<p>Wish I had an easy answer for Op but I don’t. My answer, and that of many others here, are what to do after-the-fact of S3 performing at much lower degree than 1 and 2, but now approaching the deadline for a decision. It is easy to see now, that S3 should have been advised some time before that a higher performance opens more opportunities and at lower costs and lower performance doesn’t. Then, this decision would be much more like the Junior Olympics cut example given some time ago.
I do not envy the position of op having to explain why s3 is not worth the cost(guessing the perspective of s3) but S1 and 2 were worth it.</p>
<p>Sheesh! People are talking about this kid’s efforts as if he didn’t have an adequate HS performance; you’d think he’d barely graduated.</p>
<p>He had a 3.3 GPA and an average SAT. This is at the high end of average. It probably describes most students at 4 year schools.</p>
<p>Look, if they can’t pay, or don’t want to, fine, but it’s puzzling to read the justifications in many posts which are judgments on the kid, who sounds like a totally normal 17 year old to me, who is a disappointment to his family. The situation as described here sounds very sad to me.</p>
<p>Where are his stats? Musta missed that post…</p>
<p>In the first post.</p>
<p>YH, S2 worked his opps. OP can explain to S3 that he, too, can work his opps. Obviously, he’s not in the same position- neither with the identical academic base, nor, apparently, with the drive (yet) to manage it in the same way. </p>
<p>If it were me (and no two sets of family dynamics are the same,) I’d consider: we want a place where you can shine. Where you can pursue your interest in x (extras,) take advantage of y (some bennies- academic or other,) make friendships and use this time to grow and hone your strengths. That may be OOS, may be IS, could be cc. But we want this to be about YOU. And, that includes taking a solid look at various options, not assuming right now that it’s got to be this or that. And, it has to be affordable.</p>
<p>I told D1, btw, that “dream college” very much included how they came through with aid. It’s not a dream school if the aid isn’t there. Said nicely.</p>
<p>Garland, I can now see some of what you point out. But having dealt with a kid who set higher expectations for herself than she was truly ready for (ED to a top 20,) I am aware that where kids stand in maturity and drive (and other things) can complicate things. Whether or not OP has a slant some think is biased, she may very well be dealing with a less academically aggressive kid or one who needs a few years to find his stride.</p>
<p>Truth is, when D2 wanted to drop out of college, we realized her issues would not have made cc any better choice. Less $ invested, yes. But no difference in growth or achievement. Or readiness to face the real world. None of this is easy.</p>
<p>What are considered “average” SAT scores?</p>
<p>Attitude, drive and direction were our issues with our daughter. Getting good grades and the ability were there but would she put the effort and drive in at a four-year institution? Actual performance in CC indicated that we were correct - she did not initially put in the effort but she did later on and she grew a lot in the process. Our son saw lots of students at his university flunk out their first year - bad time management, bad study skills, too much partying, not using university academic resources: the usual reasons. We have parents with bright kids that did well in high-school come here in January or May with this problem - and the remediation plan is usually to figure out what went wrong and then decide whether it can be corrected at the current institution or take a step down to a local institution. Either way, it can be a big waste of resources if the student isn’t truly ready.</p>
<p>Thank you for confirming my point, lookingforward.
Because s3 had lower performance, due to academic base and drive, as you put it, than s1 and 2, he is not in the same position as S1 or s2. S3’s opportunities are likely to be less than s2’s.
And I agree with garland, too, in post 83. It’s not that s3 did poorly, it’s just that his performance(so far) is less than s1 and 2, so his opportunities are fewer at a time when op’s finances are smaller.</p>
<p>according to collegeboard,
For the class of 2012, average scores are:
Critical reading:496
Mathematics: 514
Writing: 488</p>
<p>I realize what I would say is just a starter. What comes next? As some have said, finding what he can get excited about, at various affordable options. Not settle. But feel some excitement about. Some pride. something to hang his hat on, so to speak. Parents may have to help with that.</p>
<p>^ he does have a passion…and it is nothing like his sibs. We support his pursuits ( as do S1 and S2) and pay for various “lessons.” I hesitate to outright discuss, as I don’t want to completely expose his identity. A college degree is not necessary to support his passion, but we believe a college education is necessary for him.</p>
<p>And yes, those ( earlier post) are average SAT scores. I think people on CC don’t really consider what average kids really look like ( I’m guessing most people thought when I said “average” it meant 1700-1800).</p>
<p>So are you saying your s’s SATs are in the 1500ish range? Is he competitive for the schools he is targeting?</p>
<p>I am late to this thread, but as a parent I have seen friends of my DD that started out going away from home, struggled through 2 years, and now have no money left to finish. The more mature one is so sad that she didnt stay at home for CC, and then have money for 2 years elsewhere. Where you finish your bachelors is a lot more important than where you start.</p>
<p>^ yes. He is competitive ( or close to it) for the college he wants to go to ( there are a ton of colleges out there… Something for everyone!). No hope for any merit money. His saving grace is that he has taken a full college prep curriculum in HS. Although no honors or AP( actually took 1), he will have 3 lab sciences and a post Alg II math class. He will retake SAT in Oct. He knows he has to raise that score to avoid being on shaky ground. He wants to do better…he doesn’t necessarily want to do what it takes. Many colleges for average students do not require SAT scores or only use them for math and English placement.</p>
<p>As mentioned earlier, ADD and a learning disability have made school hard for him. He has actually improved in HS. We have consistently reinforced effort over grades. He is well aware that he has to work twice as hard as everyone else in certain subjects and that it is what it is. I think it’s a burnout for him…lots of work, not a lot of results. We, however, can see progress…slowly but surely.</p>
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<p>Considering all of that, there may be something to a commenter who mentioned how his having to work harder for his grades due to all of that is likely to propel him far beyond those who received straight-As with minimal or no effort throughout K-12 only to be surprised upon hitting the college campuses.</p>
<p>Well now that everyone realizes that " average " SAT scores means " in the 1500s" has anyone’s opinion changed? I have read all the great advise and have seriously considered ( am considering) what was offered. I want to do what is best for S3 above all…I also want to make sure we aren’t frivolously spending money we really can’t afford to spend if other options make more sense.</p>
<p>Take a look at this thread (well, don’t read the whole thing- it will give you a headache). <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1085497-did-atrocious-sat-sat-optional-suggestions.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1085497-did-atrocious-sat-sat-optional-suggestions.html</a> There are a lot of options, even with some scholarships $, for kids with non-competitive SATs.</p>
<p>One further dataset that I would take into consideration is the quality of your local community college. We can afford full-pay but we still went the community college route but we used an OOS Community College because I didn’t like the quality of the CC that was 15 minutes away. There are some community colleges that are mostly vocational that may not work well for a student that wants academic courses for transfer to a four-year university. If the quality of the CC is good and it has academic majors that will transfer to four-year universities, then that is one mark against that you can remove from the CC option.</p>
<p>No, average does not change my thinking–I assumed from the start that by average you meant average, which is what it is. The average score at one of the four year college I work at is below that. and many of the students do not have 3.3 GPAs. As you paint the picture, this is a kid who works extremely hard to get good grades despite learning difficulties. An SAT is not going to showcase his strengths or probability of doing well in college–the grades would much more so. If the SAT doesn’t keep him out of the college he’d like to go to, then it becomes immaterial. If it does, your dilemma is solved.</p>
<p>But we do know different kids, despite their productivity, may be more or less ready for certain sorts of college experiences and different environments. I don’t have a clear picture of how OP is trying to describe S3. From the cautious initial working to the attempt to describe without revealing to much, I can’t tell. he has a certain gpa, college prep courses, but one or no AP/rigor. And the frame is that, right or wrong, selfish or absolute, it’s presented that the finances are wobbly. Maybe this isn’t a usual thread where we sent a parent off to look for the range of schools where S3 might fit.</p>
<p>If OP had said, look, we can’t afford it but he wants X, don’t we often tout cc? When the finances simply aren’t there and the kid isn’t a likely for substantial merit? Or the particular sub-tier doesn’t offer much aid?</p>