<p>Elite means image. Sometimes warranted. Everyone knows Harvard is elite. People that never went to college or don't have kids know Harvard is an elite place.<br>
A good friend of mine has a kid at Stanford. She has no problem admitting it is an elite place. She's proud her kid goes to an elite place. It's a validation that her daughter is elite. She's honest.</p>
<p>Some people make choices that aren't elitist. Maybe they buy a Toyota instead of a BMW. They don't stay at 5 star-hotels. That doesn't mean when they send their kid to an IVY that they are not elitist. It means sometimes they want to be part of the elite, sometimes they don't. For college education, these people want elite.</p>
<p>Dstark, but you are still saying that people want to send their kids to "elite" schools because they are elitist rather than because they have other considerations. My S has a friend who is attending the Savannah College of Arts. I had not known of it before, but since she was admitted, I learned it had an excellent reputation. For her, attending HYP would not have been as good an academic fit. So is my S's friend less elitist just because she is attending a school that fewer people have heard of? What's the difference?</p>
<p>Somehow I get the feeling that marite's boy is the type for whom the saying of where he went to college matters not one whit. I however, before joining cc, did look forward to having my D tell people she went to Princeton. But I am not a pure person. </p>
<p>I don't think this "elitist" concept is making much sense. Perhaps we could disaggregate - i.e. highly selective, prestigious, academically demanding, home to the wealthy, etc. These are all very different parameters that can be munged into the concept of "elitist".</p>
<p>There aren't too many mothers I know that don't get a certain glow when you ask them where their kid goes to school and they get to answer Harvard, Yale, MIT, Stanford, Princeton, etc.</p>
<p>I'm not too pure when it comes to my kids; although, I am definitely better than some. If my kid went to harvard and I got asked the question, "Where does your kid go to school?", I think I would start smiling.</p>
<p>Dstark: No. I recommend to you Conan O'Brien's Class Day Speech. My S laughed and said he wasn't sure he wanted to apply to Harvard after that. He had Harvey Mudd on his list. How many people outside math circles have heard of Harvey Mudd?
I also suggest that you read the Phantomprof's blog; it's about her experience at Texas A&M. Or about kids who go to 'Bama.</p>
<p>There aren't too many mothers I know that don't get a certain glow when you ask them where their kid goes to school and they get to answer Harvard, Yale, MIT, Stanford, Princeton, etc.</p>
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<p>My mom won't ever volunteer our ama maters, but if you ask her directly, you'll see this phenomenon -- there's no word for it in English, but it's "naches fun kinder" shining through from behind the politeness.</p>
<p>Remember that although most colleges teach business/financial and or economics they themselves are "non profit entities". Therefore they do not understand the importance of budgeting. It is one of the ironies of the Ivory
Tower. Bates, for instance, says that in order to keep qualified faculty they
need to raise tuition. Balderdash! Put the faculty to work and give them the task of identifying the incredible mindless spending in every department. One place to save money would be to not rely so much on government funding. That would cut the costly administrative expense when complying with nonsensical rules and regulations. i.e. Grove City is a great example of a college that offers a great education in a number of areas while still compensating the professors with a livable wage. </p>
<p>I could go on and on, but I see already that the overpriced elite's are going to run out of interested middle and upper middle class buyers (parents) who no longer see the return on investment for their hard earned dollars and will be sending their bright offspring to colleges that will reward the students' accomplishments with merit aid. Of course, many parents who do not have "brand name paralysis" have been doing just that for years.</p>
<p>No, he didn't but that's because it is too limited to math and science. Same reason MIT dropped down his list. Although HM is part of the Claremont consortium, we'd read about some difficulties accessing Pomona classes.
I won't pretend that I don't get a glow talking about my S. But enabling his mom to get a glow was not the reason my S applied to Harvard.</p>
<p>Marite, I know from reading your posts that you are a very good person, and I really like your last couple of posts on the other elite thread (John Nash). </p>
<p>Conan O'Brien is a lot more talented than I am and wrote a great speech. That speech doesn't really fly if he graduated from SJSU, does it?</p>
<p>If I ran into you in the street and asked where your son went to college, a "Naches fun kinder" (Thanks Hanna) would occur? Right?</p>
<p>I bought a BMW and when people ask me why, I tell them it was because I knew my kids would be driving it and I wanted a heavy car. :)</p>
<p>If I am wrong about you, you are the exception, not the rule.</p>
<p>I'm not either. I don't know what I was thinking. My next car is going to be a used Honda Civic. I would get a hybrid, but all the elites drive those around here. :)</p>
<p>dstark, I also drive a BMW. However, I know exactly what I was thinking: "this is an amazing car, I'll never get tired of it, I love driving it, and if I have to spend my days ferrying the kids around, I'm going to enjoy it." Five years later, I still haven't found another car I'd prefer.</p>
<p>Yeah, I'll wait until the Hybrids have dropped down in price a bit, and the Accord is no longer road worthy. That should be around the same time.</p>
<p>dstark (& others),
I don't think anyone here is denying that upper-tier U's have elite REPUTATIONS. But there's a big jump from categories to motivations -- separately from whether any particular motivation is up for judgment by others, or disapproval. (Which it isn't.) Or whether an applicant or parent should be browbeat into apologizing for such a choice. (Which they shouldn't.) And if you don't think "elite" is a politically laden word, check out the # of guilty apologies that followed the introduction of that word on the thread.</p>
<p>My D wanted the most challenging academic environment for which she qualified AND which had the kind of atmosphere & opportunities she wanted AND which was located in the East Coast reasonably convenient to NYC. Hence, her list and her choice. I'm sure she's also pleased that it's "elite," but it wasn't her motivation. On the other hand, PART of the elite aspect is the "highly selective" part; she chose that not so that she could brag, as she hates braggers, but because she needed peers of her intellectual ability. So is Reed highly selective, but she didn't want West Coast or that campus culture.</p>
<p>Student pride and maternal "glow" are the effect, not the cause.</p>
<p>As to the car tributary in this thread, I know men who are quite anti-prestige in lifestyle & income, but who love a beautiful machine, & therefore prefer the Mercedes brand of any particular make, model, year, appearance because of the way those cars run & are made.</p>
<p>Be very careful of thinking you know why people choose items which have "elite" attributes to them.</p>
<p>Marite, tks for your list. We looked closely at Tufts for my son, and I think I'd like for my daughter to take a good look at it as well.</p>
<p>I saw "the glow" a couple of weeks ago when I asked a man where his oldest daughter went to college. Unabashed child like pride that she goes to MIT. Absolutely charming. This man did not come across the least bit as elitist.</p>
<p>Epiphany, I agree with you. People end up in elite places for a variety of reasons. </p>
<p>I think trying to find a college that "fits" is definitely a good thing. I never thought about it for myself way back when, and wish I had!</p>
<p>The reason why this thread won't die is not because anyone denies that--- 1.elite colleges exist 2.not everyone can access them 3. one can feel pride in attending one.---but because of the communicated dissaproval by one poster of those that can/do. That, as another previous poster stated, simply smacks of sour grapes. And Curmudgeon, you're very right to empathize with the frustration of those who for one reason or another cannot access such schools. But I think that the communal empathy in this case was pretty much extinguished by the original judgemental, disparaging attitude.</p>