<p>"Besides, I've told my kids they're my old age insurance "</p>
<p>oh, how true!! Though I have serious misgivings that S will put himself out for me like I did for my parents (in the physical sense).Can a future PhD in science--headed for research--earn enough to support his tired mother?</p>
<p>Bookworm: Same here!</p>
<p>The deal in our family is that the kids bring home respectable report cards and we'll do everything we can to pay for the best college that they can get in to......that's our priority.......wouldn't have it any other way.</p>
<p>I don't think parents own their kids a college education only the best preperation for life past highschool that fits
I also don't think children need to plan to take care of their parents financially or physically.
( kids don't need to produce grandkids either- I doubt if either of my girls will have kids and I respect that they are honest with themselves as to what they want to do)</p>
<p>We've never thought of it as "owing". It's always been a given in our home that we would provide as many opportunities for a full and successful life, as possible, for our children. We never actually discussed, or reached the decision, to pay for a college education for them. It was just, as I said, a given. Unspoken but planned for, beginning the day each of them was born. Neither my parents, nor my husband's parents, attended college. We were both given the opportunity to, and our success is a direct result of that opportunity. </p>
<p>We are fortunate enough to provide for our children, as well as the boyfriend of one of our Ds, and a couple of nieces and nephews, whose parents are not as able to provide. Our attitude and policy of giving children opportunities hasn't changed over the years. From the time they were small, we offered them the opportunity for different types of activities, e.g., music, art, drama, dance, sports, martial arts, computer camps, etc. These are all a part of a child's education, in my opinion, and the attempt to make them well-rounded, informed adults in the future. Formal education is probably the single most important 'gift' we can give our children. Why would we stop when they turn 17 or 18?</p>
<p>I can certainly sympathize with those who are unable financially to provide a college education for their children. However, I will never understand those who ARE able to pay, yet think that their responsibility ends when the child turns 18. A good education, all through the years, can be the great equalizer for a child.</p>
<p>I do believe parents owe their kids and "education". Just as much as they owe their kids love and care.</p>
<p>The question is...when is a child "educated"?</p>
<p>Without a better criteria we have decided that they are educated when they can read and write and do basic math. Beyond that, everything else is a bonus. We will help them educate themselves as much as we can and as much as they are willing. </p>
<p>We have decided that we are only able to help them with college education to the tune of about $10,000 per year. That is a somewhat arbitrary number based on the amount that we are already paying for their room and board and other expenses at home.</p>
<p>We don't owe them anything beyond the basic "education". They can educate themselves after that if they are motivated enough.</p>
<p>I think it depends on the child. If they have the potential to acheive at college, sure, I think I owe that to them. I know my husband would say he owes that to his children. After all, we want to do what we can to give our children a good start in life. Nowadays, one can incur enormous debt easily, if you love your child, who wants to see them in that position! But there is a limit as to what we can do. If the decision was made to have several children, you can only do so much for each.</p>
<p>I don't think my children 'owe' me anything in return. I have seen situations where parents have disowned a child because they didn't get back what they think they deserved. Too sad. But, also, when I see parents put limitations, like you can only go to college here or here, I do understand that also. Parents want that lifelong assocaiation with their children and it is very difficult to remain close if family is split up over thousands of miles. </p>
<p>There are so many new issues to deal with today. For example, in times past, the grandparents remained with one child or another or were passed from child to child in their old age. Nowadays, grandparents may live longer and because of this need more old age care. Or they may be able to be self suficient longer. I don't expect my children to be close to me in old age but hope they will. If you always kept the fire warm for them, chances are they will return to it. And kids do learn from example.If parents smoke, kids pick it up, if parent was helpful and concerned about his parents, kids will do likewise. Guess you get what you reap!</p>
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<p>But he said I did in fact owe a debt, but the debt was not owed back to him but forward to the next generation. </p>
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<p>What a great way to word this ... if you don't mind I am going to steal it and use it with my kids</p>
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<p>I with Suzie the Vet , and Mr. B. As the first in my family to go to the U, paid for myself, working for "it" helps builds character (I even got out in four years). However, working nearly FT kinda diminishes the college experience. </p>
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<p>I agree with the character part ... our current plan is to have the kids work part-time (8-10 hours a week) and take out minimal loans while in school (subsidized student loans) ... which hopefully will help them apprecaite the experience. Then when they graduate one of the small skinny envelopes they get as a graduation gift will include a check to payoff the loans.</p>
<p>Fendergirl, congrats on turning 22, you said your birthday was near...and I'm impressed by your posts here on CC.</p>
<p>On my side of the family, my son will also be 6th generation college-going. My husband's side, my husband is first generation and that is an achievement unto itself; my mother-in-law is single-handedly responsible for pulling her family out of poverty by the bootstraps so to speak. Quite a plucky lady, she was...</p>
<p>We feel we owe him a good life and education is part of it. I do think my son should look after me when I'm unable to take care of myself; or at least not throw we out on the streets if I have alzheimer's or something..</p>
<p>Rather than "owing" our kids a college graduation, I would prefer to say that we are committed to providing them with the best possible education. As others have said, giving one's child a sound education is probably the best investment one can make for the future--of the child, of the community/world, and of the parent--all for different reasons. Our kids know that we'll take care of tuition, room/board, and fees/books plus transportation, but the responsibility for any "frills" and graduate studies will fall more on them than on us (as it was for my H and me). S has been working 10-15+ hours/week throughout college (F/T during breaks) to pay for his personal expenses and, when he moved out of the residence hall, his room and board. D plans to do the same next year.</p>
<p>As I mentioned in my earlier post, I am not sure "owe" is the right word, or should I say, the right word for me. It is more about being a priority and a value. I know my parents had education as a priority for us and we feel the same for our kids, whether we can afford it or not. It was never anything we questioned, it is a given. In fact, both sets of grandparents have it as a priority to help the grandkids get a college education. This is simply a value but I have never thought it was something "owed". It is clearly a choice and it is one to be appreciated and not taken for granted, in my opinion.</p>
<p>Yes we 'owe' them. As some one said, they didn't ask us to be their parents. We brought them to world and it is our responsibility to help them become self sufficient, independent and productive member of society. In our family, education is considered as a basic necessity - like food, shelter and clothes. Untill the child is independent is is parents reponsisbility to privide for them.</p>
<p>Why are parents complaining? For 13 years their kids got education on other people's money (yes we did pay small amounts in school taxes). Now it is time to cough up some of your own.</p>
<p>Time to think about paying or not was 18 years and 9 months ago.</p>
<p>We have had a harder time.
Our extended family doesn't value education to the extent we do.Neither my husband or I were encouraged to attend college, in fact I didn't even graduate high school and possibly I would have been more interested in that if any adults had shown that as a priority.
My husbands parents were appalled when we suggested savings bonds for the girls gifts instead of expensive presents that they didn't need. They didn't see the need for college at all. My mother wasn't that bad, in fact she attended the UW for a year or two, but she is much closer to my sister and brothers kids, as she was to them when we were growing up. I was the "bad" one of the family and was basically written off. :(
So needless to say, it has been very difficult raising the kids without a lot of family support. We have placed education as a priority as much as we can, but it includes vocational training as well as college depending on interest and ability.</p>
<p>Like other parents, I do not like the term owe because it seems that there is a sense of debt or entitlement attached. I feel that as her parent one of the few things that I could give her is education and opportunity in the hopes of helping her to chart her own path through this life. </p>
<p>I value education both formal and informal, and believe in its power to transform lives. My daughter knows my story, that both of my parents were deceased by my sophomore year of college and I did not want to be a burden to my older siblings who offered to pay for my education, so I worked full time and paid my own way to finish school. I tell her all of the time that I had a wonderful time as a day student but learned the value of an education at night. My daughter has also gone to school with me through two graduate programs and understands the sacrifices that we have both made for her to have the life style that she has, we are by no stretch of the imagination, wealthy, but she knows that she has always gotten everything that she needed and even a few things that she wanted.</p>
<p>I believe in the saying that your life is a gift from God and what you do with it is your gift to God. I have been given an amazing gift I that I have for a short time to help shape, influence, and return to the world a person who will hopefully be an agent for positive change in the lives of others. My daughter knows that because I love her I want her to be the best possible person that she can be and to live her best life. Because I love her, I dont owe her anything. I make the choice of giving to her opportunities that will hopefully enrich her life; whether it was through 13 years of comminuting into Manhattan when we have always lived walking distance from schools, to attending an Ivy League institution. Does she need that? Absolutely not! Does she appreciate all that has been given to her- definitely! I dont count it robbery or consider it making a sacrifice paying and/or borrowing for her education. </p>
<p>Above all my daughter also knows that she is not owed anything that what she has been given is a GIFT. She knows that she is also a partner and an active participant in her education. She does work at college, will have to work over the summer and even take out loans before it is over. However it is an investment in her, because when you think about it we have certainly spent more money for less.</p>
<p>I raised my daughter to also know that to whom much has been given, much is required, and your will never be blessed until you are a blessing to others. So she values the gift of the education that she has been given by doing her best work, and by paying to forward to give of her time and talents. In the end, maybe she will make sure I have a really nice room at the home</p>
<p>Thank you, Sybbie, as you put my thoughts into words better than I did for myself. The word, "gift" is how I see it too. It is not owed but it is a gift we never thought twice about giving. But it is also meant to be appreciated. It is a choice to give that gift and hopefully they will pass it on to the next in line.</p>
<p>The interesting thing is that while few here feel they "owe" an education (and owe really is an ugly way to look at it) the Government assumes that we do owe our kids. Is it wrong that a parent contribution is a key element of financial aid?</p>
<p>I don't like the way the system works with the parents being the determining factor of whether a kid goes to college or not. I have raved and ranted about it on these boards many times. </p>
<p>Owe, is a strong word. When you raise your child with strong expectations that they are to go to college with implied and explicit promises that you are going to "send them to college", I do see an "owe" element. In homes where this is not the case, it is not that clear. In homes where there are other pressing needs, clearly not. It is a question that comes up often in split familes where state laws are not clear or do not specify that the noncustodial parent has to pay for college. I think this is a major gaffe in the law as kids are not considered independent until age 24 for undergraduate aid purposes. Insurance provides coverage usually to age 23 for full time college kids on your policy. There should be some consistancy on how the law views this. They are not clear on this "owe" business themselves.</p>
<p>You reap what you sow.</p>
<p>Kirmum:
The alternative to parents taking financial responsibility for their children's education is 1. the children not getting an education or 2. everybody paying higher taxes to get the kids educated in state universities with an expansion of both the state universities system and the government's role. This country (and the world) needs a more, not less, educated workforce. So throwing up our collective hands after high school is not really an option.</p>
<p>Not everyone can contribute fully to their children's education; that's why we have scholarships. But I also think many parents could do more. I remember the post from last year from a student whose parents bought a Porsche for her younger brother and a Hummer for themselves but insisted she go to the state university. I am not too eager to subsidize the education of kids whose parents think they do not owe them an education, although they could afford to underwrite it. Clearly these parents expect their kids to go to college, but at someone else's expense. </p>
<p>When I write that I expect my kids to support me in my old age, it is, of course, jokingly. But in truth, one generation depends on the next. Even if we privatize social security, the personal retirement accounts will be profitable and enable us old geezers to live comfortably in retirement only if the workers of the future are productive.</p>