<p>I've officially decided on IU, and I'll be a freshman in the fall. Living in the Central neighborhood.</p>
<p>All I hear are pros and good things about going to school here. But no school can be perfect, so what are the ** cons ** of attending IU? I'd just like a bigger picture beyond the pamphlets they give us and what they tell during the info sessions.</p>
<p>If you looking for complaints read posts by Welch1016, she has plenty of them including the cold,crowded buses, greek life, crowded gym. No place is perfect but overall IU does a pretty good job. Keep in mind Welch1016 was trying to get into the business school and was having academic problems so take her complaints with grain of salt.</p>
<p>I can’t think of too many, I like it here a lot. I’d say the residence hall food is pretty unhealthy, that’s the thing I dislike the most. There are only so many salads I can take, and unfortunately the healthiest foods take the most meal points. I’m assuming you’re a guy, so that may not be of greatest concern. It’s big and its cold in the winter, but I was going to get that no matter where I went, so it’s not a big deal. I really love it though, hopefully you will too.</p>
<p>IU is so close to perfect that it’s hard to think of anything.</p>
<p>The food is really unhealthy as the previous post said, and a lot of the professors aren’t English proficient. Other than that, there really are only good things to say.</p>
<p>Probably the one negative that stood out to me (and that wasn’t clear at the time of being admitted) was how IU-B treated incoming “honor” students versus regularly admitted students. There are many workshop and special programs that are essentially only available if one comes into the honor program as a entering freshman.</p>
<p>Let me give one example:</p>
<p>One of the best business “special” program is its Investment Banking Workshop. Information about the workshop is given to business students who have either (a) already been admitted as “direct admit” students as freshmen, or (b) who are in the regular honors (Hutton Honors) program as freshmen–and almost never mentioned at all to any students taking regular “university division” business classes–even though the material covered is exactly the same in both groups of classes. Applications for the workshop are taken before the end of the freshmen year–primarily because the first workshop courses must be taken during the summer between the freshmen and sophomore semesters. This strongly favors students who have already taken business honors courses;–and, in browsing the IBW resume book, I never found one student admitted to the program who got in from the “university division” as opposed to those who were already business direct admits. </p>
<p>This is for a very simple reason–it makes no sense to admit someone to a “special” business program who hasn’t even been “admitted” to the business school;–and the requirement to get admitted for non-direct admits are such that it is almost impossible to get admitted until after a student’s freshman year has ended.</p>
<p>Similar requirements exist for other “special” programs in other schools, such as Journalism, Music, and Telecommunications.</p>
<p>I found this policy/procedure ridiculous for one primary reason;–it makes a student’s high school work and grades (and not work and grades earned at Indiana University) the primary criteria for determining who will get “priority” status (via admittance to the special program). Yes, the honor students still have to do well to get in the programs–but those not in honors programs as incoming freshmen have a zero (yes, zero) percent chance of getting into these workshops no matter how hard they work during their time at the university.</p>
<p>Other than this one glaring “con” I find most of the complaints about IU-B to be the kind of things one would find complaints about at any large top-level university–that is, some students drink too much or are too rowdy, some dorms are older than others, some dorms party too much, and sometimes it is difficult to get to classes on-time because distances across campus are so great. </p>
<p>My son had three other cons he listed (the cold weather, the large number of busses that were overcrowded or ran late during the early morning hours and the fact that he didn’t have a job upon graduation since none of the recruiters were from the west coast where he planned to live upon graduation). Yet despite these problems, my son actually loved his time at IU-B and is still very glad that he chose to go there.</p>
<p>Calcruzer, I’m pretty sure that students typically do not apply for the Investment Banking Workshop until the beginning of their junior year, by which time nearly all applicants would have been in Kelley for at least a year. If you look at this year’s group of IBW members, probably only about sixty percent are in business honors, which may be a little low compared to previous classes, as this year’s class does not seem as talented on paper (resumes) as the last few years. I doubt that non-direct admits and non-business honors students have zero chance of getting into IBW. Eight or nine students in the most recent IBW class have gpa’s below 3.6 and even 3.5. </p>
<p>A student that was a member of my son’s graduating class in high school was not a direct admit to Kelley, is not in business honors, and is not in IBW. Despite this, he is in two investment clubs at IUB and was able to obtain oncampus interviews the last two weeks for ibank summer internships. Just getting those interviews would be extremely tough to do for students at all but the top finance schools and the best national universities. So I don’t think there are insurmountable obstacles to getting interviews from some of the top finance companies coming to IU just because you were not a direct admit or in business honors, and getting those interviews is probably a better opportunity than most students get from being in their school’s honors program.</p>
<p>Having said that, there are a ton of perks that come with being in business honors, and really not that may benefits to being a direct admit outside of not having to worry about C’s keeping you out of Kelley-- which is an absolutely huge benefit. Hutton Honors is great for business majors. Non entering Hutton Honors students and non-direct admits can get into Hutton Honors with relative ease-- just take at least 14 credits the first semester and achieve at least a 3.7 gpa, and you will be automatically admitted to Hutton Honors college during your first Spring semester at IU, if you take the time to apply to HHC. There will still be time for most students that get accepted to Kelley after completing their freshman year, and entering HHC by getting the first semester 3.7, to take, during their sophomore year, honors versions of both introductory accounting classes, X202, honors Legal Environment of Business, and X205, as well as some HHC COAS classes to pad their gpa’s with. They can also take Z304 (honors managment class) and HHC COAS classes their junior/senior year. Those are a lot of opportunities for somebody that did not have an outstanding high school record and who did not enter IUB as a Kelley direct admit or Hutton honors student. And all they have to do is get the 3.7+ the first semester, which really isn’t that difficult to do if you choose your classes wisely.</p>
<p>There really aren’t that many cons with IU itself as a school. I’m trying to think of bad things about IU and the only ones I can really think of are things that you can find in any college. The dorm food, cold weather, etc… all of those are found elsewhere and I happen to kind of like the food 
</p>
<p>Some of the classroom buildings, especially the older ones, are a little dirty on the inside.
Campus is HUGE so getting places is a pain sometimes especially when the weather is bad, but the scenery is gorgeous and there is a pretty reliable bus system too.
Ummmmm if you don’t like to party you might get sick of the huge party culture; it’s very much prevalent but don’t let that stop you from coming here.
IU is super expensive out of state, but then again, most other state schools are too. </p>
<p>Otherwise, that’s about it. I can’t think of much else. IU has been very good to me so far.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>I really hate to hijack this thread, but this scares me slightly. I definitely want to return to the west coast upon finishing college, but I don’t want to be jobless. Is that avoidable? 
Do I have to work for a company that only recruits at IU?</p>
<p>You don’t even apply to the IBW until beginning of junior year. There are a couple students in my class who are not in any honors programs (but I have no clue whether or not they were direct admits). </p>
<p>I can assure you that there is no emphasis placed on you being a direct admit or your grades in high school (although if you came to IU as a Wells/Kelley Scholar that is always viewed favorably). The only part of high school that is applicable is your SAT/ACT score, and that is because some banks do look at that. I was not admitted into any honors programs directly, gained admittance to Hutton after my first semester, and business honors after my second because I worked hard my first year at IU.</p>
<p>It is hard to get a job on the west coast simply because not very many of those offices come here to recruit. I know there are a couple alum at UBS and one at Goldman Sachs in San Francisco, and we have one person at Lazard Freres and J.P. Morgan in LA. I cannot speak for non-investment banking jobs, but am confident that if you spend time searching the alumni index that you will find alum along the west coast. In short, you are going to have to do more work to get a job on the west coast, but it is still attainable.</p>
<p>Well, apparently a few things have changed at IU-B–and obviously for the better.</p>
<p>Change #1: First, let me say that almost all IBW students used to be chosen during the freshman year to attend IBW preliminary (prep) classes during the summer before the sophomore year–and there were even students chosen during the freshman year to be in the full-fledged program during their sophomore year (although these were very few–usually only 2 or 3). Now apparently, everyone needs to go through the normal process for admission–and this kicks off during the beginning of the junior year–and the IBW class is offered during the spring semester of the junior year. This is a whole lot later–but still allows the student to have the material needed prior to their internship at the end of the junior year.</p>
<p>P.S. If anyone wants to verify that this is how things used to work, (being chosen earlier and taking the classes earlier), you can look at an old version of the IBW resume book at the following site:
[Investment</a> Banking resume book.doc - File Shared from Box.net - Free Online File Storage](<a href=“http://www.box.net/shared/jkgjvot9tc]Investment”>Box)
and then look for the resume of Tamir Kaloti–and you’ll see that he even put down as one of his accomplishments that he was one of the two sophomores chosen to be in the IBW full program as a sophomore (in 2005). Also, if you look at some of the senior resumes, you’ll notice that they list multi-year interships (meaning they were in the program as sophomores also).</p>
<p>Change #2: It used to be that if you were not admitted to Hutton Honors College as a freshman, you had to wait until the end of your freshman year to apply. Now I see that the rules have been changed so that you can apply at the end of your first semester at the school. (Unfortunately, I have no way to prove this change–so you’ll have to trust me on this one.)</p>
<p>Change #3: Mitte (Business) Honors Program
One of the requirements used to be that you already had to be admitted to the business program (and I mean actually admitted, not a university division student with a declared business major) in order to apply for the business honors program. Since your application had to be in by April 1st of the freshman year–this was very difficult, if not essentially impossible. I see they have now apparently changed this requirement (although it is not entirely clear from the website that they have done so)
[Business</a> Honors Program: Academics: Undergraduate Program: Kelley School of Business: Indiana University Bloomington](<a href=“Undergraduate | Bachelor's Degree in Business | Indiana Kelley”>Undergraduate | Bachelor's Degree in Business | Indiana Kelley)
It appears that you can now apply if you have a 3.7 GPA during your first semester and are at least making progress towards completing your business school admission prerequisites. There are new rules about getting two teacher recommendations submitted and completing 26 units by the end of the fresman year, however–and even in this case, if you apply by April 1st, you still won’t know if you are admitted until the summer before your sophomore year. But it is still a great improvement from the old rules.</p>
<p>All in all, I have to say I’m impressed that apparently IU-B took steps to change many of their procedures. And I also need to apologize for not checking closer on their new procedures before posting my “con” list.</p>
<p>There are some things that I really like about IU but more that I don’t. This is a list of my cons of attending school here:</p>
<ol>
<li><p>IU is so easy to get into so your peers will be stupid and immature. There is compulsive drinking among the girls on my floor nightly because guys show up with shots and beer and they get trashed almost every night. Then in class all you hear about is people complaining that theyre too hung over to function or that they skipped their first class because they were too drunk to walk to it. </p></li>
<li><p>There is too much partying and if you do not want to party people will look down at you. I know people who have died from alcohol, i wanted nothing to do with the party scene at IU and in result my floor thinks i am sheltered and guys think i am unworthy. But IU is a constant rage going on all around you at at all times.</p></li>
<li><p>The people are not friendly. Everybody comes from the rich suburbs of Indianapolis and they do not want to meet new people. You need to be from a town called Carmel to mean anything on this campus, otherwise you are worthless. You introduce yourself to people in the first week and they look at you like you just whipped your shirt off and then awkwardly say ‘cool’ when you tellthem your name. it is not a welcoming environment at all and if you are not from indiana or a state that connects to it, you will be unable to make friends without really putting yourself out there to extreme levels i mean people just don’t want to get to know out of state students.</p></li>
<li><p>It is so cold. The bus system is bad and you have to walk really far to class when it is freezing and there are no precautions that IU takes to make this easier. The main classroom buildings are always freezing too so when you are an IU student you are basically living in a fridge. It’s also very windy and brisk and the arctic chill gets brutal un december and january and they hardly ever cancel class because of it.</p></li>
<li><p>Profesors are SO bad. Half of mine did not know english last semester and i could not understand one thing they were saying and the ones i could understand taught small classs and they played favorites. The best instroctors at IU are the AI’s for discussion sections and i have found them to be quite good. But I took a CMCL-C190 class last semester with a grad student named William Scheibel and I wanted to barf every day in that class, all he did was flaunt his vocabulary and make himself look cool and the whole class did so bad.</p></li>
<li><p>The campus is very big and you need to walk far. The bus system is not good, it is ever consistent and the traffic on campus is EXTREMELY dangerous and slow.</p></li>
<li><p>There is no good way to get involved on campus, every campus organization is a cult. Yes I did go to over 10 callout meetings and some events and they are all just cults. You will not feel welcome and they will not be nice to you.</p></li>
<li><p>The food is attrocious, all they have is hotdogs/burgers/chicken/pizza and they have no steak or lasagna or good food that’s healthy. I am well on my way to the Freshman 15 because of the lack of healthy food. I went to collins once to get healthy food but we got stared at because we were wearing preppy clothes and that is not okay at collins so we got “stared” out of the cafeteria.
^ This also shows how condescending people here are.</p></li>
<li><p>The classes are weird, some are impossible like K201 and A100 hardly anyone passes A100 on their first try it’s impossible.ECON E201 is an adventure through hell and then finite is sooooo hard. Then they make you take all these dumb language classes where atother schools if ur good enough u can pass out of language all together but theyre still making me take spanish 200 250 and 280 even tho i had AP credit.</p></li>
<li><p>Campus is ugly. I admit the part of campus by the union and the sample gates is very nice but i think 80% of this campus is attrocious. </p></li>
<li><p>The dorms are sooo bad, especially Wright</p></li>
<li><p>Greek life is so bad, they are all pretentious and EVERYONE wants to be just like them. IF you are not grek they call you a GDI and call you worthless. You cannot go to their parties because you are not as high uip as them and during sorority rush they are not fair and do not talk to all the girls equally they judge off appearance. There is always something bad in the greek scene and everyone’s always talking about it, i hate it.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>There are so many more cons, pm me if you have questions i know a lot about this school and what it is REALLY like, i do not candy coat things</p>
<p>In response to Weltch1016:</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Yes, IU is a big school. There will be intelligent people and mornic people. It is all about who you associate yourself with. One of my friends has a 2.5 GPA, parties every day and is lazy. Another has a 3.96, studies during the week and parties during the weekend. You will find people on both ends of the spectrum.</p></li>
<li><p>Yes, there are parties, but I doubt you will find many people who party more than 3 days a week. People like to have fun. I like to have fun. However, if you do not like parties or have to study for a test instead of attending one, noone I have met would look down on you for it. Last year I had to miss several due to a tough schedule, but when I managed to make it to a couple my friends were glad to see me enjoying myself and made sure I had a good time.</p></li>
<li><p>This is just untrue. Everyone I have ever met at this school has been extremely friendly when I first met them. During my three years at IU I have met a total of three people who I did not enjoy getting to know more. Most of the people here are very friendly. </p></li>
<li><p>Has been covered in another thread.</p></li>
<li><p>You have good professors and bad professors. Each semester I have one or two that I do not care for and maybe one per year that I think should not be teaching. However, as you move up into higher level classes, the quality becomes better and better. Overall I think the professors (especially in the finance, accounting, and economics departments) are great.</p></li>
<li><p>The campus is big, but big is relative. You can walk from one end to the other in twenty minutes, or bike it in five. I have had very little experience with the bus system, so I cannot comment on that.</p></li>
<li><p>I have yet to find a cult on campus (although I have not joined any religious clubs). I have been involved with eight different organizations and none of them have been a cult. The closest thing to a cult I have experienced was the church we stayed at in South Carolina during alternative spring break last year.</p></li>
<li><p>Dorm food is gonna suck almost everywhere, but IU is not that bad. There is lasagna at Foster. You can have egg white only dishes, salads with low fat dressing, fruits, etc. However, you can also get very unhealthy things at the same time. You are going to have to make that decision yourself. After you leave the dorms you do you own shopping at the grocery store. </p></li>
<li><p>Classes are not weird. K201, A100, and E201 are weed out classes. They assign a lot of work, but if you do the work you are going to get a good grade. They do this to weed out students who would not be good business majors due to work ethic. They are not conceptually overwhelming. </p></li>
<li><p>IU campus is beautiful. You should see the other Big Ten campuses.</p></li>
<li><p>Dorms are small. I did not care for them, which is why I got a house for the same price as a dorm my sophomore year.</p></li>
<li><p>I have not had the most interaction with greek life, but everyone I know who is greek is pretty cool. I will admit there are a couple people who have grown up living a pretty good life and might be spoiled, but overall they are good people. Also, GDI is not an insult. However, I never bid for a frat and have had very little experiences with what goes on inside a sorority, so take what I say with a grain of salt.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>Thank you, Welch1016, you have completely made my day.</p>
<p>Never mind, my message has been sent in a PM.</p>
<p>To Welch 1016:</p>
<ol>
<li><p>IU is an enormous state school, if you came here expecting an Ivy experience than your problems started far before you arrived here. Indiana is consistently on top twenty party school lists; of course theres going to be drinking. But theres also some of the most brilliant people Ive ever encountered here. If youre bragging about how easy it is to get in here, then maybe you should/could be in Hutton, where youd be surrounded with like-minded individuals who wont be complaining about hangovers every morning. (Also, if you can get your work done, whats wrong with going out on the occasional weeknight? It is college afterall).</p></li>
<li><p>See above. And no, it isnt a constant rage. I lived in the infamous Briscoe, and my floor (a non-honors floor at that) was extremely quiet on the weekends. </p></li>
<li><p>I am from the East Coast, literally didnt know a single person when I came to IU freshman year, and managed to make tons of friends. You dont need to be from Carmel or a suburb of Indy. You need to be friendly, which quite frankly, you dont seem to be. Most people seemed to be interested when I tell them where Im from; they would ask how I chose IU, or if I like it out here. Smile, wave, chat up a stranger at the bus stop. Youll make friends no matter where youre from. People in Indiana are friendlier than any other region in the U.S. Ive ever traveled to.</p></li>
<li><p>It is cold. Duh. Its the Midwest. You should have researched Indianas climate before deciding to come here. Ive always been comfortable once inside the buildings. IU is an enormous campus, in terms of size, and the ground crews do all they can to try and make it bearable for students. </p></li>
<li><p>Two words: Grade. Distribution. IU has a very easily accessible database that allows you to look up the average GPA for every class taught by each professor. This allows you to look up just how well students do in each section so you can avoid the duds. As with any large research university, there are going to be foreign instructors, but they generally arent found often past freshman or sophomore year in the very large classes. Ive personally never had a foreign professor other than in Spanish (and she was from Spain).</p></li>
<li><p>Didnt you visit before you came here? I love walking, its great exercise and campus is gorgeous. The bus system isnt consistent, but IU has a great iPhone app that allows you to track where each bus is. If you dont have an iPhone, someone at your bus stop will. </p></li>
<li><p>There are plenty of ways to get involved on campus. Did you know that IU has over 650 student organizations? I have a hard time believing that all are cults. Im a part of PRSSA and its nowhere near what one would describe as a cult. Join a club that youre passionate about. Did you do Relay for Life in high school? Then join IUs Relay for Life team. Clubs are always on the lookout for new members, and I cannot imagine that they would be rude or unwelcoming to a prospective member.</p></li>
<li><p>The food isnt great. Ill give you that. But Ive been to Collins before without any problems, and I am extremely preppy.</p></li>
<li><p>I really dont even want to respond to this one
</p></li>
<li><p>CAMPUS IS BEAUTIFUL ARE YOU KIDDING ME?! My friends that come to visit are always amazed by how picturesque and “classic college” it is. </p></li>
<li><p>The dorms are not fantastic, but as stated before, that can be expected at any large public university. Besides, most people only have to deal with them for a year.</p></li>
<li><p>Greek life has honestly has been a godsend for me. I have made my best friends in the entire world because of the Greek system. I understand it’s not for everyone, but there is no need to attack something that does amazing things for this campus and for the lives of the people involved in it. And not everyone wants to be just like them thats why only about 18% of this campus goes Greek. If everyone wanted to go Greek, itd be a lot higher. You cannot go to their parties because youre not a part of the system, just like I wouldnt expect to be able to walk into a house party at someones house who I wasnt friends with. Sorority rush is cutthroat, statistically the most competitive in the country. But as someone who has been on both sides of recruitment, I can promise you that selections are not made off of appearance, even in the best houses. </p></li>
</ol>
<p> but thats just my two cents.</p>
<p>^ I agree. The fact that he said people from Indiana are mean and that IUB is ugly, however, makes me think this kid is just a giant ■■■■■. Oh, and the fact that he called all clubs “cults”. And the fact that he blamed the cold on IU. And just the overall tone of entitlement and whininess that seems to be so shockingly prevalent in our generation.</p>
<p>Welch1016, Wow thats quite a list of complaints. I find it interesting that you complain that people at IU are not intelligent, yet ,you were unable to pass the weed out classes required for Kelley. Perhaps you are a bit bitter? You should definitely transfer home to community college and live at home where you will not encounter relying on busses, cold weather or dorm food.</p>
<ol>
<li>There is literally nothing to do on the weekends if you don’t like to party. Luckily, I was able to find a few people who don’t party either, so I pass the time doing other things. I have never encountered a negative reaction from people who party and drink.</li>
<li>Math department has midterms on Saturday mornings. So if you do party, expect to either not party on Friday or party and bomb the midterm. Also, don’t expect to get ANY sleep in your dorm the night before, if you are doing a spring math class. They are the week before Spring Break, so it’s the night everyone goes out and gets drunk before they’ll be gone from campus for a week. Drunk people really have no regard for people who have to sleep because of a midterm. Oh yeah, math professors tend to have accents that are not understandable.</li>
<li>IU is really crappy about cleaning sidewalks after snow and ice. Ice skating to class is not fun. They never cancel school. They did once this year only because people started getting seriously injured, like broken bones and concussions from falling on the ice.</li>
<li>It always feels like the professors here want you to fail. This is very true in the Chemistry courses. When an AI tells you that they will get test scores back as soon as possible so you can drop the class, it makes you lose all hope…quickly.</li>
<li>IU loves to charge you random fees for the dumbest things. Also, watch out with refund money. IU will give you a majority of it 1st semester, and give you about 100-300 dollars 2nd semester. I blew all my money 1st semester because I didn’t realize they did this and I am struggling this semester.</li>
</ol>
<p>I think I can keep on going on and on here, haha. I’m pretty much here for my friends. You can find a niche here. The friends I have made here are better friends than I ever had in high school.</p>
<p>Too big and too much of a party school for my son. For others, that is perfect.</p>
<p>^^^ My concern also.</p>