<p>In terms of best jobs/positions and salary?</p>
<p>What do you have against UCSF? (It's long been recognized by docs as a top ten med school.)</p>
<p>The 'best' premed program is one where YOU can earn the most A's and score high on the mcat. Nearly everything else is secondary.</p>
<p>JHU's BME program has an excellent reputation for sending grads off to med school. However, the poster above me makes a noteworthy point and is completely accurate.</p>
<p>JHU is actually one of the most stressful and cut throat pre med programs. Their placement of premeds into med schools is lower than Brown, Harvard, Yale and Princeton and more comparable to Duke's.</p>
<p>The best medical school? Harvard, followed by Hopkins.</p>
<p>^^ MyOpinion, that's actually pretty much all rumor. unless you've gone to JHU, which I doubt.</p>
<p>The best advice came from babyblueyou.
If you can do well at Hopkins, there are no doors closed to you in the medical world unless you eff up your medical essay or interview or something lol.
However, the same cannot be said if you, say, got a 4.0 from X state college. Amongst science and medical school admissions officers, JHU is very highly regarded for its pre-medical program. And their placement is pretty high as well.</p>
<p>^ </p>
<p>A 4.0 from a respected state university accompanied by high MCAT scores and reasonable extracurricular involvement will serve you no less well than similar accomplishments at Hopkins. </p>
<p>Hopkins has a fairly stringent weed out process in place that strongly discourages applicants from applying unless they're felt to be reasonable candidates. I've long felt that it is the responsibility of a college's pre-med office to offer guidance and advice, but ultimately support every student's decision about whether or not to proceed with applications. Let the medical school admissions committees "weed out" students. This is not a role a college should assume. </p>
<p>While a pre-med path is inherently one of the most stressful any college student can follow, the very high number of entering students interested in medicine coupled with Hopkins' policies about only selectively supporting applications to medical school do contribute to a higher stress level on campus in general. This is not generalizable to other fields. A creative writing or poli sci major on campus would likely see little difference vis a vis stress whether at Hopkins or Michigan, for example.</p>
<p>^I'm guessing you heard that somewhere?
This weed out process happens everywhere, dear. My friend at NYU with a 3.6 GPA who is pre-med was encouraged to not even apply to medical school if he couldn't raise his GPA to a 3.8 by the pre-med advisor.
My other friend at Brown was told that her 3.4 GPA was extremely poor and that the advisors had little faith in her medical school entrance at any medical school.
etc.</p>
<p>It's not only at Hopkins. Maybe if you go to a State University, the advisors there will encourage you, but at a lot of top schools, the advisors are harsh and expect the best out of their students. They will still help, however...but weeding out is inevitable. After all, only the best SHOULD go on to Medical School. Certain students simply do not qualify and/or do not show the potential to be good doctors.</p>
<p>And of course there is stress at JHU. Pre-Med students in general are very stressful, but this is true at places like Harvard, WashU, Northwestern, UofC, etc. Cutthroat doesn't mean **** because in this world, cutthroat is how many fight it out. Is it right? not all the time. But does it exist everywhere? you betcha.</p>
<p>If you are afraid of competition. go to X state school or better yet, go to X community college because schools like NYU, WashU, Northwestern, Harvard, Brown, etc are filled with the same types of Pre-Med cutthroats that everyone seems to only associate with JHU.</p>
<p>also, in regards to a student getting a 4.0 and perfect MCAT from State school...sure, that student might be at the same level as a HOpkins in the eyes of the review board. But what if both students had gotten 3.8 GPAs and the same MCAT? The Hopkins student would be viewed more favorably due to the reputation of the school for hard academics just like if you substituted "hopkins" for "northwestern" or "Columbia" or "Cornell" or "Caltech" etc. They would, almost 100% of the time, get the seat over the same statistical state student.</p>
<p>^ that may be true to some extent but in the REAL WORLD, admissions will look at other things like what you do with your time outside of college, any job experience, and your essays as well. If I were an adcom and saw both of those students with 3.8 GPAs I would neither reject nor accept either of them, at least until I saw other parts of their application.</p>
<p>i was merely giving you an example. obviously, a 3.8 is good at any school.</p>
<p>a 3.4 from Hopkins vs. a 3.4 for university of Oklahoma on the otherhand....unless the Oklahoma dude came up with a cure for AIDS...</p>
<p>What about for accelerated medical programs? Rice and Brown at the top of teh list?</p>
<p>Brown med is not that highly ranked. But, your first choice should be your instate public Uni if they have a program. It's a whole lot cheaper and you are still called "Doctor."</p>
<p>Northwestern HPME and Rice with Baylor are probably two of the two choices out there.</p>
<p>bluebayou
[quote]
Brown med is not that highly ranked. But, your first choice should be your instate public Uni if they have a program. It's a whole lot cheaper and you are still called "Doctor."
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Your bias is blatant. Brown University Medical School is ranked 23 (Primary Care) above John Hopkins, Mayo and Duke Medical Schools. If you want to look at research, Brown is ranked 31. </p>
<p>Out of a total 130 medical schools in the country that is pretty damn good, especially when only 50 get ranked. </p>
<p>I also believe that the idea of going to medical school is not to be called "Doctor"...What a..... remark that is.</p>
<p>Hope2getrice, you are being ridiculous.</p>
<p>The atmosphere and attitudes at different schools are very diverse. Just because premeds tend to be more obsessive and driven does not mean that the schools are the same. One of the reason to choose between schools is because of something called "fit". The student body at JHU and Brown are very different. The same goes for Harvard and Northwestern and University of Chicago....Premeds included.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Your bias is blatant. Brown University Medical School is ranked 23 (Primary Care) above John Hopkins, Mayo and Duke Medical Schools. If you want to look at research, Brown is ranked 31.</p>
<p>Out of a total 130 medical schools in the country that is pretty damn good, especially when only 50 get ranked.</p>
<p>I also believe that the idea of going to medical school is not to be called "Doctor"...What a..... remark that is.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>No one gives a crap about the primary care rankings. Brown isn't really known as a prestigous place for medical education or for residency. The med school is fine as are all the med schools in the US but unless you consider similarly ranked med schools (Boston University, etc.) to be "prestigious," I wouldn't call Warren Alpert prestigous.</p>
<p>MyOpinion:</p>
<p>Sorry, I don't drink the Ivy cool-aid. Being ranked high is primary care is NOT a badge of honor in medicine. If it were, kids would be flocking to Seattle (U-Dub has been ranked #1 in primary care like forever). The rankings are based on research on the big stuff, which is why Hopkins is up there with H.</p>
<p>Look, there are what 140 med schools in the US. Graduate from any of them and a student is an MD and can have a sucessful life-long practice. Graduating from Brown gets no brownie points over graduating from Wake Forest. The only difference a med degree makes is in research or future academics, but most premeds just want to live comfortable lives and practice with real patients.</p>
<p>
[quote]
hope sneeringly writes: ^I'm guessing you heard that somewhere?
This weed out process happens everywhere, dear. My friend at NYU with a 3.6 GPA who is pre-med was encouraged to not even apply to medical school if he couldn't raise his GPA to a 3.8 by the pre-med advisor.
[/quote]
No it doesn't happen everywhere; it happens at expensive schools that realize a high admit rate brings in fresh applicants to their school; it means they're willing to throw current undergrads under the bus in order to look good to future undergrads -- who they will treat the same way.</p>
<p>If your story is true, then NYU is screwing their students. Cornell publishes an accept/apply chart. You can see the 2008 one at <a href="http://www.career.cornell.edu/downloads/Health/AaChart2008.pdf%5B/url%5D">http://www.career.cornell.edu/downloads/Health/AaChart2008.pdf</a> They had 76 students apply in 2009 with a 3.4 to 3.58 GPA (in other words, WORSE than the 3.6 your "friend" had). And 68% of them got into med school!!</p>
<p>Bala is 100% right; students should look for colleges that advise students, not ones that actively screen out any but their best applicants.</p>
<p>As for advice that the OP asked for, take some time and read thru the Amherst premed guide at <a href="http://www3.amherst.edu/%7Esageorge/guide1.html%5B/url%5D">http://www3.amherst.edu/~sageorge/guide1.html</a> Finish it and you'll know more than 75% of the premeds out there. And they say it best about your quixotic hunt for a school that will give you some "edge"
[quote]
Amherst College has no magic touch that automatically elevates a student's chances of entering medical school simply by virtue of the student's coming to Amherst; no college or university has that kind of magic touch. What does elevate a student's chances is to go to an institution (1) that energizes and challenges that particular student academically, while providing good teaching and academic support so the student can meet the challenge satisfactorily; and (2) that provides opportunities for accomplishment and leadership in extracurricular areas. Of course the student must take advantage of these educational and extracurricular opportunities - in the end it's the student's accomplishments that count, not the name of the institution.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>mikemac, most of the top schools in the country do this. What I was pointing out was that JHU gets all this flack for doing this, when schools like Brown, Duke, Cornell, NYU, Northwestern, etc. subscribe to the same method of advising. Hence, their high success rates.</p>
<p>I totally agree with Hope...</p>
<p>Mike mac: Aren't the advising committee is looking out for your best interest? They seriously want to see their graduates succeed to the best of their ability, which is why they have a large acceptance rate into medical school. Those who are advised to apply to the next admission cycle eventually will get in due to the diligent good advise from the advising office. </p>
<p>I politely disagree with notion you are proposing: schools manipulate numbers by refusing to give university committee letters, not allowing applicants to apply, essentially "screwing" over their students for a larger acceptance rate to med schools to boast to potential freshman is very silly! </p>
<p>Universities want alumns to give back $$ and succeed in life, not to actively screw them for image purposes sake... They want to give the best advise possible in clear cut situations when they know for a fact that this below average applicant will not make it in the tough world of med admissions. Med admissions is not a "crapshoot" like admissions to HYPSM. With admission rates of 2-5% for even the top 50 med schools, things are really slim and there is no margin for error here. </p>
<p>Advising boards would rather save you the hassle of facing countless rejection letters and wasting upwards of $3000 and hours of your time which could be spent polishing up your resume for the next application cycle or applying to graduate schools to further bolster your credentials.</p>
<p>Med school admissions is incredibly tedious. Selection of a class of 100 students from 15,500 applicants is extremely tough. If a former dean of admissions from Hopkins med tells you to do post baccalaureate courses to boast your GPA, pursue a public health masters degree, join the TeachForAmerica for 2 years, join the PeaceCorp for a year, or do post graduate clinical work... THEY KNOW WHAT THEY ARE DOING. </p>
<p>They want their alumnis to be rich and successful so that they are satisfied and can donate back to their alma mater as doctors... Schools rarely would want to screw over their students in order to attract more students in which they will "screw" over at later time. The vicious cycle does not make sense because word will eventually get out that advising office is playing a game with ppl's lives... Many ppl will get very angry lol.</p>