to pay a lot…)</p>
<p>Now, for the polar extreme: Barnard College. It’s NYC and the idea makes me smile (a lot). When I visited last weekend, the classes were small and personal, the faculty spectacular, and the opportunities presented (internships, research, etc.) endless. Also, the anticipated “intense” relationship with Columbia student was all hype. On campus, I couldn’t tell one student from the other. Besides, I can genuinely say I loved Barnard as Barnard, not just its affiliation with Columbia. Also, while finances are tight Barnard was generous with financial aid.</p>
<p>It would cost around the same to attend both schools, which makes the decision even more challenging.</p>
<p>I would deeply appreciate any thoughts or opinions. Thanks!</p>
<p>It sounds like both are wonderful options —but I have a sense from what you’ve written that in your heart you want to go to Barnard. </p>
<p>I’d just raise a couple of questions: 1) Are you absolutely, completely, totally sure that you want to study International Relations? You have been admitted to a wonderful program – but what if you change your mind and want to pursue something else? I’m guessing that you could easily transfer to another major at W&M during your first 2 years, but then would you be happy with your college choice? I think Barnard provides wonderful opportunities for students interested in IR, including the opportunity to take courses at SIPA and a possibility of applying to the joint degree program with SIPA down the line – and of course freedom to explore other areas.</p>
<p>2) Would the program to study at St. Andrews preclude other possible study abroad opportunities? St. Andrews is wonderful, but you might consider whether it would be better for you to use a study abroad experience to gain proficiency in a foreign language and a deeper understanding of the culture in the country where that language is spoken. </p>
<p>Two wonderful options so you can’t make a bad choice. From what I read in your post the W&M program, while wonderful, sounds “scary” while the idea of Barnard makes you “smile”. And they are about the same price. Sounds like you made your decision. Good luck.</p>
<p>I agree, that if you think you like Barnard better, I have no worries that Barnard will give you the education you are looking for. I’m not convinced that St. Andrews is necessarily where you want to spend your time abroad, or that you would want to spend a full two years abroad. My son spent a full year abroad in Jordan, because he needed the language fluency, but he ended up missing some things in his home college that he would have liked to have been a part of.</p>
<p>Wow! Thank you for all the thoughtful responses. @calmom I’m glad you mentioned the SIPA aspect of Barnard. I further researched SIPA and it seems amazing. Along the same research, I found that Barnard has a study abroad option (while highly competitive) with Oxford. Both prospects have definitely given me something to think about!</p>
<p>Just be aware of this: taking classes at SIPA is easy. My daughter had a friend who enrolled in a SIPA course her freshman year. (SIPA courses are graduate level – one of the pleasant surprises at Barnard was the lack of any barrier to enrolling in upper level courses, whether at Barnard, Columbia, or SIPA. There may be specific prerequisites you need, or in some cases you might need permission of the instructor – but basically, the resources are there and pretty much available to any serious student who wants the opportunity)</p>
<p>However, getting into the 5-year SIPA/Barnard joint degree program is very difficult. They only accept 1-2 students a year. My daughter applied and her adviser felt that she had a particularly strong application, in part because of an internships she had done overseas with a UN agency the previous summer – as well as a very strong GPA - but she was turned down. SIPA prefers to take students who have some real-world work experience, so in general they aren’t to keen on applicants who are still in college. </p>
<p>In fact, my daughter was accepted to SIPA a few years down the line, but she turned down the spot. But that’s fairly consistent with what she had been told about SIPA admissions – she was just a lot more of an attractive candidate with 2 years of post-grad experience working with the UN. </p>
<p>So my point is simply that you shouldn’t choose Barnard based on the dual degree program, as it is more likely than not that you won’t be able to get in. (It might not be affordable in any case – you could not count on need-based aid for the 5th year). But there certainly is an advantage to being able to walk over to SIPA for a course or two in your particular areas of interest. Also, the SIPA library is open to you, as is any other library on the Columbia/Barnard campus. I know that because I helped my daughter return books she had been using for her senior thesis – apparently all the libraries have very liberal lending policies, because my daughter had a stack of about 100 books that needed to be returned to about half a dozen different libraries on campus. We loaded them all up in one of those metal wheeled laundry carts and then did a circuit around campus to all the different libraries. </p>
<ol>
<li>it sounds like you are leaning towards Barnard (and I am a W&M alum)</li>
<li>what do you want to actually do with your IR degree?</li>
</ol>
<p>related to 2: The SIPA program at Columbia is very academic-y and full of western/liberal ideals (UN, gender, etc) but does have an international security option. I get the impression Columbia attracts people that want to teach or perhaps attempt to manage some type of international development stuff, vs work on the national security side of international affairs. Neither is better or worse, they are just different career tracks. And I think Columbia’s location lends itself more to the UN type things vs. US focused positions which are mostly based in DC.</p>
<p>Thanks all for the responses! @soccerguy315 In terms of 2) that is a great point! I’m relatively sure I want to study international relations, yet what particular aspect of that major is still rather uncertain. I feel that at Barnard there is exposure to real world experience from internships and just being in the city, however at W&M I’m sure I would focus mostly on academics. Which one is better, I don’t know?</p>
<p>I certainly want to continue to grad school later on, and I’m looking for the best program (prestige and all) that would offer rigorous academics, connections, and opportunities. Which one looks better on a resume/application?</p>
<p>It’s been said that I was leaning towards Barnard and it was true. At least till I did more research on St. Andrews and reflect on the unique degree W&M is offering. </p>
<p>It’s just so hard! I seem to change my mind everyday…</p>
<p>Barnard is known nationally, not just within the New York. I would think that anyone doing any hiring within the field of IR would be very well aware of Barnard’s reputation and its affiliation with Columbia. </p>
<p>I do want to emphasize that no one is going to create opportunities for you. My daughter had an incredible overseas internship with a UN agency the summer after her sophomore year – she was doing the type of internship normally reserved for graduate students – but that is something that she arranged on her own, outside the auspices of the school, through networking. So that is probably something that she could have arranged for herself no matter what school she was attending. </p>
<p>It does look like the W&M/St.Andrews program would give you a more constrained and narrowly focused education – you would pretty much be spending all of your time taking courses related to the IR major – whereas at Barnard you would be spending much of your first 2 years filling the 9 ways of knowing requirements. So it probably depends somewhat on what you want out of college: do you want that broad, liberal arts foundation? One that requires you take a course in the arts along the way, and a full year of a lab based science – even though those have nothing whatsoever to do with your career goals? Or do you want to plunge right in and spend your time immersed in political science, history and econ courses? </p>
<p>Perhaps if you spend more time focusing on the details of the academic requirements, you’ll have your answer. The joint degree program sounds like a tremendous opportunity, but it is also a commitment that you will be making at age 18 that you may or may not be ready for; Barnard will offer its own set of opportunities with more flexibility. </p>
<p>So go back to your original post: why does Barnard make you smile? Your decision might just lie in the way that you answer that question for yourself.</p>