S19 has been accepted to the Faculty of Science and wants to do Honours in CS. Right now he has AP scores which would give him 12 credits at McGill. I assume with those, he’d enter as a U0.5. He’s currently taking enough AP classes that 4’s or 5’s would have him enter as a U1. If he does that, he’ll have a 4 or 5 on the BC Calc. This would count as 2 math classes for the Freshman Program and exempt him from Math 140 and 141. He’ll also have a 4 or 5 on the chemistry AP, counting as 2 science classes for the Freshman Program and exempting him from Chem 110 and 120.
I have 2 distinct questions.
1. I know what McGill's official position is. In your experience or your kid's, are the BC Calc and AP Chem classes genuinely equivalent to Math 140 and 141 and Chem 110 and 120 or would S19 be better off doing poorly on the AP exams and being able to take the McGill classes before jumping into Calc 3 or Linear Algebra and whatever the next Chem class is? I’ve been hearing generally that AP classes aren’t truly equivalent to college level courses and that students are often better off taking the class, regardless of AP score.
2. Do you have any thoughts pro or con on the general experience of coming in as a U0.5 vs a U1, both academically and socially?
Good questions. In our case, my daughter would not report her AP Calc score for AB because she has such a lack of confidence in her teaching in high school. She’s afraid of starting McGill at the Calc II level, would rather retake Calc I, essentially.
Umm, McGill says you’re required to report all AP scores. Is she a senior and taking Calc this year?
My son’s school requires kids who take AP classes to take the exam, but the score doesn’t effect anything high school related, so if he decides he wants to take Calc I and II at McGill rather than place out, the plan is to tank the AP exam.
Same question I have for my daughter. But she is A Level student, not AP. We don’t know U0.5 or U1 at all.
I agree U0.5 will be better for the first year student.
Reporting scores and/or using them for credit are different. Don’t let him tank the tests! He can opt to not use the credits, but he can also “bank them” and decide later (unless he takes the class that negates the test). Entering as a U1 gives a nice boost for class registration and also allows students to either take a lighter load if you have a couple of brutal courses to take (many students take 4 courses instead of 5), or expand your studies to take a minor, second major beyond primary focus. Of course, completing your degree in 3 or 3.5 years is also compelling for many.
A general rule of thumb is if the student intends to or is required to take advanced courses in that subject at university the AP credit should not be used. University intro courses often cover more material than the typical high school AP course. If the student does not intend to take advanced courses in that subject then the AP credit should be claimed.
@TomSrOfBoston But McGill requires you to report all AP scores. They say it gives students an unfair advantage if they’ve already taken and done well in the AP course. I don’t know what the disciplinary action is if caught.
Calc 1 (Math 140) and 2 (Math 141) are brutal at McGill. D was not allowed to use a calculator for midterm or final for 141. And partial credit was rarely given; one little mistake could be very costly. D reported her AP score for Calc AB so she started at McGill with 141. I don’t think she regrets not taking 140. She will take Calc 3 this summer. That class does not seem to have the brutal reputation that the first two have.
She is taking Linear Algebra now (Math 133) and doing fine. She says it’s more a progression of Algebra 2 than Calc. I don’t think I’m allowed to link here, but she has paid for private tutoring sessions, for both 141 and 133. It really, really helps a lot. If anyone wants the link to this tutor’s website, PM me.
@millie210 To answer your second question, D entered as U1 and is very glad she did. She still has to take 27 credit hours a year (not counting summer) to keep her scholarship, but the option to take just 12 credits one semester a year gives her a bit more breathing space. Those math and CS classes are intense.
@ShrimpBurrito I didn’t know that. Some colleges do not mandate that AP credits be used.
Here is their official policy:
“AP exams already written, as well as AP exams you intend to write, must be declared on the McGill application.
Admitted students must make arrangements to have all AP results sent to Enrolment Services directly from the College Board…If you receive an exemption for a course but take it anyway, you will not receive McGill credit for it.”
https://www.mcgill.ca/transfercredit/prospective/ap
@ShrimpBurrito is correct. My son really appreciates the 4 class semesters. He is in a five class semester right now and it is brutal. He is has been home for break for five days and has worked non-stop. Wednesday he is a big marketing presentation followed by an Econ Stats quiz/exam plus a Computer Science Project that is due at midnight Wednesday night. Definitely “Reading Week” and no “Spring Break”!
Anyone else notice the frequent use of the word “brutal” when discussing McGill academics? D is realizing that even the classes purported to be “easier” are anything but easy. It’s all relative.
@ShrimpBurrito I said to my son yesterday that next year his fifth class needs to be a bird - McGill terminology for easy. His response was “trying to find one that is interesting AND not a lot of work AND easy to get an A or A- is a lot harder than you would think.” That said, my son adores McGill and couldn’t imagine himself at any other school. 
@ShrimpBurrito My son told me that they just announced a new Math Class for Econ majors (not sure if just for econ or all Faculty of Arts). Seems they are giving them their own Math 141 (maybe Math 140 and 141). My son texted “My GPA would be so much higher if those classes existed last year!!!” followed by lots of angry, swearing emojis.
We attended the McGill webinar for admitted students. The question came up about AP credits because if you are applying to medical schools after McGill in the US, many medical schools do not accept AP credit for biology or general chemistry - seems like most accept calculus AP credits. The admissions officers on the call told everyone that you MUST report the AP scores for your exams but you are allowed to retake the course at McGill. The course and grade will be on your transcript but the grade will not be included in the calculation of your overall McGill GPA. Obviously, you only get credit once (either for AP or for taking the course), not both. That was the first time we had heard/read anything about being able to take courses that you have AP credit for.
ALSO on the topic of AP exams - registration will happen for incoming students before they know the scores of their AP tests. If you intend to use your AP credits of a course for which you have just taken the exam for, they recommend registering as if you have a 4 or a 5 and to adjust later if that is not the case.
@CollegeHopes19 That was my understanding. You must report all AP results but that does not preclude a student from taking the course. You only get credit once though.
My son scored a 5 on AP calc BC pretty easily and absolutely had to report the score. Upon reporting the score they gave him 140/141. They do NOT take kindly to students who don’t report their AP scores. I haven’t heard of any disciplinary action but I have heard the term “academic dishonesty” thrown around. As a U0 currently he’s in calc 3.
Last semester he took linear algebra, 133. It is savage. I could go check his final mark but it was a low B, high C at best. He’s a good math student - certainly not a Putnam Fellow kind of kid, but somewhat talented nonetheless. The final, on which he scored a sweet 56, sunk him pretty badly. But hey, he got the credit. Some of his friends have to repeat it.
You’d think calc would be the weeder subject but it’s actually 133. Sure, kids can do well in it, and many do, but it seems to be wicked.
I don’t think McGill is unique in this respect. I know Waterloo is very difficult, as is UofT. You have to be really really talented to get an A in McGill math. It’s not plug-and-chug like high school. I shudder to think what honors analysis, or honors abstract algebra are like.
Having gone to grad school in the math faculty at Waterloo, and having helped my son with some of his problem sets, I can say that they aren’t messing around. Soon I’ll run out of usefulness. I graduated way too long ago to remember every little thing.
I’m the OP. I can’t tell if the couple of references to not reporting scores are aimed at me, particularly, but just to be clear, my son will absolutely follow the rules.
It seems to me that the problem with repeating a class for no credit is that you have to take that class in addition to a full time class load. In any case, my son has made his decision; he will try for a 5 on BC Calc and hope to go straight to Linear Algebra or Calc 3, whichever makes the most sense.
I appreciate all the advice.
@SwimmingDad If you don’t mind me asking is your son majoring in both Econ and CS?