College Disaster

Parent Cafe
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<p>I’ve been thinking about the discussions and TA thing and everything, and I mean, now that we’re in a university and getting older and whatnot, we’re the adults that have to be working together discovering things, etc. Our peers, our TAs, and us are the ones that are going to be in the workplace doing an assignment and needing to rely on each other and our own intuition. So I think I did undervalue that part of the university experience, the part that is trying to teach us that now we’re the ones who need to read the material and interpret it amongst ourselves, WE’RE also the scholars…not just the professor. </p>

<p>But, I also think there’s a balance and professors should still make themselves very available for their expert insight after coaxing interpretations out of us. I think a professor should be just as willing to engage in an intellectual conversation about the intricacies of a particular source/reading/etc. as he is willing to refer us to a TA to do it.</p>

<p>As far as taking a break, going to a community college someplace nice, volunteering, etc. I would love to do that. However, realistically I am not going to be able to live and work in and go to a gorgeous community college in San Francisco or something. Probably I’ll have to live at home and do a local community service project/attend the local CC/etc. I wanted very badly to do this BEFORE going away to college, but my parents would not have it. Although I think they would support me in doing this now that they see I am not succeeding as it is, at this point it would be very difficult for me to return back home. I will always be my parent’s “little girl” and it is difficult to live with them when they treat me very much like a child (even in HS, when I was very responsible). I don’t blame them for it, but it is the role they have kind of “stuck” me in as my brother is much more organized, outgoing, etc. So, I have always been their “problem child” in need of extra supervising/babying/etc. And it is very depressing to me when I can’t change this attitude of theirs no matter how responsible I am. So I would prefer to just keep plugging away here…Plus, I can’t bear to leave my friends/girlfriend/etc.</p>

<p>What are different ways to “try”? Brute mental force doesn’t seem to work. Midway through this semester when I realized things weren’t going my way, I wrote down this great list of things I should do - eat well, exercise daily, go to sleep by a certain time on certain nights (I have work very early in the morning some days), etc, all very simple things. And even though I tell myself I’ll stick to it I don’t. Just like when I say, ok I’ll do this assignment today, I don’t :(.</p>

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<p>Find someone to do these things with. As an adult, it’s hard to do many of these things but having one or more people to do things with improves the odds of success.</p>

<p>I play tennis three times a week with several other guys and we remind each other or ask someone via email if we have the time to hit. My son likes to drag me to the YMCA - he likes to run while I prefer weights. He keeps egging me on to run though.</p>

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<p>You can start out by going to class (EVERY class), and doing the assignments (ALL of them).</p>

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<p>nngmm: You can start out by going to class (EVERY class), and doing the assignments (ALL of them).</p>

<p>OK, this is an example of how unhelpful it is for the OP to be told to just try harder. She knows she needs to go to class, and she knows she needs to do her homework, but she hasn’t been doing them. Somehow she hasn’t been able to summon the willpower/motivation to do those things. She needs different techniques and strategies to get her going, because the Try Harder approach just doesn’t work. Maybe a coach would work. Maybe a specific schedule. Maybe setting up specific times to study with other students. Possibly medication. Maybe some counseling. Maybe a switch to a different school (though I doubt that alone would be enough). Maybe setting up very short-term rewards for herself. But when the trying harder <em>is</em> the problem, being told to try harder isn’t the solution.</p>

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Maybe it’s my problem, but it is just very hard for me to feel much sympathy for OP based on that passage. Unless a person is clinically depressed (which does not seem to be the case), she should be able to pull herself together enough to do the work she is perfectly capable of doing (based on her own assertion). If she can’t do that, there’s no justification to waste any more of her parents’ money on her “college experience”.</p>

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<p>inaslump11, I don’t understand why you did not take any upper-level courses yet; that’s the first thing that come to my mind when I was reading your post. With that many AP credits, you probably could do it right in your first semester. If engaging classes are what you want and need, why did not you try anything beyond the intro level? </p>

<p>But by now it looks like the things got out of hand already. My friend (a graduate student) was diagnosed with depression when all she had was the same unwillingness and procrastination you are describing. She did not feel depressed or sad at all, just could not bring herself to do the job. As other posters indicated, undiagnosed ADHD might be also the case. You probably should go to a real counselor (mental health professional), not to those who “just listen”.</p>

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<p>Ditto the above poster^^^</p>

<p>Sounds more like depression than ADD. Either way, a visit to the doctor may be the place to start.</p>

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<p>Are you unwilling to go to a doctor to be screened for depression or ADD? That has been offered several times and then you repeat your question of what you should do. That is the first thing you need to do. </p>

<p>I’m also going to disagree a little bit with the idea that “go to class everyday” is completely unhelpful. I do agree that making lists of ever single thing one should be doing and is not doing and then trying to change that through sheer force of mental will is unhelpful. But it’s not terrible advice to suggest that a person pick one behavior and focus on changing that one thing as it makes it not so daunting. It can calm the chaos and help the person feel a bit in control. </p>

<p>If the OP is unwilling to get professional help, then it cannot hurt to suggest many different ideas that might click with her.</p>

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<p>“I’ve been thinking about the discussions and TA thing and everything, and I mean, now that we’re in a university and getting older and whatnot, we’re the adults that have to be working together discovering things, etc. Our peers, our TAs, and us are the ones that are going to be in the workplace doing an assignment and needing to rely on each other and our own intuition. So I think I did undervalue that part of the university experience, the part that is trying to teach us that now we’re the ones who need to read the material and interpret it amongst ourselves, WE’RE also the scholars…not just the professor.” </p>

<p>inaslump… I think this is a very mature attitude for someone in their first year or two of college, and to me it represents a true love of learning, and for knowledge itself. I commend that, and encourage you continue to seek out your answers. You’ll find them. </p>

<p>One thing I don’t hear in your posts is the mention of something to look forward to, a hope for the future. Maybe graduate school, whatever. (When you mentioned “working together discovering things”, graduate school is what I thought of. You may or may not know this, but for many MS/PHD degrees, tuition and room/board is pretty much funded by your graduate assistantship, so money doesn’t have to be an issue. Just a thought…)</p>

<p>Regarding the rest of your post: </p>

<p>“What are different ways to “try”? Brute mental force doesn’t seem to work. Midway through this semester when I realized things weren’t going my way, I wrote down this great list of things I should do - eat well, exercise daily, go to sleep by a certain time on certain nights (I have work very early in the morning some days), etc, all very simple things. And even though I tell myself I’ll stick to it I don’t. Just like when I say, ok I’ll do this assignment today, I don’t .”</p>

<p>I rarely find that making lists of stuff to “improve myself” works – I just can’t do it.</p>

<p>But here is what does work: choose one thing, a simple thing, to change each day. (This is an idea that Tony Robbins’ excellent tapes helped bring into focus for me.) For me, it can be as simple as being sure to put my socks into the laundry bin rather than throwing them on the floor. Literally. :slight_smile: And each thing that you change gives you momentum, a boost in confidence, that allows you to then change one other small thing. Maybe you could commit to just attending one of your classes regularly, or being sure to review your notes or…</p>

<p>I don’t disagree with others, that you should seek some type of counseling: there could very well be physiological issues that only medication can really solve. If you are suffering in this way, medication can PROFOUNDLY change your life. Even if it’s not physiological, I agree that some type of cognitive or rational-emotive therapy is the way to go. Keep an open mind…</p>

<p>And you might also consider some type of vocational counseling: what do you want to do??? What makes you tick???</p>

<p>But in the end, you need to make a decision about what you’re going to do. Only you can do this.</p>

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<p>I have seen psychologists/psychiatrists and have been diagnosed a couple/few times with depression. ADD has been suggested but depression’s been the overruling one.</p>

<p>I have to say the meds don’t really work for me, I feel like my depression stems from a lot of bad thought patterns and habits that I have to unravel and fix for myself. Not just something a simple mood uplifter can help with…or did…as I have tried a couple different things.</p>

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<p>Have you tried therapy, particularly cognitive or cognitive behavioral therapy?</p>

<p>Have you talked to your parents about the college issues and/or the financial issues re: scholarship loss (are they contributing money, or are you paying the remainder of costs after your scholarship)?</p>

<p>(As an UG TA for several classes, I can say that TA’s [even moreso graduate student instructors and TA’s] are overwhelmed, but we’re also there to help. I always like it when students come to me for advice–I like to think I’m contributing to their education in a broader way, and I like the feeling that they test my intelligence enough to ask for advice. If you have questions about your grade, <em>politely</em> ask your TA. If you have a valid, engaged point, they’d probably be more than happy to discuss it with you.)</p>

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<p>Strattera and Wellbutrin can help with both mood and attention. Strattera can unlock unproductive thinking patterns.</p>

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<p>There are far too many meds out now to make a blanket statement of “meds don’t really work for me” yet. You may or may not need medication. But you do need professional help. You are a bright, hard working person who has obviously done her best to handle this on her own. </p>

<p>With my depression, my mood does not “lift” at all with the right combo of meds. Instead, my brain clears of what I’ve come to call my “depressive thinking.” Among other things, I am able to follow through on tasks that I knew I had to get done but was having such trouble following through on. In getting back on track, in becoming free of the invisible weights that were holding me down, then my mood lifts.</p>

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<p>Strattera… it seems to help with organization but a lot of people with ADD (unless they are hyperactive) find themselves exhausted.</p>

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<p>“I know that if I showed up to class and did all my work on time, I would have straight As. But I just can’t bring myself to do either. Sure, I’ve always been kind of lazy, but in HS I could get myself to do things. Here, I’m just totally disinterested in academics. Maybe it’s because I expected classes to be more interesting or challenging, and I feel like they’re a step down from what I’m used to.”</p>

<p>I actually am ADD – what some here are calling “inattentive ADHD”, and what the OP describes doesn’t sound like ADD, but like laziness, condescension toward others, and a sense of entitlement.</p>

<p>Sounds like the OP feels to smart to bother doing all of the work required, so to me, it seems like going to college is wasting the OP’s time, and the OP might as well enter the work world fulltime where the challenge of having to support himself would motivate him to do what needed to be done whether or not it was boring or his supervisors seemed smart and interesting.</p>

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<p>Northstarmon, I’m sorry but I think you are being extremely callous and harsh. </p>

<p>[edit – northstarmom’s comment follows, below, for some reason]</p>

<p>I’ll second (third?) what has just been said – you clearly have the ability, conscientiousness, drive, and values to achieve something. It does sound like there is something other than a “lack of effort” that is standing in your way.</p>

<p>And that something could be a combination of physiology (ADHD and/or depression) as well as beliefs/thought patterns. </p>

<p>I think that coming to grips with this “something” whatever it is, should be a high priority, and I think you should enlist the help of those who care about you, and are already committed to helping: the school, and your parents. </p>

<p>At the same time, this should not be an excuse to let off with school (or any other responsiblity). People function, and get through their tasks, with ADHD and depression. I am one of them, who did for twenty-plus years. But it’s hard, and we recognize that, and if you come to grips with the other issues, it WILL get easier!!!</p>

<p>Do your best to uphold your responsiblities, but at the same time, speak with the school counselors and your parents, and make it clear that you need to work through, with their help, the other issues.</p>

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<p>You do sound depressed and somewhat obsessive. That is what I felt right at your first post.</p>

<p>How much do you exercise? You’re a young person; is there any physical activity that you enjoy on a regular basis? Club or intramural sports of any kind? Perhaps a new activity that you might enjoy which would involve sweat?</p>

<p>The reason I asked about exercise is because studies have shown that it can be as effective (or more) than drug therapy, and you have indicated that drugs don’t work for you. </p>

<p>Personally, I am of the opinion that ADD/ADHD is way over-diagnosed and it is the drug companies who benefit. My son was diagnosed with it years ago and has managed to deal very effectively without drugs. In the process he became a fine athlete. </p>

<p>It appears that whatever you’re doing now isn’t working. I don’t think that a change of scenery (school transfer) is what you need. What you need is to change your patterns of living, get out of the rut that you’re in. And you probably need some good help with that, ie a counselor.</p>

<p>Best of luck to you.</p>

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<p>I’m entering this discussion late, and many of the comments are very good, and should be seriously considered. inaslump, you say that you have been diagnosed with depression in the past. Why, then, are you not in some kind of ongoing cognitive therapy??? You should be seeing someone on a consistent basis who can help you tap into what is really keeping you from moving forward with your life.
You don’t mention any goals, any plans, or any interests in your posts. What do you want to do with your life? It’s possible that not being able to answer this question is partly the reason for your depression.
I second the suggestions that you could benefit from a time-out from school. But don’t work in some dead-end burger flipping type job that you’re sure to dislike and find excuses to quit. I would suggest getting a job in a helping profession…teaching assistant, tutoring, work in a care-giving role…something where you can see that your hard work results in a benefit to someone else. I believe that many people need to be helping others to feel good about themselves, and there’s nothing wrong with that. My own daughter never felt so good as when she was helping kids learn who had learning difficulties. She needs and wants to feel useful. Could this be part of your issue as well?
Work in the real world may help you decide your own purpose in life, and once you’ve done that, school will be about realizing your goals.
And to repeat the most important take-away from these discussions–cognitive therapy. It will help you find yourself.</p>

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<p>ADHD is an umbrella term that actually refers to a complex set of symptoms. One person’s experience of ADD/ADHD may not be the same as another’s. </p>

<p>I think we, out here in internet-land, are doing this young lady a real disservice if we attempt to say, one way or another, what we think her problem is. We can suggest, we can say “it sounds like…”, but we cannot say, definitively. Especially when such diagnoses are typically handled by highly trained practitioners who are skilled in administering and interpreting some sophisticated and highly evolved test instruments.</p>

<p>inaslump, please take such suggestions with a grain of salt: we aren’t there, we can’t see you, we only have some words on a screen which only convey about 1/10 of the information that we really need. (the other information consists of things like tone of voice, expression, etc.)</p>

<p>Do enlist the help of those who care about you, i.e. the school’s counseling system, as well as your parents. And persist in seeking that help until you get through this. </p>

<p>At the same time, hang in there, and keep trying!!! You will get out of your courses what you put into them. And keep up with your responsiblities, and take care of yourself. Make sure you’re eating well, getting some type of physical exercise, and above all, having some fun.</p>

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<p>It sounds like you’re in a self-generating cycle of depression, lack of motivation, and hopelessness about your options. I feel for you. I think what you characterize as your laziness – your inability to fulfill your goals, assignments, to “stay the course” – is really about something else. I don’t know what that might be for you, but I’ve had similar problems. For me, it’s a combination of fear of failure or success which leads to expectations, fear of being average, and the particular family dynamic of my childhood. It takes a long time to sort these things out, but there is a reason (or several) for your resistance. And that’s what I sense the most from your posts, that your default mode is a sort of dug in resistance to what you know you should/could be doing. List making and planning don’t really help, they’re just another kind of procrastination. As others have suggested, a targeted therapy like cognitive behavioral therapy might be the most helpful.</p>

<p>It sounds like going back home to work or go to a community college might not be so great, given that you’ll be right back with the same old patterns within your family. You really have the most options where you are right now, if you can find it within you to take advantage of them. There have been great suggestions already. Maybe just do one little thing every day?</p>

<p>As for being shy, there is nothing inherent about being shy that will prevent you from being successful, unless your goal is to be a “people person”! I know many, many people who are basically introverted, who are very happy within their small social orbit. The only problem with it from my perspective is if it prevents you from enjoying other people, if you are so acutely self-conscious around others that you are unable to focus on anything but your own discomfort (like your club outings). It might help to remember that human interaction is not at all about worrying about or cultivating your impression on others but curiosity and interest in the other human being, despite all the social advice available. I guarantee that if you can keep this in mind during your next conversation with a TA, you’ll be amazed at what you can learn.</p>